Noddy Guide to Making Block and Tackle MOB system

[roblpm]

There is a great thread in the East Coast forum from some years ago where some good people actually tried retrieving a MOB

http://www.ybw.com/forums/showthread.php?175610-Man-overboard-and-the-answer-is/

Their preferred solution was a dedicated block and tackle to attach to the main halyard through the end of the boom to enable lifting someone out of the water.

Before everyone jumps down my throat I am aware that the casualty should be horizontal etc, but for my beginning coastal unchallenging sailing I really just want at least one way of possibly retrieving someone with a KIM sling. This is not supposed to be perfect. I have done my Dayskipper and interestingly they didnt really discuss the most difficult bit ie retrieving the casualty. If this ever happened for real obviously I would be sending a mayday and hoping someone arrived pretty fast!

The trouble is that I am far too thick to figure out how to buy parts to make one, so I need some enterprsing soul to list out the bits and create instructions so simple that I can follow them!!

Cheers

Rob

 

[pvb]

It's probably easier to insist on harnesses and lifelines...
.

 

[roblpm]

It's probably easier to insist on harnesses and lifelines...
.

Yes but not as much fun! Its also an excuse to muck about with some bits and pieces and spend some money which I thought was the point of all this!!

 

[jac]

Is it the sling you want to make or the block and tackle???

 

[Hadenough]

My preferred system is to make sure that the kitty is always kept in a wallet on the chart table. Then if the silly buggers fall overboard I'll do my best but -------

 

[roblpm]

Is it the sling you want to make or the block and tackle???

The block and tackle

 

[knuterikt]

There is a great thread in the East Coast forum from some years ago where some good people actually tried retrieving a MOB

http://www.ybw.com/forums/showthread.php?175610-Man-overboard-and-the-answer-is/

Their preferred solution was a dedicated block and tackle to attach to the main halyard through the end of the boom to enable lifting someone out of the water.

Before everyone jumps down my throat I am aware that the casualty should be horizontal etc, but for my beginning coastal unchallenging sailing I really just want at least one way of possibly retrieving someone with a KIM sling. This is not supposed to be perfect. I have done my Dayskipper and interestingly they didnt really discuss the most difficult bit ie retrieving the casualty. If this ever happened for real obviously I would be sending a mayday and hoping someone arrived pretty fast!

The trouble is that I am far too thick to figure out how to buy parts to make one, so I need some enterprsing soul to list out the bits and create instructions so simple that I can follow them!!

Cheers

Rob

It's not so complicated, first some comments on how to use.
I think that attaching it to the end of the boom sounds like a bad idea on a sailboat that is used for sailing, you would have to take the sail down first.
My plan is to use a spare halyard to hoist one end of the tackle to a height so I can lift over the side, you must allow for some extra height.
The hauling part is led via a snatch block or genoa car to a cockpit winch (self tailing).

For my setup I have
1 fiddle block with becket
1 fiddle block with snap shackle

Rope 10/12mm length 5 x max height + distance to winch

Something like this (without the cleat)

 

[William_H]

I think perhaps with the cleat would be best. Make the whole tackle as long as possible. It is called a "handy billy" and can be used for all sorts of jbs on the boat.
I did a report some years back on this forum of our experiments with MOB recovery ona 38ft yacht at our club.
I think one of the better systems is to have a stern ladder but have a tackle from high up the backstay so that you can help lift the MOB as he climbs up.
An alternative that seemed Ok was to use a spinnacker pole swung out sideways from the mast using a spin halyard to the the lifting and a topping lift to hold the pole up.
Use a rope around the pole and to the end to locate the halyard. ie don't lift from the end of the pole but just part way out as necessary to clear the gunwhale. The pole can be swung in then to get him on foredeck.
We tried the use of boom end which was also OK but as said difficult with sail on.
We tried the use of a small jib shackled to the gunwhale dropped into the water like a net then the head was haulded up by a halyard. This was Ok and did not need a sling or harness but the MOB tended to slip out between the sail and the gunwhale when nearly on board because sail was secured only at the corners and stretched.
In all cases the halyard or topping lift had a lot of friction such that a takle in series would be much easier with the load.
good luck olewill

 

[knuterikt]

I think one of the better systems is to have a stern ladder but have a tackle from high up the backstay so that you can help lift the MOB as he climbs up.

Recovery over the stern using ladder or tackle sound risky in everything but flat water.
On most modern sailboats there is a great risk that the MOB can be hit on he head buy the stern in a little bit of waves.

I have tried to board my boat using the swim ladder on the stern in the waves from an inconsiderate MOBO..
Wold never consider rescue over the stern in anything than flat water.

 

[roblpm]

It's not so complicated, first some comments on how to use.
I think that attaching it to the end of the boom sounds like a bad idea on a sailboat that is used for sailing, you would have to take the sail down first.
My plan is to use a spare halyard to hoist one end of the tackle to a height so I can lift over the side, you must allow for some extra height.
The hauling part is led via a snatch block or genoa car to a cockpit winch (self tailing).

For my setup I have
1 fiddle block with becket
1 fiddle block with snap shackle

Rope 10/12mm length 5 x max height + distance to winch

Something like this (without the cleat)

Great stuff. Obviously the top block is attached to the halyard. I assume the bottom block is attached to the toerail? Why the snap shackle and the becket?

 

[oldbilbo]

It's not so complicated, first some comments on how to use.
I think that attaching it to the end of the boom sounds like a bad idea on a sailboat that is used for sailing, you would have to take the sail down first.
My plan is to use a spare halyard to hoist one end of the tackle to a height so I can lift over the side, you must allow for some extra height.
The hauling part is led via a snatch block or genoa car to a cockpit winch (self tailing).

For my setup I have
1 fiddle block with becket
1 fiddle block with snap shackle

Rope 10/12mm length 5 x max height + distance to winch

Something like this (without the cleat)

'roblpm' is quite right. The RYA ducks this VIP question in its DazedSkipper curriculum.

There are no easy 'one size fits all' answers. After a lot of musing, I've opted for an arrangement - on my little boat - similar to that suggested by 'knuterikt', except I will use my 5:1 Harken mainsheet tackle which secures up to the boom and down to the traveller using 100mm Wichard spring clips. Thus I ( someone ) can easily disconnect it and attach it to a spare halyard 'inverted'. I also have a Lifesling - the business-end strop is closely similar to the NATO strop used on our S&R helos for winching - and the one will attach to the other, with a sufficient mechanical advantage to get someone back on board.

If it is deemed appropriate to have a secondary sling for the legs, that's also easy to attach.

No, it's not idiot proof. No, I don't sail with idiots.


Edit: one of these, 'cos I've got one doing nothing....

 

[knuterikt]

Great stuff. Obviously the top block is attached to the halyard. I assume the bottom block is attached to the toerail? Why the snap shackle and the becket?

The bottom block is attached to the MOB, I have a snap shackle on this block as it's ease to connect to the sling.
Becket is the thingy you attach the fixed end of the rope to (the top block in the picture)

 

[roblpm]

The bottom block is attached to the MOB
Becket is the thingy you attach the fixed end of the rope to (the top block in the picture)

Sorry there I was being really thick!! One end of the rope is fixed!!

So the snap shackle will attach to the lifting strop on the sling.

My plan B is a half inflated dinghy.

I think people who say just don't fall in are a bit foolish as even if these methods arent perfect I would rather have some idea of how to brief the crew and what to do if it really happens! Maybe they don't know anyone who has drowned! My Dad's best mate was drowned in Portsmouth harbour (though that was a solo tender to yacht accident and none of this would have made any difference!!).

Also oldbilbo thought I had a point and if he says so then I must be right!!

 

[roblpm]

'roblpm' is quite right. The RYA ducks this VIP question in its DazedSkipper curriculum.

There are no easy 'one size fits all' answers. After a lot of musing, I've opted for an arrangement - on my little boat - similar to that suggested by 'knuterikt', except I will use my 5:1 Harken mainsheet tackle which secures up to the boom and down to the traveller using 100mm Wichard spring clips. Thus I ( someone ) can easily disconnect it and attach it to a spare halyard 'inverted'. I also have a Lifesling - the business-end strop is closely similar to the NATO strop used on our S&R helos for winching - and the one will attach to the other, with a sufficient mechanical advantage to get someone back on board.

If it is deemed appropriate to have a secondary sling for the legs, that's also easy to attach.

No, it's not idiot proof. No, I don't sail with idiots.


Edit: one of these, 'cos I've got one doing nothing....

That looks expensive!!...........

 

[oldbilbo]

That looks expensive!!...........

It bluddy well is! And doubly so if sitting in the loft gathering dust...!

However, there are plenty of cheaper and still-effective multi-part mainsheet systems with cam-jammers that, with the addition of big Wichard clips like this:

....will do the job. And there are enough cheap copies now - e.g. at Beaulieu Boat Jumble - for this to be affordable.

 

[Andrew G]

This will be nearly as heated as anchors and anchoring but is just as/more important.
As said above it really depends on the boat and crew and how you modify it after each practice.
I use a 50mm wide webbing strop over the boom (orange - ex tether). A Wichard double action safety hook hooked into an eye makes this form a loop over the boom - it must not come undone accidentally. The top of the pulley system snap shackles to this eye (definitely no cleat) the bottom pulley snap shackles to the MoB's PFD or the Life Sling and the free part of the pulley system snap shackles to the toe rail to lead to a primary winch.
- only the self tailing winch or its cleat - no other cleats (my boom is 5m long - how would you reach a cleat on that if the MoB was x meters away and you had to let it down a metre);
- I use red rope (this is the only red rope on board);
- the rope is 10mm (not the 8 in the pics in the preceeding article) - very hard to get full power pulling an 8mm rope - you may have to pre-tension the line before you get it to a winch;
- mine is laced into a series of “bows” so it is quite compact and doesn’t tangle when stowed but feeds out when deployed;
- Use it only for this purpose (whatever the expense). No point if it is holding up the dinghy or tangled or worn when it is needed;
- store it in an accessible place eg tied inside the Life Sling bag with breakable string, or in its own bag? (mine hangs in the flare locker down below);
- on my boat, the best place to bring them up is beside the cockpit (the stern is just too dangerous – unless it is calm). The boom can be secured (traveller, preventer and main sheet) and the lifelines released to slide them over the gunwales;
- hauling them up on a halyard moves the MoB forward, away from the cockpit where crew may need to be for their safety (no point having more MoBs);
- all my halyards, up-hauls etc can reach the water (+ some) if I do decide to raise the pulley system that way;
- I have a ladder at the stern and one beside the cockpit if they can climb by themselves;
- three last points, practice, practice and practice.

Andrew

 

[Daydream believer]

Like the last post I use a different colour for the lift - Flourescent orange-
My lift is the spinnaker topping lift which exits the mast a metre below the jib halliard
I have a large clip that fits everyones harness loop permanently fitted ( i also have a rescue sling if needed)
The line goes back to a 2 speed winch in the cockpit so that it can be near the tiller & other controls & my wife would be strong enough to lift me using it
It is also long enough to reach the water near the stern but not quite long enough to get in the prop
One thing i did do was sew a plastic golf ball on the lift so it cannot be pulled back too far up the mast
I can see an enthusiastic crew pulling on it when it is not clipped on properly & the line disappearing up the mast. the golf ball stops it from going out of reach


I would be worried about using the boom as a lot of load would go on the topping lift
If it came off its cleat ( my topping lift cleat is not particularly substantial) or broke, the falling boom could seriously injure someone if it hit them

 

[nigelmercier]

I would be worried about using the boom as a lot of load would go on the topping lift...

Surely the boom is only used to hold the main line over the side?

 

[rgarside]

I have a substantial 6:1 purchase that is also used with an A frame for raising the mast. The tail would go through a snatch block on the toe rail back to one of the sheet winches. Hope I never have to try it in earnest!

 

[Daydream believer]

Surely the boom is only used to hold the main line over the side?

So what happens when the load goes on the line as you start to lift the casualty