Nav Lights and collision regs

benw

benw

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Have just purchased Sadler 32 which is fitted with deck level nav lights as well as tri colour top of mast with allround white anchor. Mast head not fitted but spotlight is.
I am confused re what lights to show when under motor. Any advice welcome.
 
Ok - at spreader height spotlight only. At deck level I have port starbd and aft white, atop the mast tri colour and all round white.
Can I use deck level and all round white at mast top when under motor? Thanks
 
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deck level lights for motor/motorsailing with steaming light,tricolour sailing,---allround white ONLY for anchoring.

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How about Rule 23(c)?

(i) A power driven vessel of less than 12 meters in length may in lieu of the lights prescribed in paragraph (a) of this Rule exhibit an all-round white light and sidelights.
 
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...all round white ONLY for anchoring.

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How about Rule 23(c)?

(i) A power driven vessel of less than 12 meters in length may in lieu of the lights prescribed in paragraph (a) of this Rule exhibit an all-round white light and sidelights.
 
You are right.
BUT the op and the majority of leisure water users ( as you will have experienced ) have no idea why the various lights and coll regs have an enormous importance.
Suggest keep it simple is the way
Basic is best
Turn every light on
keep going on your course because the learned will bottle before a collision.
Re OP
In the dark: don't care about your size or what you are doing just need to know where you are.
If motoring
White stern
Red and Green Side
White mast Light

Sailing
White Stern
Red and Green side

Then when you understand the rules better use your MH light etc.
I know I am being controversial but confusing lights are better than no lights
k
 
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You are right. But the majority of leisure users have no idea why the various lights and Coll Regs have an enormous importance. [ QUOTE ]


Because they haven't just returned cross-Channel with their eyes on stalks and their guts in a twist. And that's just he night watch - singlehanding is far worse!
Get some miles in and it might just dawn on them the importance of knowing who is what and where going.

Needless to say your advice to switch everything on is the pit of irresponsibility; that attitude can only accelerate legislation to prevent unqualified numpties from going to sea.

(Question: would that be such a bad thing?)
 
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[ QUOTE ]
You are right. But the majority of leisure users have no idea why the various lights and Coll Regs have an enormous importance. [ QUOTE ]


Because they haven't just returned cross-Channel with their eyes on stalks and their guts in a twist. And that's just he night watch - singlehanding is far worse!
Get some miles in and it might just dawn on them the importance of knowing who is what and where going.

Needless to say your advice to switch everything on is the pit of irresponsibility; that attitude can only accelerate legislation to prevent unqualified numpties from going to sea.

(Question: would that be such a bad thing?)

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What, in your opnion would be an acceptable qualification?
 
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Can I use deck level and all round white at mast top when under motor? Thanks

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I've done it when there was a problem with the steaming light. The downside is that the 'stern light' is at the masthead and when you're motoring up a river, for example, it's not where following boats are likely to look.

I wouldn't recommend it as a long-term solution even if you could argue it's technically correct under the col regs. You'd be better off getting a steaming light fitted.
 
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Can I use deck level bicolour and all round white at mast top when under motor? Thanks

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That's the standard arrangement on all Dragonflies as fitted at the factory. I've not heard of anyone having a problem or a rear shunt so far.
 
[ QUOTE ]
You are right.
BUT the op and the majority of leisure water users ( as you will have experienced ) have no idea why the various lights and coll regs have an enormous importance.
Suggest keep it simple is the way
Basic is best
Turn every light on
keep going on your course because the learned will bottle before a collision.



[/ QUOTE ]

What grotesquely stupid and irresponsible advice.
 
Cagey - your advise will confuse more people than help them! AND is TOTALLY incorrect. You MUST show the correct lights, which the majority of boaters do. All the correct information is easily available from several sources. If you had an accident with all your lights showing YOU will be held to blame. Youe suggestion of using a stern white lamp AND an all round white at masthead is WRONG. You do not need the all round white masthead lamp if you have a stern lamp.
 
Re: qualifications

"What, in your opinion would be an acceptable qualification? "

Sadly, my opinion is irrelevant because if that day comes, the RYA will be called on to dilute demands from our foreign neighbours whose standards are already quite restrictive, only to find that some Whitehall bureaucrat makes a decision with very little relation to reality.

This doesn' help the original poster - but he's learned that not all advice on this Forum is either erudite or rational!
 
The regs. say that you can have Port & Starbd. lights, a Stern white light and a mast Steaming light, usually at the spreader height or incorporated into a deck lamp. Alternatively you can have Port & Starbd. lights and an all round white masthead lamp, but this is not often seen in sailing boats that are motoring. I suggest you fit a steaming lamp and a stern lamp.
 
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keep going on your course because the learned will bottle before a collision

[/ QUOTE ]

What an irresponsible and moronic comment.

I do look forward to you testing the theory when you next see my vessel at night.

If you enjoy playing chicken with a 265000GRT tanker, you're welcome. I'll win, as I really won't be altering my course to put me on shallow ground or into other danger just to let you carry on in a straight line.
 
Quote: "What, in your opnion would be an acceptable qualification? "

Years ago the Rt Hon Edward Heath was a yachtsman, perhaps one ought to be a politician then before becoming a yachtsman?

Seriously - no qualifications, aren't we regulated enough already? It's the last great freesom and that is swiftly becoming eroded, please don't suggest hastening the process.

On the subject of lights, deck level P & S will be almost impossible to see at any distance as will a stern light at the same level. Unless inland waterway use sensibly the lights should be as large as you can practically fit, and the pattern set as high as you practically can, i.e. flybridge sides for P & S, proper masthead, stern on a jackstaff. After all, you WANT to be seen don't you? Not smuggling immigrants are you?

For raggies P & S on the shrouds if possible to increase visibility over a distance and proper masthead. An all round white is fine, so long as the proper arc of visibility of the P & S is maintained once the forward facing masthead is occulted abaft the beam the stern becomes visible anyway whilst both P & S are occulted.

That's my two pennies worth, I'll go back to sleep now!
 
You CAN use the all round white masthead light as a combined steaming and stern light but if you do, you must not also show a stern light or a steaming light as well unless you have a really big sailing vessel. Otherwise you will be showing a misleading light signal. I have done this as a "get you home fix".

I don't think there is any excuse for going to sea without the rudimentary knowledge of the Colregs, including basic lights if you're out after dusk.

As for "Turn every light on
keep going on your course because the learned will bottle before a collision." is downright dangerous.

If in doubt keep out of the ferkin way.
 
I have not read all the replies, in fact I have not read any of them, but you may find this diagram helpful in undersatnding the requirements as it shows all the legal combinations for a boat the size of yours.



Navigationlights.jpg
 
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