New marina at Walton on the naze

[Cobra]

Given that we share the same sailing waters I do hope that you are not as objectionable as that comment would imply. What makes ill or unemployed people or low income families scum?

In any case the error here is not the placement of families on benefits but the building of a development for which there was no market.

Errrr Whoops! Sorry, I just got a wee bit carried away there...I get very passionate about the destruction of the East Coast and the prospect of another glass and steel marina development just abhors me! I have made an amendment to my original post reflect a more appropriate approach!

 

[MoodySabre]

Well done.

Hands off the East coast I say.

 

[LONG_KEELER]

I get very passionate about the destruction of the East Coast and the prospect of another glass and steel marina development just abhors me!

You do seem to jump up and down a lot without coming up with any alternatives to the ending of the old industries and sites thereof .

Where would the money come from . You are obviously not keen on the use of public money.

Have the developments of the Ipswich docks, Burnham and Bradwell marinas been a disaster. Yes, mistakes have been made at Brightlingsea but things can and do change.

Could you be more specific on where the destruction of the East Coast is.

How would you attract new investors to at least keep things as they are and who would they be.

Do other people have the right to own a boat if they choose to do so and thereby expand existing capacity. If you do, how would this take place.

Should housing not be built on the old marine structures and be replaced with green sites.

Would you like to borrow my Flux Capacitor ?

 

[Lucky Duck]

The last two residential developments at the Ipswich dock have probably been a greater failure than those at Brightlingsea with both developers now in administration leaving part complete eyesores and derelict buildings.

 

[MoodySabre]

Have the developments of the Ipswich docks, Burnham and Bradwell marinas been a disaster.

Bradwell

 

[nigelm]

As a destination for a weekend I would choose Walton over brightlingsea anytime , for us there is just nothing there , unless your an old fuddy duddy who wants to sup half of brown ale with a packet of chips .
For us it's up to Walton , dinner in the bar , cab into clacton and a club till late , cab back to boat , fry up in the morning and sail back
And we did it from hullbridge in a 23' Pegasus 700 to start with .

Brightlingsea , nah , toooo quiet .

 

[swatchways]

Taken my boat in twice (12.8m and 1.9m draft) bit of a bum clencher especially when being 'attacked' by lots of dinghy sailors and the channel markers are very small and dive off at unlikely tangents, but following them slavishly is essential. check with W&F for depths over cill but not a problem - had a tiny gap either side when passing through the gate!
Or you could moor at the entrance to the channel and go in by dinghy, but dont do as I did and ask someone in a rib if the pontoons dry out for long - 'No' he said, 'Hardly at all' We all disappeared up the town, only to return to be greeted with no water and acres of mud, Turns out the bloke I spoke to had never been there before! As the tide wasnt expected back until 1am had to get a B&B in Clacton - bit of an adventure really apart from the drunks returning at 5am to howl at the moon!

When we were nippers (some 20yrs ago now ) in and out of the club there was a lot more water, these days access is somewhat more limited and you do have to know how long you've got before nipping to the showers/shops!
I don't find the entrance to the pond too bad, but then Swatchways is fairly small in comparison to yours, as you say the real problem is trying to avoid the dinghies (although having said that, they're faster than us )!

Back to the development - lots are opposed to it, that's clear from all the posters up all over the town. It is true that it would change the club substantially too.

 

[LONG_KEELER]

The last two residential developments at the Ipswich dock have probably been a greater failure than those at Brightlingsea with both developers now in administration leaving part complete eyesores and derelict buildings.

You are probably referring to the building known as the 'Wine Rack'.

It is true that some developments have gone bust but this is true all over Europe and in other countries. I suppose you could call these failures.

Alternatively, in order to overcome these problems how would you have done things differently ?

 

[millbeach]

Must admit Brightlingsea town is a tad rough and "chavy",
Marina is very nice,
Must admit think Bradwell is ok ,,

 

[davidwf]

Now I am going to be very controversal here, as I have often thought that the Deben is developing into a large boat park with all the moorings at Felexstowe, Ramsholt, Waldringfield and Woodbridge.

I would rather see a Marina built upriver of Felixstowe Ferry and reduce the number of moorings on the river I know it will never ever happen because of all the tree huggers but I cannot help but wonder.

 

[GrumpyOldGit]

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[Cobra]

[RANT MODE]

You do seem to jump up and down a lot without coming up with any alternatives to the ending of the old industries and sites thereof .

OK...it's a fair cop and guilty as charged. I make no pretence about the fact I would rather see the East Coast as it was some 50 years ago. I was only 5 at the time and I know that we all see things from our youth in a much rosier view than maybe they were, BUT I do remember quite clearly coming down through the moorings in Brightlingsea and not having to treat it as a slalom run as it is now. There are alternatives to every development, it is just how money talks and what we end up with!

Where would the money come from . You are obviously not keen on the use of public money.

Actually I am keen on the use of public money! I would much rather see money spent on keeping our environment a pleasant one to live in than to pour money into shall we just say "debatable causes"?

Have the developments of the Ipswich docks, Burnham and Bradwell marinas been a disaster. Yes, mistakes have been made at Brightlingsea but things can and do change.

I can only assume that you do sail with a blindfold on? Anyone who keeps their eyes open and thinks that Ipswich, Burnham and Bradwell marinas are sights of great beauty...sorry...this is a wee bit early for April 1st isn't it?

Could you be more specific on where the destruction of the East Coast is.

Sure...lets start with Gunfleet Wind Farm, Thames Array Wind Farm, Scroby Sands Wind Farm, Cell Block H in Brightlingsea, Burnham Yacht Harbour...shall I go on?

How would you attract new investors to at least keep things as they are and who would they be.

Sorry, not trying to be obtuse, but why do you need Private investment? Surely that means that costs will rise to provide a return thus forcing out locals...take a look at the small fishing villages in Cornwall...summer months they are full of second homers, winter months they are all but empty. If you want this for the East Coast then god help us all!

Do other people have the right to own a boat if they choose to do so and thereby expand existing capacity. If you do, how would this take place.

Now that is the big issue isn't it! Personally I hate Marinas...IMHO they are (along with Offshore Wind Farms!) the spawn of the Devil. But having said that they do offer a lot of mooring space for boat owners. Having said that back in the '60's there were a lot of boats kept on drying moorings and mud berths...those old traditional moorings are now in the most gone and everyone wants pontoons or marina berths. I guess that is a progress that has to be accepted.

Should housing not be built on the old marine structures and be replaced with green sites.

Now you are being rather churlish aren't you? Going back to Cell Block H in Brightlingsea. At the time of the development being mooted and the various public meetings, a local architect in association with the Brightlingsea Society drew up alternative plans for the old James and Stone site. They were for low density housing of a style and type matching other local properties and a shifting of the Smack dock alongside the old Aldous yard from it's current position to a more central position in the new development. Making the area not dissimilar to the Maldon Quayside. This would have been practical and in keeping with the town. Would it have worked? Who knows? Alledgedly money talks!

Would you like to borrow my Flux Capacitor ?

No, but you are quite obviously happy with the rape of the East Coast just so long as you can sail from one Marina berth to another and not get your feet wet!

NUURRRRRRRSSSE![/RANT MODE]

 

[Cobra]

As a destination for a weekend I would choose Walton over brightlingsea anytime ,

Brightlingsea , nah , toooo quiet .

GOOD! Let's keep it that way! Just remember to keep going up the Wallet until you reach the Pye End Bouy! PLEASE do not turn left into Brightlingsea!!

 

[Cobra]

Must admit Brightlingsea town is a tad rough and "chavy",

I will ignore that! Certainly no more Chavvy than any other town...ie Clacton, Reading, Brentwood, Maldon, Hemel Hempstead, Ipswich, Norwich etc etc

Marina is very nice,

and which Marina is this??

 

[Koeketiene]

I will ignore that! Certainly no more Chavvy than any other Essex town...ie Clacton, Colchester, Brentwood, Maldon, Chelmsford etc etc

 

[sailorman]

Well my marina neighbour is about to move into the small marina there . that will change the place for sure, unless they all moan a lot then he will fit right in

 

[xyachtdave]

Can I suggest the Brightlingsea and Burnham waterfronts are a lot more appealing than for example Chatham's? (shouldn't provoke too much argument!)

The more I explore the East Coast the more I despair at our towns lack of investment or imagination in it's own.

I first visited Brightlingsea after the new buildings/marina was built. I water taxi ashore and stroll around the town, a friendly harbourmaster, CYC, various food available and all the essentials available for cruising. Is it really all completely destroyed by a marina and flat combination?

Burnham's unsightly marina??
It appears to be dug into a hole tucked out of town and if you were not looking for it you could easily sail past the entrance without noticing it. Same as B'sea here, loads of places to eat, friendly staff, nice little town, free bike show Sunday am weather permitting, cheap mooring (by local standards).

You find the same in places like Ipswich, easy access to the town, everything you need to maintain a boat/yourself. Maldon - nice waterfront, a park for children, loads of places to eat. Waterfront well used in all of the above and pleasant for families to spend a few hours by, regardless of boat ownership.

Enter Chatham. Sun pier derelict - apparently the pier pontoon was repaired at a cost of £70k and ordered to be removed by the council who didn't want any maintenance costs, prime waterfront.......let's build a Staples office superstore and Tax office. Park next to the river....leave the drunks in one corner and build bus station. Command House, it could be nice pub for food etc unfortunately a sea of broken glass and fag buts.

Don't knock the development of the East Coast too hard, I would positively encourage it here.

 

[Lucky Duck]

You are probably referring to the building known as the 'Wine Rack'.

It is true that some developments have gone bust but this is true all over Europe and in other countries. I suppose you could call these failures.

Alternatively, in order to overcome these problems how would you have done things differently ?

Not just the 'Wine Rack', the two tallest buildings on the adjacent development (Cranfield Mills) were never fitted out in an early attempt to stave off the adminstrators and those that were completed look barely occupied every time I walk past.

While I can't speak for the Regatta Quays development (aka the Wine Rack), Cranfield Mills' target market was predominately buy to let investors which was probably not a good sign. I would also question whether there was really the market for the number of flats being constructed on Ipswich waterfront. After all, if I wanted to live in a flat I would move a lot nearer London and get up at a reasonable time each weekday morning

 

[LONG_KEELER]

OK...it's a fair cop and guilty as charged. I make no pretence about the fact I would rather see the East Coast as it was some 50 years ago. I was only 5 at the time and I know that we all see things from our youth in a much rosier view than maybe they were, BUT I do remember quite clearly coming down through the moorings in Brightlingsea and not having to treat it as a slalom run as it is now. There are alternatives to every development, it is just how money talks and what we end up with!

Actually I am keen on the use of public money! I would much rather see money spent on keeping our environment a pleasant one to live in than to pour money into shall we just say "debatable causes"?

I can only assume that you do sail with a blindfold on? Anyone who keeps their eyes open and thinks that Ipswich, Burnham and Bradwell marinas are sights of great beauty...sorry...this is a wee bit early for April 1st isn't it?

Sure...lets start with Gunfleet Wind Farm, Thames Array Wind Farm, Scroby Sands Wind Farm, Cell Block H in Brightlingsea, Burnham Yacht Harbour...shall I go on?

Sorry, not trying to be obtuse, but why do you need Private investment? Surely that means that costs will rise to provide a return thus forcing out locals...take a look at the small fishing villages in Cornwall...summer months they are full of second homers, winter months they are all but empty. If you want this for the East Coast then god help us all!

Now that is the big issue isn't it! Personally I hate Marinas...IMHO they are (along with Offshore Wind Farms!) the spawn of the Devil. But having said that they do offer a lot of mooring space for boat owners. Having said that back in the '60's there were a lot of boats kept on drying moorings and mud berths...those old traditional moorings are now in the most gone and everyone wants pontoons or marina berths. I guess that is a progress that has to be accepted.

Now you are being rather churlish aren't you? Going back to Cell Block H in Brightlingsea. At the time of the development being mooted and the various public meetings, a local architect in association with the Brightlingsea Society drew up alternative plans for the old James and Stone site. They were for low density housing of a style and type matching other local properties and a shifting of the Smack dock alongside the old Aldous yard from it's current position to a more central position in the new development. Making the area not dissimilar to the Maldon Quayside. This would have been practical and in keeping with the town. Would it have worked? Who knows? Alledgedly money talks!

No, but you are quite obviously happy with the rape of the East Coast just so long as you can sail from one Marina berth to another and not get your feet wet!

NUURRRRRRRSSSE![/RANT MODE]

Well. Thanks for giving a reply. Not bad.

The fact that there are about 7 billion people on this planet. All of whom have different parents, educations, life experiences etc suggest that no one has the monopoly on truth. Particularly you and I.

We live in exciting times. There is more action, money, services , products than at any time. Life is moving at a faster rate than ever before. It does seem a shame that some of us don't want a slice of it. The reality is that life will move on whether we like it or not. Personally I'm enjoying it.

There will of course be winners and losers, not only people but towns. But all will learn from it no doubt.

 

[LONG_KEELER]

Not just the 'Wine Rack', the two tallest buildings on the adjacent development (Cranfield Mills) were never fitted out in an early attempt to stave off the adminstrators and those that were completed look barely occupied every time I walk past.

While I can't speak for the Regatta Quays development (aka the Wine Rack), Cranfield Mills' target market was predominately buy to let investors which was probably not a good sign. I would also question whether there was really the market for the number of flats being constructed on Ipswich waterfront. After all, if I wanted to live in a flat I would move a lot nearer London and get up at a reasonable time each weekday morning

There does seem to be an abundance of flats but I suppose that market forces will eventually sort this out. I believe a number of single people owning flats and houses in Chelmsford/Colchester areas let them out and purchased and lived in another flat in Ipswich and commuting to London when things were looking good. Some have caught a cold. Hopefully the excess might help locals get on the first rung.

The area behind the Custom House near the two churches still looks grim though. I am old enough to remember bomb sites and that is what it resembles. The wet dock could have looked like this without the investment though. I notice there is a new hotel being built behind the University.