Near miss in Blackwater,

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millbeach

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Coming home from Brightlingsea on Sunday afternoon.( it was blowing 25 knots)
Stone sailing club dinghys , mostly with young children were racing across the channel.
One of there dinghys came right at me, lucky managed to jibe away, and only a side way scuff happened.no one was hurt i am pleased to say.
My point is WHY SAIL ACROSS THE CHANNEL ?
There was loads of clear water to the north and south of the channel,so why sail across it?
There so called "safety boats" done nothing to supervise these children.
If someone had been hurt, as an adult every one would point the finger at me.
Very angry at this, and will send email of complaint to Stone sailing club.
Also Blackwater sailing club do the same,
It beggers belief sometimes...:mad::mad:
 
Because they need to learn?
They also have as much right to set their courses as you have. I don't think you are in a directed or traffic separation zone, so you arent in a channel, just in a place where there happens to be more water for you to sail down.
If, as happened, there is a collision, it is the responsibility of the Skipper, in this case, a child, then radio the race officer or the safety, usually on Ch37. Not sure it needs to go to a letter, maybe you could have dealt with it then, a bit of a racing incident.
 
RivalRedwing said:
er.. millbeach wasn't racing
Click to expand...

No, but he can get the crashee chucked out of the race, and have reasonable redress through the Race Office.
I think its a bit formal to be doing this afterward.
I heard a boat do this on VHF to the races out of Mersea yesterday where he had to take avoiding action whilst on starboard with a racing cruiser on spinnaker un on port. The race boat was probably chucked out. Off Bradwell at the time.:p
 
It's the Cadet nationals at Stone (which i'm a member) this week so i'd guess they're competitive little buggers. :)

I've no idea of the rights and wrongs of this one, I just try and keep out the way when a race is on.
 
I agree, "every one has the right to learn"
But these children were in there care,
As children we all played in the street,
NOT ON THE MOTORWAY.
Why sail/race across bouyed channel?.
Answer me this, why did they not sail/race to the North or South of channel.
I must add, it was blowing 20 knot plus, opp Stone.
 
Whilst I have to agree, racing fleets crossing a deep water channel can be a bit aggravating, BUT trying to view this from both sides (I used to race dinghies from Brightlingsea for more years than I will ever admit to!) think of the following.

You are racing a dinghy, it is a glorious afternoon and a really good breeze...makes for an exciting race! You find that the Race Officer for the day has set a short 'close to' course. How do you feel? I would usually remonstrate with the PRO arguing the toss until such time as the race started and I missed the start OR he agreed to make it a longer course!

At the end of the day, dinghy sailors have every bit as much right to sail over the full width of the river as you have!

Chill out a bit, they are racing competitively and having bags of fun, you are cruising with nowhere to go in a hurry also having bags of fun. Think outside the box, alter YOUR course to take their stern...you will be surprised as many of these youngsters will smile, shout a thank you or give you a wave...end result two people feeling good about life as opposed to two people getting VERY stressed on a lovely afternoon!
 
Its not a motorway, thats being a bit dramatic. You were unfortunate enough to come across ONE that didnt quite meet the required standard, and so want to ban all of them from doing what has been happening on the river for generations. Close quarter boat handling is an essential part of it all.
As I said, its not a motorway, it is a buoyed channel which still does not confer rights or even define traffic direction. If you had to tack back and across that channel to reach your destination, would you be in the wrong?
Or do you believe that you should motor up and down the channel in a straight line to make it easy for everyone?
 
I will clarify, i was motor sailing.
I as an ex- dinghy sailer know myself the pitfulls of sailing.
I as a farther myself, i was shook up by what could have been a nasty incident.
Then again on this forum i am to blame.
As i said before, "the adult is always to blame"
 
millbeach said:
Coming home from Brightlingsea on Sunday afternoon.( it was blowing 25 knots)
Stone sailing club dinghys , mostly with young children were racing across the channel.
One of there dinghys came right at me, lucky managed to jibe away, and only a side way scuff happened.no one was hurt i am pleased to say.
My point is WHY SAIL ACROSS THE CHANNEL ?
There was loads of clear water to the north and south of the channel,so why sail across it?
There so called "safety boats" done nothing to supervise these children.
If someone had been hurt, as an adult every one would point the finger at me.
Very angry at this, and will send email of complaint to Stone sailing club.
Also Blackwater sailing club do the same,
It beggers belief sometimes...:mad::mad:
Click to expand...
This is the International Cadet UK Championships, so these sailors are generally not learners and usually highly skilled. Their idea of close quarters and ours are very different. Having said that, it's likely that many will be pond sailors so have limited experience of cruising yachts behaviour.
You may have come across a particularly bolshie kid or perhaps one having a lack of concentration, but this shouldn't be a reason to spoil his /hers and everyone else's week.
Setting fair courses for 100 boat fleets can be very trying for a committee and it's a thankless task. Did you have your radio on? patrol boats often call on 16 or 37 if they see yachts crossing a race area to advise or request caution.
It's quite an achievement for Stone SC to be able to hold the Cadet Nationals and it would be a great pity to sour this event with hasty complaints. Many of our current top sailors have originated from this class.
Is there actually a channel at Stone? I thought it was generally open water.
 
If you were motor sailing as you say, then you were the standoff boat and should have taken avoiding action, any collision was your fault motor gives way to sail.
 
millbeach said:
I will clarify, i was motor sailing.
I as an ex- dinghy sailer know myself the pitfulls of sailing.
I as a farther myself, i was shook up by what could have been a nasty incident.
Then again on this forum i am to blame.
As i said before, "the adult is always to blame"
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So if you were motor sailing, didnt the sailboat have right of way?
Unless you were claimed restricted draught and were flying the shape accordingly?
 
This has reminded me of an incident when my sprogs were doing the Cadet Nationals in Plymouth Sound.
The Pride of Bilbao ferry had to cross the race area and a patrol boat called her and asked her intentions so they could shepherd the racers away.
The Long Room [VTS] immediately came on and said do not contact shipping, that's our job. [The were very anti yachting in those days]
Captain of the ferry replied that it was a great pleasure to see so many young sailors enjoying sailing and complimented their skill, and I'm heading [whatever] at dead slow will be clear in 15 mins. Have a nice day. [ No reply from VTS]
If a huge ferry can cope with kids in dinghies, surely us yachties can?
 
All.
In regard to this post.
I did take avoiding action, which lead to a glancing on the dinghy in question.
I am fully aware, under motor that i am the stand off boat.
I always have my radio on.
The dinghy in question, done a complete u turn, i turned to port,so the dinghy only scuffed me.
Answer me this, why sail/race in approx 40 metres of channel when there is approx a mile of water across.
Be honest, this child could, i say Could have been hurt.
 
millbeach said:
All.
In regard to this post.
I did take avoiding action, which lead to a glancing on the dinghy in question.
I am fully aware, under motor that i am the stand off boat.
I always have my radio on.
The dinghy in question, done a complete u turn, i turned to port,so the dinghy only scuffed me.
Answer me this, why sail/race in approx 40 metres of channel when there is approx a mile of water across.
Be honest, this child could, i say Could have been hurt.
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The channel is more than 40 meters wide off Stone.

As a motorsailer you appear to be in the wrong.

So if a kid was legitimately sailing his course, and presumably a stream of others in front of and behind him doing the same thing, then you represent the danger, surely?

I know I wasnt actually where you awere, but it seems to me that you could have anticipated the whole fleet and threaded through them without incident, maybe by slowing down and letting them through.

I am sorry, but I just fail to see your point at all.
 
There is no point.
I cant be bothered.
I was there, so only i know what could have been a nasty bang.
On reflection, IT WAS ALL MY FAULT...
 
Your explanation seems to be a trifle confused for me to picture what happened.

1. Can you explain where the wind was coming from and the speed.

2. What point of sail was the dinghy on?

3. What was your course and speed and were you flying the daytime recognition signal for a vessel motor sailing?

4. When did you first observe the dinghy, what was the range and direction relative to your vessel?

Thanks in advance for your answers.
 
Not trying to upset anyone here but I think all this finger wagging about rights of way etc misses the point of the original post i.e. try and answer the question as to why courses are laid across areas of deep(er) water when there is a huge expanse nearby where deeper draught vessels will not be able to go but the participants will.
I would assume it is the duty of the Race Officer to minimise risk to all users in the first instance by not putting different users potentially in conflict. I mean, taking it to extremes would they set a course across a water ski area, ferry route etc.
 
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I really don't see the problem.

The Blackwater has got masses of space, and unless you have a pretty serious draft boat you would be unlikely to be put to any inconvenience by taking the stern of a boat racing.

At the end of the day, use of the water is free to all, and as long as you are using that space sensibly there should be no real issues!

Race officers have just as much right to set a course using the width of the river as the OP has to elect to Motor Sail right through a National Championship fleet!

It should improve boat handling skills all round!! ;)
 
There is risk of polarising views on the ECF which is not what we should be about, but hey, a good debate can be very healthy too. And I have to say I'm in agreement with Wingdiver especially when a 14 year old in a laser darts out from between the moorings opposite the Royal Arrich and shouts at me, " you idiot - I'm racing" as if my 5 tonne boat was suddenly going to leap out of his way as I drift upstream under sail at 3 noeuds. Must be even trickier with a 24 t boat?. Wolverstone is a crappy place to lay a course across the channel especially when the ferry or other coasters are about and manoeuvring room is a bit tight to get out of someone's way. Have to say the chaps in the racing keelboats are much more understanding and more appreciative if I can't get out of there way quick enough if there is too much river traffic about.

I certainly didn't think of complaining to the RHYC and just put it down to an inexperienced kid who nearly learnt the hard way about physics and inertia. ;)
 
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