New Aircon install

[Portofino]

As some will probably know I purchased a new to me boat before Christmas with the intension of working through a small list of upgrades .
There were only 17 made each slightly a bit custom Itama42 /48 .
Mine has no Air Con .At the time I kinda thought of the flip side of starting with a blank canvas .
After 9 y with Sunseeker marine air self contained units ,I know what" I do not want " .Noise .
I know self contained units from a builders perspective and most retro fits are cheaper / easier it install and a lot of folks just accept that -came with the boat .
I gone for a Frigomar 24 V chiller in the Engine room with 3 air handlers in each of the spaces -saloon,fwd cabin ,aft cabin .
This is new tech it means I can run it on the alternators ,ie chill it down when returning to port ,shorepower at port ,or Geny at anchor eventually when domestic bank needs a boost .
Well that's the plan -it's being installed this week and I plan to nip down at W/E to view ( will take pics)
Here's the link I,am hoping up to 42,000 BTU (calc,s were around 20,000 ) should cope with July /August " tropical " heat in the Med at night and the whole thing just be a gentle breeze .
It's costing 2-3 X more than selfies .
http://www.frigomar.com/images/PDF/FRIGOMAR_chiller-inverter-DC_eng.pdf

 

[rustybarge]

As some will probably know I purchased a new to me boat before Christmas with the intension of working through a small list of upgrades .
There were only 17 made each slightly a bit custom Itama42 /48 .
Mine has no Air Con .At the time I kinda thought of the flip side of starting with a blank canvas .
After 9 y with Sunseeker marine air self contained units ,I know what" I do not want " .Noise .
I know self contained units from a builders perspective and most retro fits are cheaper / easier it install and a lot of folks just accept that -came with the boat .
I gone for a Frigomar 24 V chiller in the Engine room with 3 air handlers in each of the spaces -saloon,fwd cabin ,aft cabin .
This is new tech it means I can run it on the alternators ,ie chill it down when returning to port ,shorepower at port ,or Geny at anchor eventually when domestic bank needs a boost .
Well that's the plan -it's being installed this week and I plan to nip down at W/E to view ( will take pics)
Here's the link I,am hoping up to 42,000 BTU (calc,s were around 20,000 ) should cope with July /August " tropical " heat in the Med at night and the whole thing just be a gentle breeze .
It's costing 2-3 X more than selfies .
http://www.frigomar.com/images/PDF/FRIGOMAR_chiller-inverter-DC_eng.pdf

These look like very interestings units.
only 2 amp start up current!
Continuously variable dc motors.

a/c catapulted into the 21 century!

when you say expensive, what sort of numbers are you talking about?

 

[Portofino]

I asked two Co,s ( yards ) in the SoF to basically install A/C -priortising low noise
They came back with selfie units one small one ( 8000btu ) under a bunk in the aft cabin ,and one larger one say 18,000 btu with split ducting sacrificing a considerable amount of storage space to place the unit - for the 2 spaces fwd of the engine room .
€ 8k -12K inc tax .With one € 5 K was labour! Eek .
So I contacted Sunseeker .Fr -they have an excellent tech dept ( in my Marina -handy ) .
They kindly reccomended a local guy they use for this kind of stuff a boat electrical engineer -he came along surveyed the boat and listened to how we plan to use it - reccomened this set up -chiller in the E room on 24 V inverter .
Cost will be around € 18 K with tax of which € 3 K is the labour .he,s gonna link up all the various systems to run it in the ways I have allready described
Also highly regarded in the sence leaves no mess ,very clean and works on SS bigger stuff with fussy owners etc .

You can buy selfies for around £ 1K each x3 then fitting kits and DiY for less than £ 5K -but to be honest I have not got the time or patience to pfaff ,and I did not want these anyhow .

 

[rustybarge]

I asked two Co,s ( yards ) in the SoF to basically install A/C -priortising low noise
They came back with selfie units one small one ( 8000btu ) under a bunk in the aft cabin ,and one larger one say 18,000 btu with split ducting sacrificing a considerable amount of storage space to place the unit - for the 2 spaces fwd of the engine room .
€ 8k -12K inc tax .With one € 5 K was labour! Eek .
So I contacted Sunseeker .Fr -they have an excellent tech dept ( in my Marina -handy ) .
They kindly reccomended a local guy they use for this kind of stuff a boat electrical engineer -he came along surveyed the boat and listened to how we plan to use it - reccomened this set up -chiller in the E room on 24 V inverter .
Cost will be around € 18 K with tax of which € 3 K is the labour .he,s gonna link up all the various systems to run it in the ways I have allready described
Also highly regarded in the sence leaves no mess ,very clean and works on SS bigger stuff with fussy owners etc .

You can buy selfies for around £ 1K each x3 then fitting kits and DiY for less than £ 5K -but to be honest I have not got the time or patience to pfaff ,and I did not want these anyhow .

i think the company is based in Genoa, so spares shouldn't be a problem.

thr cost of labour in France is verging on ludicrous, but then the social charges are enormous. It's expensive but you are getting the latest hi tech solution to Aircon and it should be super quiet in operation.

the installation will be tedious and difficult to squeeze in and the ducting a nightmare: I'm sure they'll earn their money.

 

[Deleted User YDKXO]

V interesting, portofino. The power consumption and current draw certainly seem to be v low. I have a 48,000 Btu Condaria chilled water unit on my boat and it often draws 30-35A compared to, it seems, a max of 10A for your Frigomar unit. I also like the fact that the compressor runs continuously; it's irritating the way the compressor cuts in and out on traditional units

Yup, if the Frigomar unit can really run off the batteries for extended periods, particularly if it could run at a low setting overnight, its a major step forward. Let us know how you get on with it in actual operation

 

[Portofino]

Thx it's a bit of a leap of faith -but site looks ok -seems a bit fwd thinking
http://www.frigomar.com/en/
I just was not really impressed with attempts from folks to peddle cruise air / marine air -trad American stuff .( nowt wrong with it BTW for those who,s boats came with it ) I,am after silence -just cool breeze coming out of the air handers
BTW sent the guy 75 % deposit prior to him ordering the kit at euro / Stering exchange around 1.5 a few weeks ago -but that was not planned .
As Med boaters will know in the hieght of the season in the marina its so hot that when we return from a day at anchor swimming etc ,first thing we tend to do is shorepower up - run the A/C -whereby the wife kids, guest all retreate inside to cool off -
So hopefully 1/2 hour out from base I will be able to start cooling it down .Or run it any time when we are motoring .?
Over and above using it at anchor @ night -nice to have -it seems to have an Eco function 4.5 A

 

[rustybarge]

Thx it's a bit of a leap of faith -but site looks ok -seems a bit fwd thinking
http://www.frigomar.com/en/
I just was not really impressed with attempts from folks to peddle cruise air / marine air -trad American stuff .( nowt wrong with it BTW for those who,s boats came with it ) I,am after silence -just cool breeze coming out of the air handers
BTW sent the guy 75 % deposit prior to him ordering the kit at euro / Stering exchange around 1.5 a few weeks ago -but that was not planned .
As Med boaters will know in the hieght of the season in the marina its so hot that when we return from a day at anchor swimming etc ,first thing we tend to do is shorepower up - run the A/C -whereby the wife kids, guest all retreate inside to cool off -
So hopefully 1/2 hour out from base I will be able to start cooling it down .Or run it any time when we are motoring .?
Over and above using it at anchor @ night -nice to have -it seems to have an Eco function 4.5 A

I think the eco function may come on automatically when other appliances are switched on; this reduces the high amperage load of the Aircon, and stops overloading the inverter.

 

[Deleted User YDKXO]

Over and above using it at anchor @ night -nice to have -it seems to have an Eco function 4.5 A

For me that would be the biggest advantage. Must admit that on a few occasions when anchored overnight, I have run the gennie all night to drive the aircon when it's been a bit steamy

I don't suppose you know the answer to this but do you reckon that the Frigomar unit could be substituted for an existing chiller unit but using the same air handlers and controls?

 

[rustybarge]

This might be a way of reducing your overnight amps load so you leave the Aircon operating on the batteries. ( presuming you wouldn't leave a propane fridge on while you sleep)

https://www.lehmans.com/p-3505-dometic-kerosene-refrigerator.aspx?show=all

 

[Portofino]

Would have thought so it only chills the water so any air handler( fan coil ) will accept cold water .

Controls -dunno ??
it's balancing actual cabin temp with desired temp via , fan speed , and the DC variable compressor speed -which is the water temp .Sensor in the cabins has to tell it how fast to run -I think ? If one space sets v cold and another " warmer " then the fan coils will play a more important role .Each space supposed to have the ability to have its own temp indipendant of the others -so I suspect a black box somewhere to sort it all out .


Your sensor I suspect ? will just start / stop the AC compressor allowing the chilled circulating water temp to respond
Suggest drop em an e-mail .
If the control panals are similar size then I guess could be swapped with or without rewire? Exsisting cabling could be used if yours has same or more wires -change the plugs / attachments ?-
Dunno-

 

[Portofino]

This might be a way of reducing your overnight amps load so you leave the Aircon operating on the batteries. ( presuming you wouldn't leave a propane fridge on while you sleep)

https://www.lehmans.com/p-3505-dometic-kerosene-refrigerator.aspx?show=all

We have two fridges both run off the Dom batteries and suppoes to auto shut down bellow whatever volts .
One a decent size under counter type in the galley like you might have under a work top at home .
Other is a small one in the cock pit under the helm seat with bottle racks in .The bottles that come out are frost white or soon get covered in hoar frost in humid times ,quite pain full to hold - your fingers start to stick to the beer bottle .
I think will prob turn that off at night at anchor and the galley thermostate down .
I,ll be happy for a 6 hr run on domestic from say midnight to 6 am . At anchor only with no breeze in high season
Prior to that at anchor we will run the Geny -need AC to cook , charge up Dom batteries and other minor AC charging stuff