New Elans

[flaming]

New deck, new cockpit and new styling …. according to the J website J/36 (36.0')

I had though some of the more crusing J yachts were, like the X Yachts, on a subtly differnt / fuller hull shape as well, but not in the case of the J36 apparently

For a while J were running essentially 2 lines in yachts.

J88, J111 were the faster, earlier planing boats

97, 112, 122 were more traditional C/R.

99 is somewhere in between. 121 a bit of a diversion into offshore specific boat. (That wasn't a huge success)

Both the 88 and the 111 are out of production (though they will build 111s if they get orders for 5 at a time apparently)

They have also launched the J7 and J9, which are comfortable day sailers.

So with the 112 being replaced by the J36, it does look like they are pivoting away from really fast boats like the 111, and towards more traditional C/Rs.

Interestingly this is the exact opposite of what every other yard is doing... Everyone else is splitting the range into much faster boats, and much slower more comfortable boats.

 

[Ingwe]

Yes….you’re right. And @Frogmogman (who posted while I was typing). Maybe should drop by Fox’s… did fill out a contact form, back in the summer, but heard nothing. May have scared them off by opening with asking if the tiller steering, from the First 36SE (full carbon race version), could be had on the standard First 36.

I would contact seascape directly either by email or "Seascape Edition" on Facebook. This time of year they probably aren't all sailing so shouldn't take too long to respond.

My experience has been that certainly Ancasta aren't really interested, the last time I tried ordering parts through them for my First 18 they came back to me saying the boat had been discontinued and couldn't help. Emailed Seascapes parts department and had it the next week.

 

[Lucky Duck]

….subtly….

BUT the changes do (for me) help to shift her from racer/ cruiser to cruiser / racer. The one I sailed recently was a J/112e. BUT I visited J-Composites in Les Sables, to climb around a J/36 in build, in the summer. Unfortunately I picked a week when, main man, Fred Bouvier was off scooping up silverware.

The twin wheels do significantly open up the cockpit and avoid that ‘pinned behind the wheel’ feeling. Plus (biggie for me) a tiller option is available. Engineered along the lines of the J/99 set up. Which includes provision for Jefa below decks ‘permanently engaged’ pilot.

The lazarette hatch has been neatened up. Fibreglass cowl replaced with flush hatch.

J pole is retained (v’s mini sprit of J/40 & J/45) for max off wind sail area & min berthing fees. Which I like.

Hull remains resin infused (worth a trip to Les Sables just to see the process) cored with closed cell foam and balsa. The balsa there for low resin uptake and mechanical properties. But it worries me a bit (rot risk long term?)

Below decks:

Companionway opened up. Including, I think (but I could be thinking of another boat), drop down washboards. Plus Shallower & more numerous companionway steps. Which also aids galley bracing.

Slightly larger and more sculpted lockers.

Saloon hatch moved forward of mast (used to be obstructed by kicker on J/112)

Of more importance (to me): notch at head of forward V berth removed. On the J/112e it was there as a step. To aid pushing sails up through the fore hatch. On the J/36 the notch is gone. Providing a 2m+ length (on centreline) berth.

The interior does look an upgrade on the J/112e. But somehow lacks the (to me) simple yet classy look of the J/40 & J/45. To my eye it’s acceptable, but no more. Pogo and RM (to name but two) do it better at a similar price point / LOA. In terms of aesthetics, perceived quality and stowage provision. All in the eye of the beholder, of course.

Sailing performance was never in question. Hence lack of change there. In fairness Key Yachting originally described the J/36 as a face lift, to me.

Thanks, from the manufacturer’s photos I was struggling to spot many differences so did wonder how much the talk of change was marketing puff

Balsa is also a concern for me.

Some articles refer to it being ’de-tuned’ but seems like there is no change to the rig, hull or appendages?

 

[Lucky Duck]

Elan haven't really been making C/Rs for years. Basically since they discontinued the 340, 380 and 410. The replacement 350, 400, 450 etc never really cut the mustard on the race course. Decent fast cruisers though.

Right now the only things you'd call genuine C/Rs being made in the sub 40 foot space are the Js and the First series. I definitely wouldn't call the Sunfasts C/Rs. They're specialist offshore D/H boats.

If you think back to the early 2000s, where you had C/Rs from X, Elan, Bavaria Match, Beneteau First, Arcona, Dehler, J etc etc....

I've been saying for ages that we're due a big reset... Dunno what form it might take though....

And back then the Sun Fast range was definitely mainstream

Even ten years ago the choice wasn’t all that great

ETA - even at the lower tier levels of racing I can’t recall anyone competing in the local spring and autumn series and then heading off to the West Country in between so maybe the schism is not going to resolve itself

 

[John_Silver]

Some articles refer to it being ’de-tuned’ but seems like there is no change to the rig, hull or appendages?

No changes. Felt a very approachable / unintimidating boat though, despite a full suite of sail / rig controls. A trick which not all performance cruisers pull off. And, on my light airs sail, the helm feel was sweet: light and positive. So, I'd congratulate J-boats on their decision to leave well alone, in the hull rig & foils department.On deck too. Just wish they’d put more effort in below decks.

 

[flaming]

And back then the Sun Fast range was definitely mainstream

Even ten years ago the choice wasn’t all that great

ETA - even at the lower tier levels of racing I can’t recall anyone competing in the local spring and autumn series and then heading off to the West Country in between so maybe the schism is not going to resolve itself

That's been my beef with the rating office for years.

All of the penalties for modifying the interior were designed to encourage dual use, except nobody was doing that... So for example when we had the Elan the owner wanted to remove the forecabin door because we were only racing and it was getting damaged. Similarly we'd have liked to have taken the cushions off the boat completely as they were only getting wet and slowly ruined, nobody was ever sleeping on them. But the penalties for doing so were punative, so they stayed. And therefore the next owner who was going to mostly cruise the boat didn't get an essentially unused interior as he could have done, but one that was a little battered.

 

[John_Silver]

Sound advice from @flaming & @Ingwe . Thank you! Messaged Seascape co-founder Kristian H last night, re putting a First 36SE tiller on a standard First 36. Reply, by return this, morning. For those interested:

It can be done.

Downside (from Kristian) is that cockpit bench extension boxes & cockpit table must be sacrificed, to allow tiller to swing.

Upside (based on promo pix) is that helm sits well forward, between main & jib winches, able to control both them and the traveller.





That's the cockpit sorted!
But how to resolve the micro-heads issue? (Or reprogram my expectations). EDIT: Now then......If the forward part of the starboard aft cabin became a heads and the aft became a 'technical area' (as per the French norm)....that would do the trick. And the existing head could be the mother of all wet lockers cum shower cubicle......
Another Q: will Seascape be able to preserve its commendable independent, small yard style, agility and responsiveness?