New rigging with "Talurit" fittings.

[MasterofHera]

New rigging with \"Talurit\" fittings.

Well winter is nearly here and I am contemplating changing all the standing rigging on my Folkboat. Do you have any commments on using the Talurit system and can it be undertaken by myself with appropriate tools ?

 

[ex-Gladys]

Re: New rigging with \"Talurit\" fittings.

As I recall a Talurit press works at a pressure of about 4 tons.... Probably chepaer to get the rigger to do them - if you must. Talurits break at the edge of the copper collar and most modern opinion seems to go for the swage type fitting....

 

[MasterofHera]

Re: New rigging with \"Talurit\" fittings.

Thanks I was told the same but just wondered if anyone had a "plus" to say about them

 

[Bilgediver]

Re: New rigging with \"Talurit\" fittings.

Copper and SS wire are a no no.... Stainless wire will fail at a stress point where copper is present. Best used galvanised wire.

Unless you have the right press you have no guarantee you are swaging the talurite sleeves correctly.

 

[Roberto]

Re: New rigging with \"Talurit\" fittings.

I have a hand wrench for talurit ferrules and used it for a variety of things, a bit beefier than the Ormiston swaging tool but very similar.

A few remarks:
1.max cable thickness is 5mm, and it takes quite a bit of effort

2.it takes some time: every ferrule has to be compressed three times at three different points along its length

3. perfect cable is 7x19; when using 1x19 cable instead its tiny component wires tend to open up as the wire is bent, say to make an eye

4. I have had some difficulties in finding the correctly matching ferrule sizes for the different dies, as for example two nominal 4mm ferrules may vary a little bit in actual size, and the die may scrape off a bit of metal from the ferrule, which is bad

if not for the rigging, the wrench is useful for a lot of things (closing wires for the aft pulpit, securing cable for the dinghy, various fixed bits of wire here and there, rudder spare cables, etc)

 

[Spuddy]

Re: New rigging with \"Talurit\" fittings.

Mine needed changing last year on a Folkboat clone. Was considering using the Norseman type fittings and DIY but got a quote for all made up with new bottlescrews for £450 from a rigger. Might give you a target price to beat if you go that route.

 

[catalac08]

Re: New rigging with \"Talurit\" fittings.

hi
on a positive note I have had 3 boats all talurite/stainless eye swages and never had any problems or even a broken strand over 15 years. IMHO the negative comments about wire failure where swage ends applies just as much to where a stainless swaged end terminates. The important thing with all rigging is that there should be a swivel so that the rigging iscrew is not held rigiid and bending occuring in the swage area.

Stainless swages are much more expensive than talurite, talurite is an industry standard usage for cranes and certified lifting so there are no doubts about its strength not being adequate if properly done.

I guess your rigging would be 5mm and not perhaps something to do yourself as if a failure danger to life and your insurance co would not be impressed.

Nothing wrong with Talurite up to 6mm - ask a rigger - I asume your current rigging is talurite how has this performed?

 

[Guest]

Re: New rigging with \"Talurit\" fittings.

[ QUOTE ]
Well winter is nearly here and I am contemplating changing all the standing rigging on my Folkboat. Do you have any commments on using the Talurit system and can it be undertaken by myself with appropriate tools ?

[/ QUOTE ]

Many people confuse Talurit with Swaged fittings - you obviously not as you are asking the question !

A large % of boats up to 30ft in years gone by ... Folkboat years incl. - used Talurit. In fact many older boats still do. Have a gander around yards with older boats sitting there - count actually how many DON'T have Talurit rather than how many do !

You will get comments about stainless and Talurit fittings incompatible .... sadly true - despite most rig failures are not actually at the fitting - what I've seen anyway ....

As to doing them DIY - I waould advise not to .... one of the biggest errors made in early days of inexperienced press operators was to press the fitting "twice". Internal cracks / weaknesses were induced that later failed. They are designed to be pressed and that's it finish !
The rigger has the set-up to get the eye pulled tight properly, the end set properly and right pressure exerted on fitting.

I can be honest and say that the rigging on my boat is more than 10 yrs old that I know of and there are no signs of stress or decline. When the port cap-shroud was caught a few months ago and failed - it was the wire as it exited the mast head that parted ... both top and bottom Talurits were undamaged and in full order. Stainless 1x19 and standard talurit.
The replacement is a galvanized 3x25 with more copper like talurits - made up by a crane rigger as temp replacement - difficult to get 1x19 stainless out here ... His comments were - as good as the old - come back in 2 yrs and we'll look at it again !!

 

[roly_voya]

Re: New rigging with \"Talurit\" fittings.

No reason for not using talurit ends (though I agree about DIY being inadvisable) or even splicing around a solid eye which is in fact the strongest method and presents no hard spot at the end to cause fatigue problems. The problems of cracking/wire fatigue come from incorrectly bending the wire. The reason eyes are not normally formed in 1*19 wire is that its min bend ratio is to big, several inches on 5/6mm wire. If you bend it more than that the outer wires on the bend carry more load and are therefore more suceptable to fracture under high or cyclic loads. 7*19 is much more flexible and normally used with any system that bends the wire round a loop although even then it will benifit from a bit bigger than standard thimble. The reason rigs changed to 1*19 wire was because it streaches less which means more forstay sag and can cause problems with the mast going out of colum on high aspect rigs with narrow shroud bases but that is not going to be a problem on a folkboat. Ideally use solid thimbles as the open ones can deform under heavy rig loads (available from classic marine I think) Make no difference weather you are using galvanised or S/S wire

If you want to read up on it before having a go then the best book is Brian Toss the Rigger Manual.

 

[maxi]

Re: New rigging with \"Talurit\" fittings.

Pretty much frowned on by surveyors these days. It's old technology and whilst it's ok insome applications there are better methods available e.g swages.

 

[oldharry]

Re: New rigging with \"Talurit\" fittings.

Just redone the rigging myself on my third boat. Talurited from new (1970) and still apparently perfectly OK, but stainless wire at 35 years old? The splices were as good as the day they were made, on a boat that has a long cruising history around East and South Coast with at least one annual channel crossing a year since 1988, as well as regular club racing.

DIY Taluriting needs a proper hydraulic press - not the hand held unit which is only good for dinghy rigging. Even with a hydraulic press wire above 4mm is quite difficult to handle. |
Doing a full set of 6mm wires was a day and a half of hard manual labour! It is not easy at that thickness to ensure then wires remain in position round the thimble, and it is a lot of sweat to bring it tight on to the thimble undamaged. 5mm is a lot easier, but still takes a lot of sweat to get it right. By comparison 4mm is a doddle!

As has been pointed out, you should press only once.

The first boat I did is now seven years on, and a recent rig inspection showed everything was as good as new.

Having said all that I think it was PBO did a pull test on Talurit, Swageless and Swaged rigging terminals. Talurit proved the weakest, but held on to near the SWL of the wire anyway. Many smaller older boats the rigging is often fastened with shackles which have a much lower SWL than the wire or splice anyway! 5mm wire IIRC has a SWL of around 2000kgs, which a good Talurit will hold anyway, and is then fastened with a 6mm sshackle with a SWL of around 600kgs! Not clever!

On the other hand an experienced boat builder/rigger tells me that properly set up Talurits are in his opinion the most reliable for a smaller boat like a Folkboat. He reckons the soft talurit splice is kinder to the wire than Swaged or swageless which can form a pinch point where the wire enters the fitting.

Bigger boats of course need heavier wire than can be formed round a Talurit.