Newby here, seeks opions...

[Doolittle]

Hello,

I've noticed during during the last three years of living by the river quite a disparity of opinions of who is allowed to moor where.

How would you feel if someone whacked a few pegs onto your riverside lawn and camped out over night?

In a similar vein if you lived on a towpath but had a mooring licence and someone used your moorings to tie up?

Personally I'm too laid back to worry about our moorings and anyway it's too busy with three boats, two of which are in and out like a fiddlers elbow.

I'm only curious about your opinions as I've chatted socially with a stuffed shirt in the EA who claims to have been involved with the high court and a test case, but also a new resident of a tow-path property owner who's just moved in and told me about the no trespass sign his solicitor recommended!

BTW Penton to Chertsey's like Picadilly at the mo! /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

[byron]

Personally I am not sure about houses that have towpath frontage and licences. I would assume that you have rented that area and it is yours, rather like renting a property, if you are absent for whatever reason it doesn't give someone else the right to use the property while you aren't there.
Of course direct frontage is a different matter. As a Riparian owner myself I object bitterly to people just tieing up. I mean they would object if I used their drive as a free car park /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif

 

[TrueBlue]

A muddle

If one (i.e. me) wants to be pedantic, the whole issue is a complete British muddle - that is if you want matters to be clear and certain. But that's not the way it works, innit??.

On the Thames and probably other river navigations, the adjacent landowners (aka Byron) own the river bed up to the halfway point as well as the bank; BUT the EA owns the water in the channel.

So fine, you can cruise on EA's waters, but as soon as you want to tie up you need some form of permission so to do. When it comes to anchoring - which EA says you can (provided etc,etc) - don't you need a permission to attach your anchor to his bit of soil as well??

How can you be expected to know who owns the bank or even how to find out?
How do you know if the man demanding a mooring fee has the right to do so?

For some of us who like to "get it right" it's a pain in the nether regions. I'm very cautious; well I go by any site that asks for a fee, and any sign that says "No Mooring", but there's a lot of unsigned places that we use - and where I've never been challenged. Still I don't like to be an unwelcome trespasser.

Most users seem to want a nice mooring with bollards or rings and they are marked with pretty blue signs so you're OK. As to the rest I just try to be unobtrusive, don't singe the grass, don't let your dog(s) poo on the footpath and after you're gone nobody knows you've been there in the first place. Be nice to the Riparian owners and they'll be nice to you.

Be prepared to move if you're challenged and never moor unannounced at the obvious end of a chap's garden. In the case of Byron - with his huge Estate /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif - well be sensible.

Run out of ideas - so come back fellas...

 

[byron]

Re: A muddle

[ QUOTE ]
If

On the Thames and probably other river navigations, the adjacent landowners (aka Byron) own the river bed up to the halfway point as well as the bank; BUT the EA owns the water in the channel.





gone nobody knows you've been there in the first place. Be nice to the Riparian owners and they'll be nice to you.



[/ QUOTE ]

When I first bought this property I was determined to be the friendliest most accomodating Riparian owner on the river. My first season was a salutory lesson. One boat owner set fire to my jetty with his BBQ and legged it instead of dousing it with a bucket of water, the jetty had to be pulled out and junked. One was seen emptying his Porta Potti in the long grass, I found broken bottles, another allowed his kids to let go a small floating pontoon which ended up wrecked on the weir. I can name incident after incident. It was at that stage I said "no more, Yacht Clubs only by arrangement" I can safely say in 20 years of having clubs here on rallies they have 99.99% of the time behaved impeccably. Dog poo swiftly removed, no rubbish left, rarely even a singed blade of grass. The only offender is a dude who drops his dog-ends everywhere. For the record he is a member of the RTYC, UTMYC and the Oxford Ditch. No names but I will give you a clue, he is married to my wife.

Although I ask no payment. Some clubs give very generously to our favorite charity which, for the record we are VERY grateful for.

Now! Anchoring! I haven't a clue. Yes I own the bed to mid stream but in my view it would be ridiculous to try and stop people dropping a hook. If they anchor in the Fairway then it is for officialdom to say something.

 

[TrueBlue]

Re: A muddle

Byron, thanks - for putting your side of the issue and it shows the contempt (or perhaps ignorance) of folk when using someone else's resources. The attitude seems to be, if (whatever it is) is not fenced or padlocked then it's fair game to do whatever you like - and blag your way out if challenged.

The Law does not protect the aggrieved party either.

We (like you) are fortunate to live in a rural area with fields of green and the occasional tractor. It appals me how (I assume) people who live in urban areas make a trip to "My Common" and private lane to drive up and down it, let their dogs wander and do their functions; drop their rubbish without let or hindrance. I wonder if they would do all that in their own environment?

A total lack of Respec' for yer fellow man.

Likewise those who stop in the middle of a lock layby and have lunch.....
They'd none of them be missed,
they'd none of them be missed.

 

[byron]

Re: A muddle

Funny you should say that about people coming out to rural areas. When I first moved from Londinium to my previous house my neighbour had 4,000 acres with my house and 2½ acres a tiny island in a sea of his land. He was a crusty old soul who loved a tipple. He told me that city dwellers tended to respect property, ensured gates were closed and generally present no problems. Hikers were a pain and locals took liberties. It amused him no end that Eileen wouldn't allow the Hunt over our land. Here too she doesn't allow the local shoot on our property much to their chagrin they have to detour around us as the have shooting rights either side of us.

 

[Doolittle]

Re: A muddle for sure...

Thanks for your responses.

Well the EA say that licences given for towpath moorings are a receipt of payment for a year for the right to have a structure on the bank of the river for mooring vessels. It is not an exclusive right for the license holder to use these moorings! Further EA will not issue any more licences because they cost more to administer that the income they generate.

Aye, a muddle to be sure.

I'll declare further interest in this now; the occasion that I moored on a towpath moorings the other side of the river to nip through the alleyway to Notcutts garden centre to collect some rabbit food and came back to the boat to be greeted by a hail of abuse from a mooring licence holder. This gent had been a lovely civil person whom I stopped to chat too on several occasions previously!

I've not had any trouble with uninvited guests on our moorings, you couldn't squeeze a plastic duck between our boats at the mo!!

 

[byron]

Re: A muddle for sure...

[ QUOTE ]


I'll declare further interest in this now; the occasion that I moored on a towpath moorings the other side of the river to nip through the alleyway to Notcutts garden centre to collect some rabbit food and came back to the boat to be greeted by a hail of abuse from a mooring licence holder. This gent had been a lovely civil person whom I stopped to chat too on several occasions previously!



[/ QUOTE ]

You can't really blame the dude. He comes back, finds a boat on his mooring. He then has to hang about not knowing whether it is for 10 minutes or 10 days. Frankly I would have the hump too.
Dunno why but I just thought of an incident here a few years back. A boat pulled in and a lady said "excuse me, do you have a swimming pool?" Puzzled at the question I said "No" she then asked if I had a Tennis Court. When told again "No" she looked at me disdainfully and said "well we won't moor here then" They then pulled away leaving me bewildered by the whole happening. At first I thought it was a wind-up until a lady further downstream told me they had pulled on to their garden and asked if they could use her shower as their kids were dirty.

 

[Doolittle]

Re: A muddle for sure...

Troo, but did know us very well, he sees our Sea Hog daily just by looking out of his window and has previously been happy with us tieing up there whilst we waiting for the school bus to drop the kids. Prolly an 'off-day' he was having.

Can't believe the front of some peeps. Shall I lock down the lid of the jacuzzi?

 

[whisper]

Re: A muddle for sure...

This is all very enlightening as we're about to move to a house in S on A with a decent landing stage on the river.
What would happen if a tree trunk, for example, became lodged on "our half" of the river bed? Is it our responsibility to remove it - eek!! ??

Will be very interesting to see what "trespasses" occur. On Saturday I was hailed by a group of Brummie Lads in a rowing boat who shouted "four teas please, my man".
Am looking forward to suggestions for further money making enterprises before the Summer season arrives. /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif

 

[byron]

Re: A muddle for sure...

Articles causing obstruction of the waterway's flow or navigation are the concern of Envag.
How much did you charge the Brummies for their cuppa?

 

[whisper]

Re: A muddle for sure...

Didn't have the tables and chairs set up, unfortunately.
Have to get organised with sunshades etc.
Really looking forward to riverside living actually - don't fancy the impending decorating though.