Non boat question Electric cars

[sutton sailor]

I would like to buy a Nissan Leaf. The limited range of the 24Kwh version would suit us fine. The range when new is 106 miles max, with a real world range of 80 miles. As the most we usually do in any one day is about 20 miles, the range could drop dramatically and still be usable. The 24Kwh version have a garantee of 6 years. So the vehicles I am looking at will soon be out of garantee, so if the battery fails compleatly I will have to pay out £5000 for a new battery. What I want to know is what is the possibility of the battery failing completely/ Or do the batteries gradually reduce range over a long period. Also if the range reduces do you have the cost of fully recharging the 24 Kwh to give the much reduced range?

 

[dunedin]

Apologies, I have no experience of the Nissan Leaf, but I would ask Nissan if they offer an extended warranty on the battery, for a fee of course.
If they do, and the price is reasonable, I would go for that. If they don’t, or the price is too steep, then that tells you to walk - as they will know the failure rates and costs to fix.
(I have always bought extended manufacturers warranties on complex ICE cars, as much cheaper and less stress to extend the warranty than worry after the end of the free period, or worse buy a new car at 3 years old)

 

[shaunksb]

You're best starting with one that is still showing the full 12 bars on the dash display.

The majority at 6 years old do that.

They degrade a bit each year with use but you should still expect around 70% at 8 years. You need to google leaf spy and you can get an app that connects to the OBD plug in the car and it will tell you exactly the battery condition.

The push to get new cars now to do 200 miles isn't because we all do 200 miles every day it's so that it will still do 100 miles when it's old and bangernomics start to apply.

If you really need to fix the battery this can usually be done by just replacing the worst cells as they don't all go at once.

However the simplist route is to just upgrade the battery from a newer right off.

A hours work and you could get the 30kwh and make it even better.

_____________________________________________________

 

[sutton sailor]

Hi shaunksb, thanks for that info. I wonder do you know of any garages in the UK that do this battery replacement work.
Regards Kyn

 

[lw395]

Hi shaunksb, thanks for that info. I wonder do you know of any garages in the UK that do this battery replacement work.
Regards Kyn

Not many people doing that work, because as yet, very few people need it done.
A contact in the USA was talking about getting a 'refurbed' battery pack from Nissan at a good price.. It might be worth contacting Nissan to see what their policy is these days.
Mate of mine has a Leaf, well pleased with it, he takes the view you have to allow x-amount a year for writing off the battery. Maybe if you accept you might have to get a battery once in the e.g. 5 years you keep the car, you can budget on that basis and anything else is a bonus?

 

[Elessar]

I would like to buy a Nissan Leaf. The limited range of the 24Kwh version would suit us fine. The range when new is 106 miles max, with a real world range of 80 miles. As the most we usually do in any one day is about 20 miles, the range could drop dramatically and still be usable. The 24Kwh version have a garantee of 6 years. So the vehicles I am looking at will soon be out of garantee, so if the battery fails compleatly I will have to pay out £5000 for a new battery. What I want to know is what is the possibility of the battery failing completely/ Or do the batteries gradually reduce range over a long period. Also if the range reduces do you have the cost of fully recharging the 24 Kwh to give the much reduced range?

I sold mine at 97000 miles. Battery state of health 88% Not a thing had gone wrong. No creaks, no rattles. Drove like new.

I bought another.

 

[Elessar]

I would like to buy a Nissan Leaf. The limited range of the 24Kwh version would suit us fine. The range when new is 106 miles max, with a real world range of 80 miles. As the most we usually do in any one day is about 20 miles, the range could drop dramatically and still be usable. The 24Kwh version have a garantee of 6 years. So the vehicles I am looking at will soon be out of garantee, so if the battery fails compleatly I will have to pay out £5000 for a new battery. What I want to know is what is the possibility of the battery failing completely/ Or do the batteries gradually reduce range over a long period. Also if the range reduces do you have the cost of fully recharging the 24 Kwh to give the much reduced range?

also-buy an app called LeafSpy.
Let’s you check the battery in detail before you buy. Need a £30 dongle to plug into the diagnostic socket.

 

[Sticky Fingers]

I'm also an EV convert. Had a PHEV for 2 years, bought a BEV last year (iPace). Second one incoming in the next few weeks that's us out of diesels. Only one petrol sports car left in the fleet, will probably go mental with that and swap 2.5 litre 6 to 5 litre V8 but it only does 500 - 1000 miles a year...

 

[MAURICE]

Ive had my kia e niro for a year now and done 10000 miles . Still very pleased i was getting about 280 miles in winter now its warming up am getting over 300. Its all down to cost of course but i would get the longest range you can ive never charged yet on a public charger and have driven on a couple of long journeys. One to Deven which was 218 miles with still 49 miles left. and the other to welsh Wales and back. My batteries are never charged to over 90% except if im going on a long journey. My other car is an Audi A5 soft top had that 2 years and ony done 2600 miles as i prefer the Kia

 

[Joker]

I have an MG EV. My minor regret is that it was built in China [and they bought the name].

Range 140 miles. It's a small SUV - I wanted a small runaround, but the price of the MG was the winner. Great to drive around locally, and the most responsive car I've driven.

I still have my Skoda Karoq for longer journeys.

 

[AntarcticPilot]

Don't most vendors offer the opportunity to lease the battery rather than buying it? For a cost lower than the cost of fuel, you get the battery replaced as an when necessary rather than hitting a largish lump sum. Upside is that your battery will always be maintained at a high performance level; downside is regular outgoings. But when looking at the economics of EVs (I haven't got one but our next car will probably be one) the cost of replacing the battery needs to be factored in; it WILL need replacing sooner or later, and the mileage we anticipate will mean that we can't tolerate a substantial decrease in mileage.

 

[JumbleDuck]

I would like to buy a Nissan Leaf. The limited range of the 24Kwh version would suit us fine. The range when new is 106 miles max, with a real world range of 80 miles. As the most we usually do in any one day is about 20 miles, the range could drop dramatically and still be usable.

There is a community Leaf based at Sound of Ulva. I booked it to take me and my crew to Tobermory Highland Games last summer, but they used a minibus instead because, apparently, the range of the Leaf had plumetted from 80-ish miles to around 20, and it could no longer get to Tobermory and back on a charge. Nissan had been unable to find a fault and it was bought second hand and out of warranty.

The Nissan Leaf is often quoted as the fastest depreciating vehicle on the market though when I was idly looking at the (before the Ulva experience) they all seemed to be £17k+. That seems like an awful lot of money which could be spent on petrol, and of course the structure and suspension rot and fail just as fast as any other car.

 

[Elessar]

Don't most vendors offer the opportunity to lease the battery rather than buying it? For a cost lower than the cost of fuel, you get the battery replaced as an when necessary rather than hitting a largish lump sum. Upside is that your battery will always be maintained at a high performance level; downside is regular outgoings. But when looking at the economics of EVs (I haven't got one but our next car will probably be one) the cost of replacing the battery needs to be factored in; it WILL need replacing sooner or later, and the mileage we anticipate will mean that we can't tolerate a substantial decrease in mileage.

No they don’t any more. Renault still might. The car will be knackered long before the battery - you don’t lease the engine in a car after all.

 

[Elessar]

There is a community Leaf based at Sound of Ulva. I booked it to take me and my crew to Tobermory Highland Games last summer, but they used a minibus instead because, apparently, the range of the Leaf had plumetted from 80-ish miles to around 20, and it could no longer get to Tobermory and back on a charge. Nissan had been unable to find a fault and it was bought second hand and out of warranty.

The Nissan Leaf is often quoted as the fastest depreciating vehicle on the market though when I was idly looking at the (before the Ulva experience) they all seemed to be £17k+. That seems like an awful lot of money which could be spent on petrol, and of course the structure and suspension rot and fail just as fast as any other car.

97k miles. No faults no creaks no rattles. Drove like new. God knows what they did to that one (if the anecdote is true)
And so nice to drive. Can’t ever imagine going back to petrol.

 

[JumbleDuck]

97k miles. No faults no creaks no rattles. Drove like new. God knows what they did to that one (if the anecdote is true)
And so nice to drive. Can’t ever imagine going back to petrol.

The accusation of lying is regrettable. Otherwise, yes, I had been in the previous Leaf there before and I was very impressed. The only other electric car I have travelled in was a Tesla Roadster, and that was awful - stunningly fast but mind bogglingly uncomfortable, flimsy and rattly. I'd certainly consider electric, but I'd need one which could do 250 miles on a charge and nothing affordable comes close yet.

 

[Elessar]

The accusation of lying is regrettable. Otherwise, yes, I had been in the previous Leaf there before and I was very impressed. The only other electric car I have travelled in was a Tesla Roadster, and that was awful - stunningly fast but mind bogglingly uncomfortable, flimsy and rattly. I'd certainly consider electric, but I'd need one which could do 250 miles on a charge and nothing affordable comes close yet.

wasnt accusing you of lying JD just having been misled about the leaf.
20 miles only is broken, not a normal situation. If a piston had broken on a petrol car, you wouldn't say its noisy, thirsty and slow, you'd say its broken.

 

[Hermit]

I would like to buy a Nissan Leaf. The limited range of the 24Kwh version would suit us fine. The range when new is 106 miles max, with a real world range of 80 miles. As the most we usually do in any one day is about 20 miles, the range could drop dramatically and still be usable. The 24Kwh version have a garantee of 6 years. So the vehicles I am looking at will soon be out of garantee, so if the battery fails compleatly I will have to pay out £5000 for a new battery. What I want to know is what is the possibility of the battery failing completely/ Or do the batteries gradually reduce range over a long period. Also if the range reduces do you have the cost of fully recharging the 24 Kwh to give the much reduced range?

Appallingly cheeky but I am just about to sell mine (67 plate 30KwH) following an upgrade to a bigger battery car - PM me if interested in something with a bit more range than a 24, based near Bath

 

[Richard at Bottom Boat]

Yes, the traction battery degrades, but only gradually, my 30kWh Leaf is 4yrs old, done 53,000miles, is at about 87%. Plenty info on "speak ev" forum, the 30s have a longer warranty, (of both years and mileage), than equivalent 24s. Post-2013 have less wasteful heat-pump heating.
A year in, I'm very pleased to be out of ICE, yes the insurance is a bit higher, but zero road tax, minimal maintenance required, and amazingly cheap to run.
Yes, pay for Leafspy Pro and a compatible Dongle, so you can get true car stats before you buy. Gather that Indra at Malvern can replace faulty cells, to restore the battery pack to its age-appropriate state of health. Usable, new on 24kWh is 22kWh, and 27kWh for the 30kWh, so mine now c25kWh, and I get between 4miles/kWh (winter) and 5 summer, best achieved 5.2.
For main battery longevity, not too many rapid charges, and operate within 20-80% state of charge unless heading straight out onto a long journey.
Plenty of choices, 3x trims, multiple colours, 2x battery capacity. Nissan's omission of any active battery temp management the only weakness, seems the 30's cope better. Not found it a problem in UK climate. And more charge points in uk than fossil fuel stations!
Youtube has vid of Spanish firm offering to install new pack of either 48 or 64kWh, within existing housing, pricey, guess they reuse your old pack as home storage for solar. But does this get Type Approval, will insurers accept? They retrofitted into a 24kWh car of c2014.

 

[Richard at Bottom Boat]

Just to add, Robert Llewellyn ("Fully Charged") has a 10yrs old 24kWh Leaf, ex-Nissan press fleet, says nothing has gone wrong, is aiming to take it to Muxsan in Holland, they do various pack change options, also range-extender packs which fit in the spare-wheel well. To me, that compromises the rear crumple zone, and unfavourably alters the weight distribution, whereas the factory-fit pack fits within the wheelbase. Can't see insurance accepting that!

 

[JumbleDuck]

wasnt accusing you of lying JD just having been misled about the leaf.

Fair enough. Thanks.

20 miles only is broken, not a normal situation. If a piston had broken on a petrol car, you wouldn't say its noisy, thirsty and slow, you'd say its broken.

Yes, I agree. But if you were thinking of buying a petrol car and you found out that a similar one had bust a piston after five thousand miles, you might not think "All petrol cars have piston problems" but you might think "I wonder if that model is prone to piston problems." So with the Leaf - clearly not right, but are they prone to going not right? Your experience suggests that theirs is an outlier.