muckypup
Well-Known Member
Anyone have any experience of a Nelson 40 from about 1973ish? I have found one which will fit my budget and status of beginner and was wondering if anyone had any (constructive) comments on these?
Steve
Steve
Nelson 40
- Thread starter muckypup
- Start date
Ifraser
Well-Known Member
not very constructive, but very envious, I'd love one of those...Iain
LeytonC
Well-Known Member
what engines?
muckypup
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
what engines?
[/ QUOTE ]
A pair of 200hp mermaids.
S.
what engines?
[/ QUOTE ]
A pair of 200hp mermaids.
S.
andyball
Well-Known Member
73'ish - you can sink a LOT of money into a Nelson of that age - we'd have loved one - but anything we looked at under £80K was horrible - needing all new windows, etc etc etc.
There's a cheap 34 on boatshed.com at present.
There's a cheap 34 on boatshed.com at present.
Talbot
Well-Known Member
Great sea boats, but perhaps not so comfortable inside as a modern plastic.
D
Deleted User YDKXO
Guest
Is that wood or grp? If wood, I would make very sure the structure is in A1 condition otherwise you could be commiting yourself to a lot of work. How about the engines. Are they original or replacements?
Otherwise any Nelson is going to be a good seaboat but they have such a good reputation that there wont be any about that are both sound and cheap
Otherwise any Nelson is going to be a good seaboat but they have such a good reputation that there wont be any about that are both sound and cheap
skint_git
New Member
Hi
Weve got one of these from about the same era. Is the boat you are looking at called "Lady Emma"? Just out of interest. Several points, at this age quite likely to have wood superstructure (ie above deck height) this needs to be checked carefully for water ingress particually at joints in ply sheets. Some have had glass fibre layer put over the wood. The other problem can be the wood hull badging where water gets behind it if not properly sealed to the hull.
Speed wise we get about 22 knots max. with two 225 fords giving maximum cruising around 19knots but in practice we tend to cruise at about 15 so they are not particually speedy if thats your thing. Have no idea as to fuel consumption as the fuel tanks have no working gauges. The only other advice is to get a really decent pair of windscreen wipers!/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
What else do you want to know.
Weve got one of these from about the same era. Is the boat you are looking at called "Lady Emma"? Just out of interest. Several points, at this age quite likely to have wood superstructure (ie above deck height) this needs to be checked carefully for water ingress particually at joints in ply sheets. Some have had glass fibre layer put over the wood. The other problem can be the wood hull badging where water gets behind it if not properly sealed to the hull.
Speed wise we get about 22 knots max. with two 225 fords giving maximum cruising around 19knots but in practice we tend to cruise at about 15 so they are not particually speedy if thats your thing. Have no idea as to fuel consumption as the fuel tanks have no working gauges. The only other advice is to get a really decent pair of windscreen wipers!/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
What else do you want to know.
steverow
Well-Known Member
Try and find out which yard she was built by.
Some are better then others, from that era probably Tylers being the best.
However, any 1973 boat is going to require a substantial financial input to update and maintain her, especially if she's going cheap, which as someone else said, Nelsons never are if they are sound.
Be prepared to spend about 8 to 10 grand a year over the next three to four years if you are taking it on as a project...more if you cant do much of the work yourself.
Can you give us a link to the boat??
I did my early boating in the seventies on a Nelson 40 called Miranda.
Great boat, but rather spartan and somewhat austere by todays standards.
Steve.
Some are better then others, from that era probably Tylers being the best.
However, any 1973 boat is going to require a substantial financial input to update and maintain her, especially if she's going cheap, which as someone else said, Nelsons never are if they are sound.
Be prepared to spend about 8 to 10 grand a year over the next three to four years if you are taking it on as a project...more if you cant do much of the work yourself.
Can you give us a link to the boat??
I did my early boating in the seventies on a Nelson 40 called Miranda.
Great boat, but rather spartan and somewhat austere by todays standards.
Steve.
muckypup
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
However, any 1973 boat is going to require a substantial financial input to update and maintain her, especially if she's going cheap, which as someone else said, Nelsons never are if they are sound.
Be prepared to spend about 8 to 10 grand a year over the next three to four years if you are taking it on as a project...more if you cant do much of the work yourself.
[/ QUOTE ]
What sort of running costs are going to take 8-10k per year? I understand that there will be the cost of upgrades (no holding tank, no gene, nav electronics out of date, no thrusters, no rib).
Steve
However, any 1973 boat is going to require a substantial financial input to update and maintain her, especially if she's going cheap, which as someone else said, Nelsons never are if they are sound.
Be prepared to spend about 8 to 10 grand a year over the next three to four years if you are taking it on as a project...more if you cant do much of the work yourself.
[/ QUOTE ]
What sort of running costs are going to take 8-10k per year? I understand that there will be the cost of upgrades (no holding tank, no gene, nav electronics out of date, no thrusters, no rib).
Steve
Magnum
RIP
[ QUOTE ]
What sort of running costs are going to take 8-10k per year? I understand that there will be the cost of upgrades (no holding tank, no gene, nav electronics out of date, no thrusters, no rib).
[/ QUOTE ]
Steve, have you priced those items up? If not you may be in for a shock.
What sort of running costs are going to take 8-10k per year? I understand that there will be the cost of upgrades (no holding tank, no gene, nav electronics out of date, no thrusters, no rib).
[/ QUOTE ]
Steve, have you priced those items up? If not you may be in for a shock.
muckypup
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
Steve, have you priced those items up? If not you may be in for a shock.
[/ QUOTE ]
I've seen... !
I think the holding tank & RIB would probably be the first buys, followed by thrusters (and I understand how expensive they are). The gene is a luxury, and the nav electronics while out of date will probably be perfectly ok for a while....
This is one of a few options I'm considering (including an Aqua Star 38 - more expensive, and a trader 39 - more expesive still)
Steve
Steve, have you priced those items up? If not you may be in for a shock.
[/ QUOTE ]
I've seen... !
I think the holding tank & RIB would probably be the first buys, followed by thrusters (and I understand how expensive they are). The gene is a luxury, and the nav electronics while out of date will probably be perfectly ok for a while....
This is one of a few options I'm considering (including an Aqua Star 38 - more expensive, and a trader 39 - more expesive still)
Steve
ClassicPlastic
Well-Known Member
Is it the one in North Wales?
Divemaster1
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
I've seen... !
I think the holding tank & RIB would probably be the first buys, followed by thrusters (and I understand how expensive they are). The gene is a luxury, and the nav electronics while out of date will probably be perfectly ok for a while....
This is one of a few options I'm considering (including an Aqua Star 38 - more expensive, and a trader 39 - more expesive still)
Steve
[/ QUOTE ]
guess that your running costs ought to include... Insurance, Mooring and fuel / service + once a year liftout...
Fuel cost can be calculated at approx 200 grammes per HP/hr @ 0.86 kg / L, so if you take out 150 HP, your fuel costs should be calculated to approx. 35 L /hr on each engine.
Other things on a older boat ... believe me several in here have experience with this ...
Watertank may start to leak .... not always easy to repair or replace
Waterpumps - old/tired
Water pipes - old /tired/rusty?
Electrics - 30 year old cables ... may require re-wiring and how old are the batteries...
Control Cables and steering - may require TLC and attention (hydraulics?)
Windows - water ingress
Electronics - may black out one day, so never sail relying compeltely on them
Engines .... 200 Mermaids ... probably not standard ... think that in the early 70's the Dover Block only got delivered up to 180... (Turbo and Intercooler). Great engine and easy to work on... but Turbo's may be tired... Bowman Cooler may be past it's best days ....
Yup TT designs are great seaboats ... but expect the ride to be wet, so rotating windscreen or proper paralell arm windscreen wipers ... pref with speed controls... are important...
Twin engines and this hull do not require Thruster ... no major drift, so that one would be WAY down my list of "nice to have's"
I've seen... !
I think the holding tank & RIB would probably be the first buys, followed by thrusters (and I understand how expensive they are). The gene is a luxury, and the nav electronics while out of date will probably be perfectly ok for a while....
This is one of a few options I'm considering (including an Aqua Star 38 - more expensive, and a trader 39 - more expesive still)
Steve
[/ QUOTE ]
guess that your running costs ought to include... Insurance, Mooring and fuel / service + once a year liftout...
Fuel cost can be calculated at approx 200 grammes per HP/hr @ 0.86 kg / L, so if you take out 150 HP, your fuel costs should be calculated to approx. 35 L /hr on each engine.
Other things on a older boat ... believe me several in here have experience with this ...
Watertank may start to leak .... not always easy to repair or replace
Waterpumps - old/tired
Water pipes - old /tired/rusty?
Electrics - 30 year old cables ... may require re-wiring and how old are the batteries...
Control Cables and steering - may require TLC and attention (hydraulics?)
Windows - water ingress
Electronics - may black out one day, so never sail relying compeltely on them
Engines .... 200 Mermaids ... probably not standard ... think that in the early 70's the Dover Block only got delivered up to 180... (Turbo and Intercooler). Great engine and easy to work on... but Turbo's may be tired... Bowman Cooler may be past it's best days ....
Yup TT designs are great seaboats ... but expect the ride to be wet, so rotating windscreen or proper paralell arm windscreen wipers ... pref with speed controls... are important...
Twin engines and this hull do not require Thruster ... no major drift, so that one would be WAY down my list of "nice to have's"
muckypup
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
Is it the one in North Wales?
[/ QUOTE ]
no, she is in Kent.
Is it the one in North Wales?
[/ QUOTE ]
no, she is in Kent.
Gludy
Well-Known Member
"Fuel cost can be calculated at approx 200 grammes per HP/hr @ 0.86 kg / L, so if you take out 150 HP, your fuel costs should be calculated to approx. 35 L /hr on each engine."
Is that based on a fairly high crusing speed or displacement speed?
Is that based on a fairly high crusing speed or displacement speed?
muckypup
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
guess that your running costs ought to include... Insurance, Mooring and fuel / service + once a year liftout...
[/ QUOTE ]
Yup... these are on the spreadsheet /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif
[ QUOTE ]
Fuel cost can be calculated at approx 200 grammes per HP/hr @ 0.86 kg / L, so if you take out 150 HP, your fuel costs should be calculated to approx. 35 L /hr on each engine.
[/ QUOTE ]
This seems very high for an SD boat running at sensible speed. 15gph seems more like planing boat consumption...
[ QUOTE ]
Other things on a older boat ... believe me several in here have experience with this ...
Watertank may start to leak .... not always easy to repair or replace
Waterpumps - old/tired
Water pipes - old /tired/rusty?
Electrics - 30 year old cables ... may require re-wiring and how old are the batteries...
Control Cables and steering - may require TLC and attention (hydraulics?)
Windows - water ingress
[/ QUOTE ]
Noted - Will investigate these...
[ QUOTE ]
Electronics - may black out one day, so never sail relying compeltely on them
[/ QUOTE ]
Learning the real way now in my Day Skipper course. Always have a backup GPS.
[ QUOTE ]
Engines .... 200 Mermaids ... probably not standard ... think that in the early 70's the Dover Block only got delivered up to 180... (Turbo and Intercooler). Great engine and easy to work on... but Turbo's may be tired... Bowman Cooler may be past it's best days ....
[/ QUOTE ]
Aparently it has new engines @ 400 hours and a recently epoxied hull.
[ QUOTE ]
Yup TT designs are great seaboats ... but expect the ride to be wet, so rotating windscreen or proper paralell arm windscreen wipers ... pref with speed controls... are important...
Twin engines and this hull do not require Thruster ... no major drift, so that one would be WAY down my list of "nice to have's"
[/ QUOTE ]
They would be try it and see items. Having been on a boat with bow and stern, I can see how easy it makes things - especially with a lock full of raggies...
Steve
guess that your running costs ought to include... Insurance, Mooring and fuel / service + once a year liftout...
[/ QUOTE ]
Yup... these are on the spreadsheet /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif
[ QUOTE ]
Fuel cost can be calculated at approx 200 grammes per HP/hr @ 0.86 kg / L, so if you take out 150 HP, your fuel costs should be calculated to approx. 35 L /hr on each engine.
[/ QUOTE ]
This seems very high for an SD boat running at sensible speed. 15gph seems more like planing boat consumption...
[ QUOTE ]
Other things on a older boat ... believe me several in here have experience with this ...
Watertank may start to leak .... not always easy to repair or replace
Waterpumps - old/tired
Water pipes - old /tired/rusty?
Electrics - 30 year old cables ... may require re-wiring and how old are the batteries...
Control Cables and steering - may require TLC and attention (hydraulics?)
Windows - water ingress
[/ QUOTE ]
Noted - Will investigate these...
[ QUOTE ]
Electronics - may black out one day, so never sail relying compeltely on them
[/ QUOTE ]
Learning the real way now in my Day Skipper course. Always have a backup GPS.
[ QUOTE ]
Engines .... 200 Mermaids ... probably not standard ... think that in the early 70's the Dover Block only got delivered up to 180... (Turbo and Intercooler). Great engine and easy to work on... but Turbo's may be tired... Bowman Cooler may be past it's best days ....
[/ QUOTE ]
Aparently it has new engines @ 400 hours and a recently epoxied hull.
[ QUOTE ]
Yup TT designs are great seaboats ... but expect the ride to be wet, so rotating windscreen or proper paralell arm windscreen wipers ... pref with speed controls... are important...
Twin engines and this hull do not require Thruster ... no major drift, so that one would be WAY down my list of "nice to have's"
[/ QUOTE ]
They would be try it and see items. Having been on a boat with bow and stern, I can see how easy it makes things - especially with a lock full of raggies...
Steve
muckypup
Well-Known Member
Actually, the first and most important thing to ensure is upto date is the safety equipment, such are fire extinguishers (auto for the engine bay), life jackets, flairs, lifeboat, gab bag etc. I would think this goes for any boat you buy.
Steve
Steve
Gludy
Well-Known Member
yep - top of that list should be the hull!!!
Divemaster1
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
Is that based on a fairly high crusing speed or displacement speed?
[/ QUOTE ]
Try engine load .... each engine at a given load (never mind speed and rpm) will have a consumption figure of approx 200 grammes of diesel per HP/hr....
Taking out a total of 300 hp on a SD boat wit a total of 400 hp available may not be the most efficient for fuel economy, but the calculation can be used as a rule of thumb... Each hull/engine/prop configuration will be different. You will need to look at the engine's load curve, or prop load curve to find out exactly what you take out of an engine at a given RPM....
Is that based on a fairly high crusing speed or displacement speed?
[/ QUOTE ]
Try engine load .... each engine at a given load (never mind speed and rpm) will have a consumption figure of approx 200 grammes of diesel per HP/hr....
Taking out a total of 300 hp on a SD boat wit a total of 400 hp available may not be the most efficient for fuel economy, but the calculation can be used as a rule of thumb... Each hull/engine/prop configuration will be different. You will need to look at the engine's load curve, or prop load curve to find out exactly what you take out of an engine at a given RPM....
