New instruments

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MacD68

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Hello,
I'm new to the Forum, and just bought my first yacht, so hopefully you guys will be patient with a few basic questions over the next few months.
The boat is a 1982 Mikkel 32 (Norwegian), with the hull in good shape, and a recently rebuilt engine, so I'm happy with my new baby.
The rest of the boat is basic, so after I get some life jackets sorted, I'm going to look at getting some new instruments. The budget is constrained (as always) so the idea is to get speed/depth first, and add a wind instrument later. GPS will be a Garmin GPS72 handheld.
So to get to the question, I would appreciate any thoughts on suitable instruments that are closer to the budget end of the market (that rules out Tack Tick and ST60's), but that can also be part of a combined system later (from what I see the Nasa Clipper series appears to be standalone instrumentation, with no possibility to input GPS info to obtain VMG etc later).
The Navma instruments (now sold as Northstar??) look interesting, and there is the possibility of Raymarine ST40, but I would greatly appreciate all and any feedback based on practical experience.
I have some questions about the best way to heat the boat (Webasto??) but maybe that's best saved for a later post /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
Cheers, Donald
 
I have recently been pondering the same question, but have yet to put my hand in my pocket.
So far my conclusions on integration are:
<ul type="square"> [*]Units talking to each other via NMEA can use telephone cable for the linkage
[*]Raymarine Seatalk requires special cables
[*]Raymarine ST40 series needs an extra special connector set to be able to plug the Seatalk cables into them
[*]Seatalk to NMEA requires a special interface box
This means if any component in your instruments isn't Seatalk compatible there will be extra expense to get them all to talk together. [/list]

On the product offerings:

NASA generally is standalone. Useful exceptions are the GPS repeater and a NMEA wind sender unit.

I like the specification and price of the Navman/Northstar range, but there have been posts on here recently suggesting that they don't last much beyond their guarantee period.

Raymarine ST40 Bidata looks good with the exception of the interfacing issues above. Also I understand the Wind unit is designed more for Mobos than sailing use.

Raymarine ST60... just expensive.

As I say I don't have practical experience of any of the above units and would love someone to offer further opinions.
 
I have been using an Echopilot bronze trio instrument which displays depth, speed and repeats GPS readings. It was about £250 and will work with most makes of depth transducers and various "paddlewheels". Connected to the GPS (my Garmin) it displays speed over the ground, track, distance and bearing to next waypoint as well as position (lat & long) cross track error etc. The one instrument can be scrolled through about ten different optional screen displays, with various combinations of some or all of the readings. Echopilot technicians were most helpful with advice when I was setting it up.

I have had it for about 5 years and it has been very reliable.
 
[ QUOTE ]

  • Raymarine Seatalk requires special cables


    [/ QUOTE ]
    Huh, is this right?
    I have just routed a sea talk cable from the last instrument in the chain back to the chartplotter so i can get data sent to it.
    The cable that I used was not a special seatalk cable but just ordinary 3 strand.
    has anyone experienced problems with therir setup using similar ordinary cable?
 
Raymarine chartplotter/ sounder- the special plug for NMEA in /out uses individual pins the same size as the small female spade type used in car stereo speaker systems, and the pins functions are listed in the Raymarine handbook, just remember to use a mirror image!
I connected a DSC VHF this way without problems.
 
Navman have had huge problems with the LCD displays on their instruments. Since I bought mine ( about three years ago) they have gone through radical redesigns to the extent that repairs to my set of instruments are becoming impossible. Stocks of parts for those instruments that can be repaired are dwindling, some down to single figures on the shelves with no sign of new stock being made available.
That said, they are not alone in having problems. There have been posts on this forum reporting issues with a number of makes across the range of prices. I'm a bit committed, having lashed out on the full set of Navman stuff with a Navbus linked to the plotter. That's the problem, if you want your kit to talk to each other, you can't really mix and match. But if I was starting again and just looking at instruments I'd go for Tacktick. Anything to cut back the snakes wedding of wires that infests all boats, including mine!
 
The main reason, as I see it, for instruments to "talk" to each other is only if you intend to have a repeater/plotter display in the system; apart perhaps for a wind instrument to talk to the autopilot to steer to the wind.

ST40's will talk to ST 60s, its easier with a raymarine cable and plug but simple small spades work well through a 3-core cable - probably best if it is screened.

The raymaine system is good - tho' the ST60's are expensive; as once you have power to 1st instrument its just a daisy chain to the rest to provide data and power.

FWIW if you go for a Raymarine wind DONT use the rotavecta transducer - its carp; always loosing its relative position. .
 
Thanks for the feedback. The Echopilot option is interesting, and one that I hadn't considered, so I will talk to them.
Tack Tick instruments would be nice, but just to expensive for me.
 
quote

---------------------------------------

FWIW if you go for a Raymarine wind DONT use the rotavecta transducer - its carp; always loosing its relative position. .

-----------------------------------------

tell me about it.
 
Unless you want to invest serious money in instrumentation keep to stand alones. eg Nasa speed and depth, Lowrance plotter. The problem with integrated systems is that each time one component fails (and raymarines certainly do) the cheapest option is to replace it like for like. Biting the bullet and ripping the whole lot out to start again is not finacially viable.
 
FWIW I had a Garmin 128 connected to a Yeoman plotter, a Nasa repeater in the "garage", a Nasa windvane unit and a Simrad Tillerpilot all talking to each other on my previous boat! Indeed if the gas cylinder had not been so close to the tillerpilot I could even have had the GPS steering the boat, but the deviation was too great! You don't need the echo sounder and log connected to the system unless you want to link into some exotic sort of chart plotter.
Suggest you buy a GPS and Nasa repeater first. By entering waypoints manually you will be able to obtain SOG and COG and there is a log function for distance. Expand when the money comes in. Get the best echo sounder you can afford though;in my view the most important bit of electronic kit. But then I sailed in the days before Decca was easily available! /forums/images/graemlins/ooo.gif
 
I didn't say you should have them all talk to one another; just a few comments about doing so ( having done it on the last boat) and may NOT do it again on this one!!
 
All this speak of fancy instruments and I thought the idea was to go sailing ! I grew up sailing the East coast with a compass, charts, depth sounder and a hand held RDF. It was sufficient but basic. When I bought the Warrior she had Decca, twin head depth sounder, VHF, radar, log, autopilot and every bit stand alone. Decca became useless, radar finally stopped working and hasn't yet been replaced, new GPS unit tells me where I am and where I am going and where I have been. When I arrived in my current cruising area I asked the chandlers for charts and she answered why do I want charts, its easy here. There is the beach and there is the sea, nothing else to worry about. Whilst she was almost correct, the instruments I use now and would not like to be without are all basic and simple. GPS and depth sounder. I dont get to look out at the Isle of Wight but it the land is on my starboard side I am going West and if it is on my port side I am going East. I was once horrified to hear of someone with a mobo (on the yachmaster shore based course no less) who set up his instruments to autopilot at speed from St Peter Port to Exmouth via preset way points in the fog. God help any other boater who might have been in his path that day.

My real point is how many instruments do we actually need and use to enjoy sailing?
 
Having had a fair range of instruments, including B+G, I am still impressed by the NASA Clipper units I fitted to my impala.
Big digits, easy to read.
Dedicated display, so you don't find that what you thought was 8m of depth is in fact apparent wind angle, because the crew have been playing!
The downside of independent instruments is that you can't so easily get a repeater to display whatever you want at the chart table.
The ability of linked instruments to calculate things like true wind is limited by your ability to keep everything properly calibrated. In practice upwind you subtract 80% of boatspeed from apparent wind, downwind add boatpseed.
A GPS repeater in the cockpit is very useful. As a minimum I would want depth and log. Wind speed very desirable. Wind angle better served by illuminating the windex at night imho!
 
[ QUOTE ]
DONT use the rotavecta transducer - its carp; always loosing its relative position. .

[/ QUOTE ]

What's that, a fish tied to the masthead? No wonder it is confused.
 
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