My Song - lost in transit

Re: The loss of a beautiful superyacht

AndrewfromFal said:
Said by whom to be in a bad condition?
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The article quoted by a couple of previous posters.

kof said:
Sorry but that's just rubbish. You're referring to the original translation which is BS. The boat was in perfect condition when loaded and is now wrecked (bad condition). It was due to race next week so how could it be in "bad condition"?
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Mandy Rice-Davies applies. What's your connection?
 
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Re: The loss of a beautiful superyacht

I understood the boat was in tip top condition. It was owned by fashion designer Loro Piano and was heading to the superyacht race in Porto Cervo (sponsored by his company) which it won last year.
 
Re: The loss of a beautiful superyacht

JumbleDuck said:
The article quoted by a couple of previous posters
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So not based on a primary source, just a miss translation of an article?

My Song has just done a successful regatta season in the Caribbean preceded by a transatlantic race. It has a full time crew and is owned by a guy who is vastly wealthy and can well afford to keep it in immaculate condition. What’s with all the conspiracy nonsense...
 
Re: The loss of a beautiful superyacht

This on gCaptain...

A full investigation into the cause of the incident has been launched, however the primary assessment is that the yacht’s cradle (owned and provided by the yacht, warrantied by the yacht for sea transport and assembled by the yacht’s crew) collapsed during the voyage from Palma to Genoa and subsequently resulted in the loss of MY SONG overboard. I will add that this is the initial assessment and is subject to confirmation in due course,” Holley said.
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That would explain a lot if it is true!
 
Re: The loss of a beautiful superyacht

No connection but I saw My Song about 6 weeks ago and it was in pristine condition. Also given that the owner is a very wealthy man I doubt the cost of maintaining a 2 year old boat keeps him up at night.

Don't get this willingness to jump conspiracy theory bandwagon.

JumbleDuck said:
The article quoted by a couple of previous posters.



Mandy Rice-Davies applies. What's your connection?
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Re: The loss of a beautiful superyacht

JumbleDuck said:
Do you have the original article so we can check the translation? I suspect that it said that weather conditions were forecast to be bad, hence the ship home.
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It was in the Maritime Bulletin article referred to in #12; which has now been amended to remove the phrase about the boat being in poor condition. The phrasing sentence itself reeked of google translate.
 
Re: The loss of a beautiful superyacht

+2 re Minn's and TQA's comments above - that really looks like a disaster waiting to happen.
She has a lifting keel, hence I think we can assume that a large proportion of her weight (approx. 100 tonnes) is being supported on the two transverse supports of the cradle. The keel weight is reported to be approx. 36 tonnes - I presume that the bulb on the keel would be resting on dunnage on the hatch cover.
Add in now those vertical lashing straps - for them to be even remotely effective they have to be tensioned up very tightly - greatly increasing the compressive loading on the cradle. Where are the diagonal lashing straps, especially transversely across the ship?
Add in now the centrifugal forces that the yacht will experience while perched high up above the hatch covers - that is a very long lever arm about the ship's centre of gravity.
Especially so when compared to if My Song had been transported (in the same cradle even) on one of DYT's yacht transport vessels, where the yacht is deep inside the ship, rather than sitting on top - a big difference.
And Brattingsborg is half the size of a typical yacht transport vessel - hence we can assume that for the storm that was encountered, her motions would be more lively.
Yet the blame is put squarely on the cradle, and the people who assembled it. I don't think this is very fair.
I think that one could argue that the cradle would not have been designed to cope with the sort of compressive loads that would typically arise from being used in such a manner (re the lack of diagonal lashings, highly tensioned vertical lashings, and a long lever arm about the ship's roll centre) - and these loads were then further amplified in the storm.
I am still baffled as to why they didn't use a dry dock type of ship - maybe they were all booked up?
 
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Re: The loss of a beautiful superyacht

Bajansailor said:
+2 re Minn's and TQA's comments above - that really looks like a disaster waiting to happen.
She has a lifting keel, hence I think we can assume that a large proportion of her weight (approx. 100 tonnes) is being supported on the two transverse supports of the cradle. The keel weight is reported to be approx. 36 tonnes - I presume that the bulb on the keel would be resting on dunnage on the hatch cover.
Add in now those vertical lashing straps - for them to be even remotely effective they have to be tensioned up very tightly - greatly increasing the compressive loading on the cradle. Where are the diagonal lashing straps, especially transversely across the ship?
Add in now the centrifugal forces that the yacht will experience while perched high up above the hatch covers - that is a very long lever arm about the ship's centre of gravity.
Especially so when compared to if My Song had been transported (in the same cradle even) on one of DYT's yacht transport vessels, where the yacht is deep inside the ship, rather than sitting on top - a big difference.
And Brattingsborg is half the size of a typical yacht transport vessel - hence we can assume that for the storm that was encountered, her motions would be more lively.
Yet the blame is put squarely on the cradle, and the people who assembled it. I don't think this is very fair.
I think that one could argue that the cradle would not have been designed to cope with the sort of compressive loads that would typically arise from being used in such a manner (re the lack of diagonal lashings, highly tensioned vertical lashings, and a long lever arm about the ship's roll centre) - and these loads were then further amplified in the storm.
I am still baffled as to why they didn't use a dry dock type of ship - maybe they were all booked up?
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Whilst you make some excellent technical points here which i would not argue with as i am far from a subject matter expert on the technicals of lashings and centrifugal forces, as a layman i would agree with what you say..

I will disagree with your inference that somehow the Brattingsborg is not appropriate to transport these yachts, and that it is "half the size of a typical yacht transport vessel". Float on float off vessels you refer to are very much NOT the "typical" method of transport for yachts of this type or on this route. That's before we consider the enormous difference in price.. (and i am sure we are taking hundreds of thousands of dollars difference here)

There are a number of grey areas in my mind about this incident and one thing for sure, the lawyers will be the ones getting rich here but please, lets move away from the suggestion that the Brattingsborg was not an appropriate vessel for this movement. She is an average sized MPP vessel that moves out of gauge cargo of much larger, heavier and higher cargoes on a regular basis.

Many factors lead to any incident and i have no doubt these will be investigated by the lawyers and insurers but i am sure they will be quick to discount the suggestion that somehow a 130m, 12,000 Dwt, MPP vessel that is less than 10 years old was not perfectly capable to transport such a load in any conditions that it might realistically expect to encounter.

The lashings and cradle design will i suspect be a main focus of attention and i am sure they will also look at the other yachts that remained on board to examine how they were lashed and secured by way of comparison. I am sure that the stow and lashing plan will be one of the first things on the table for review by all parties.
 
Re: The loss of a beautiful superyacht

TQA said:
The pic is from from Farevela, https://farevela.net/2019/05/28/le-foto-del-my-song-sul-cargo-prima-dellincidente/ , which is a nice close up of the cradle, and strapping, while still in port at the look of it.

That looks well under strength to me. Especially fore and aft. two vertical supports and some mostly vertical tie downs.

View attachment 78124
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That looks fine for a static support but as there is no for/aft bracing it would fall forward or aft if/when the ship pitched up and down.

Not surprised the boat fell of a pitching ship.
 
Re: The loss of a beautiful superyacht

z1ppy said:
Whilst you make some excellent technical points here which i would not argue with as i am far from a subject matter expert on the technicals of lashings and centrifugal forces, as a layman i would agree with what you say..

I will disagree with your inference that somehow the Brattingsborg is not appropriate to transport these yachts, and that it is "half the size of a typical yacht transport vessel". Float on float off vessels you refer to are very much NOT the "typical" method of transport for yachts of this type or on this route. That's before we consider the enormous difference in price.. (and i am sure we are taking hundreds of thousands of dollars difference here)

There are a number of grey areas in my mind about this incident and one thing for sure, the lawyers will be the ones getting rich here but please, lets move away from the suggestion that the Brattingsborg was not an appropriate vessel for this movement. She is an average sized MPP vessel that moves out of gauge cargo of much larger, heavier and higher cargoes on a regular basis.

Many factors lead to any incident and i have no doubt these will be investigated by the lawyers and insurers but i am sure they will be quick to discount the suggestion that somehow a 130m, 12,000 Dwt, MPP vessel that is less than 10 years old was not perfectly capable to transport such a load in any conditions that it might realistically expect to encounter.

The lashings and cradle design will i suspect be a main focus of attention and i am sure they will also look at the other yachts that remained on board to examine how they were lashed and secured by way of comparison. I am sure that the stow and lashing plan will be one of the first things on the table for review by all parties.
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Zippy, I was not trying to suggest that the Brattingsborg is not suitable for transporting yachts in general - far from it.
Sunsail used to (still do probably) use a similar sized general cargo ship to transport their 'average' size charter yachts between the Med and the Caribbean - for a few years twenty years ago we had On and Off-Hire surveys on these ships in St Vincent when they were loading and discharging there.
it used to be economic for them to send yachts out for the winter season, and then take them back for the summer.
And it probably still is - it makes a lot of sense to take vessels out of the Med in the winter, and out of the Caribbean in the summer.
Peters & May were the Managers then (and probably still are now) - they would fill the holds, and the hatch covers would be fairly tightly packed with average sized monohulls and cats.
And I never heard of any incidents arising as a result of this method of shipping.
It is a very much more complex ball game though when you are transporting a 40 metre 108 tonne yacht on the hatch covers, as opposed to a typical 12 - 15 metre yacht.
My Song's draft with the keel down is 7 m; I would guess it must be at least 4 m. with the keel up.
And her mast is in the region of 50 m. high.
Much higher centrifugal forces happening here when the ship is rolling!

And Float On / Float Off vessels are typically used on this route at this time of year - have a look at the Dockwise page.
https://www.yacht-transport.com/schedules/
This year they had three dock ships sailing from the Caribbean to Palma and Genoa in March and April.
Would it really cost 'hundreds of thousands' more to transport My Song on one of these vessels?
I am guessing that the Dockwise ships would have been preferred, but they were probably all booked up solid already when a decision was made to ship My Song.
 
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Re: The loss of a beautiful superyacht

A contributing factor could be the lightweight construction of My Song. With only 2 cradle supports set fairly central any strong downward force at bow and stern might distort the boat. There are stories of boats which had internal damage after well meaning deckies kept ratcheting up the tie downs.

Anyway the owner is a billionaire, the loss is pocket change to him. I bet he is already thinking of My Song 5
 
Re: The loss of a beautiful superyacht

That's a full carbon boat - would take a very strong deckie to bend it. Doubt structural failure of the boat was to blame - suspect it was the cradle that failed maybe because of pitching or leverage from the boat/rig. Suspect we'll find out eventually.

Loose change to the owner at the end of the day.

TQA said:
A contributing factor could be the lightweight construction of My Song. With only 2 cradle supports set fairly central any strong downward force at bow and stern might distort the boat. There are stories of boats which had internal damage after well meaning deckies kept ratcheting up the tie downs.

Anyway the owner is a billionaire, the loss is pocket change to him. I bet he is already thinking of My Song 5
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Re: The loss of a beautiful superyacht

TQA said:
The pic is from Farevela, https://farevela.net/2019/05/28/le-foto-del-my-song-sul-cargo-prima-dellincidente/ , which is a nice close up of the cradle, and strapping, while still in port at the look of it.

I am a rule of thumb engineer. That looks well under strength to me especially fore and aft. Two supports and mostly vertical ratchet straps.

View attachment 78123
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Lots of wild speculation and opinons in this thread from people who've probably never designed a structure in their lives.
 
Re: The loss of a beautiful superyacht

lw395 said:
Lots of wild speculation and opinons in this thread from people who've probably never designed a structure in their lives.
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Spot on. And all from one photo that doesn't show the full picture.

I think I'll wait and see what some grown-up has to say about it when they've actually looked into the facts.
 
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