My Prestige 560 is sinking (well not quite yet)

[Deleted User YDKXO]

Assuming that this size of boat can be lifted by crane, I’m sure that cranes register a load reading (for safety)
If it is 7T over this will certainly show.

All lifting cranes/hoists above a certain capacity should be fitted with a safe load indicator which usually gives an accurate indication of the weight of the load being lifted. That isnt the problem. The problem is knowing what the dry weight of the boat should be to compare it against. In my experience of machinery manufacturers, they never really know the accurate weight of the products they produce because the weight is usually only an estimate coming out of the CAD design process. And with grp boats the manufacturing process can easily add actual weight over the design weight as can, of course, extra equipment, owners belongings etc etc

 

[jrudge]

Assuming that this size of boat can be lifted by crane, I’m sure that cranes register a load reading (for safety)
If it is 7T over this will certainly show.

I did say that in post 3!

No reply from op

 

[MapisM]

No reply from op

I was thinking the same.
If the history of his previous 6 posts is anything to go by, we might not hear from him till the season end...
Which is a pity: I for one would be curious to hear about his findings.
Whatever the reason for such major differences, it shouldn't take rocket science to find it, I reckon.

 

[longjohnsilver]

I always find it difficult to agree with with 'real' Mechanical Engineers cos they always spoil a good story but , for once, I agree with Deleted User. Pictures in Post 1 are comparing Apples and Pears although the OP believes his boat is settling lower in water.

Loads of reasons to check other things first :-
1) Salinity does increase with heat -- and its been kin cold in Antibes recently.
2) Snow melt does reduce salinity at this time of year in that area.
3) My wife can load more stuff on a boat than former Mech Engineers bits & pieces ( and that's a lot).
4) Im not sure that id spend too much money without thoroughly investigating the obvious' potential solutions to the real problem.

- Props - Antonio (the diver) will do a you a dive for you and clean them / tell you how bad they are. Others will tell you his current rate.
- Growth is a matter of fact and only you know its current state -- I remember one boat there that wouldn't plane without a clean almost every time it went out.
- How much fuel / water / Black Tank are you carrying .
- Different fuel / the bug
- Extraneous water that's built up in scuppers etc over winter

Just saying --- but I know nothing. Hope it isn't anything more than the normal joys of boating.

I expect he’s added underwater lights - it’s that extra weight that’s caused the issue

 

[Portofino]

I expect he’s added underwater lights - it’s that extra weight that’s caused the issue

Well yesterday I was gonna ask .....
To the OP .
Have you had fitted underwater lights , if so factory or aftermarket?
On the basis a hole is a hole and gob or mastic ( skia whatever) is just gob and operator technique sensitive .
Of course rain water from above ( already mentioned ) from hole (s) . But that a lot of rain .
We need the past 12/18 months of hole drilling history or and other DIY .

But my € are still on an underwater leak and structural hidden hull soak up .

 

[danvan]

Wow - thanks so much everyone for your views on the problem.

The hull was anti fouled 10 weeks ago - things seem to grow quickly down on the med! It's not the platform as this is hollow (checked that), and also checked for fuel bug / fuel filters etc. The photo was taken with empty water tanks and 60% fuel.

I'm back down in Antibes next week and will be looking through all the other suggestions to see if I can work this one out - with the fall back of taking her out in due course and getting a decent surveyor instructed to moisture test etc!

Thanks again everyone though - seriously very much appreciated.

 

[jrudge]

I use a diver as opposed to a lift if I want a clean as it is much cheaper. Lift and return here is e2000! Lift and hold half price.

If the lift can tell you weight then a lift spray off and return will give it a clean bum and tell you the weight and both are really the starting point if you are 100% it is lover this year than last ( your boat not compared to others).

 

[Jamesbprestige]

Hi everyone,

I have a Prestige 560 moored in Port Vauban in Antibes which I purchased new from Ancasta in 2017, which has Cummins zeus pods.

Whilst the boat literature suggests a top speed in excess of 30kn is achievable, in real life over the past 2 years I've basically achieved 28kn day in and day out. However so far this year I'm only getting to 23kn, and the max revs has fallen from 3030rmp to 2800rpm.

The Cummins engineers have checked the engine and reported it is in fine condition though when they did the service, they actually replaced one of the pods (under warranty). The only thing they can think about is that the boat is sitting heavy in the water - the photo below shows my exhaust half under water (the other photos is of another 560 with the exhaust in the right location).

However no-one can work out why the boat is lower in the water this year to last. FYI when this photo was taken (on Monday) the water tanks were completely empty and fuel at 60% - even when the water tanks were full last year the exhaust was always way above the water. There is also no water in the bilges. The boat doesn't have any new toys added this year, in fact we removed the 280kg tender when we took the photo.

I'd be really grateful if anyone has any ideas on what could be making the boat sink - Ancasta in the UK are being really helpful - but Prestige are not........(their only idea so far is to change the propellors at a cost of >10,000!)

Thanks very much in advance.


View attachment 77971View attachment 77972

What was the problem ?

 

[truro expat]

I had a Jeanneau 36 Prestige fly and had a big hull problem, we never took on water but it started delaminating and had to have the whole hull repaired. I would not buy another Jeanneau as would want to risk poor build quality, I was told if mine had gone worse with out action we would start to absorb water and sink eventually?

 

[Portofino]

Never been a fan of cored hulls below the WL .
Any sandwich relies on the “ butter “ to bind it together.
Thats the glue / bond in this case .Then the actual core material .Not just it’s water absorbency ability or not as the case may be but it’s distribution , ie voids .Voids deliberate air gaps etc .
Don’t get me going on liners either .

So what do you need I hear you all ask .
A gel coat followed by glass resin impregnated with glass Matt .The glass Matt can be what ever mixed and matched hand layered up .Fibres , strips , sheets , chopped strands what ever .Nice hardwood , aluminium or carbon fibre reinforcement supports all glassed and tabled in .But basically a solid slowly cured glass fibre / resin hull .All hand layered .
The disadvantages of ^^^ is its Labour + material intensive and you end up with a heavy hull .This means a drop in performance unless you upscale the engines which is doable but very soon the boat appears very expensive next to the equivalent cored boat at the boat show .

If you need to feel to speed things up in a meeting demand production wise kinda way , because orders are flowing in from the sales team .
Then go down the vac bag route clear resin used and none water absorbing cores .
Clear so you can pick out infusion defects and easily rectify ( by hand btw ) before final painting .
This makes a lighter but strong enough hull which can be shoved around with smaller ( aKa cheaper ) engines and supporting equipment eg smaller tanks , shafts props etc …….and thus be priced in at boat shows .

Bit like my earlier rows on here re skirting at boat shows .You the forum tell me nobody’s interested in hull form the deadrise etc .
Well I was and still am .
Then the U.K. boat show favourite at SIBS where by they tape off the ER hatch ……you are not allowed in I was told ?
It’s the first place I go the ER to suss out the gen build integrity or turned around the penny pinching .
Then the construction……..this core , liner , thingy.
Then the gen Hp …..prefer as much as possible they can do .That normally rules out IPS for me .

Then after all that I might take a view of the griddle , the fridge(s) , the owners cabin etc etc .

Rant over .
It really is the Wild West out there at shows .

 

[PowerYachtBlog]

After seeing a lot of posts, if one cares for his investment an easy check would be to lift and scan survey humidity level after about a week.

I cannot really understand how someone with a boat costing a million plus asks a question in a forum before doing the above.
If one does not want to spend any $$$ the first thing to do is to stay away from this hobby, which is possibly the most nice hobby of it all but is also one of the most costly that exist.

Beneteau's are known of soaking water, I was selling a GT44 two years ago it took 6 weeks to become zero dry after being only 7 months in the water.
On the contrary I had a Pershing 43 which was bone dry in 48 hours and 20 months in the water. Both boats had no Epoxy protection.

 

[Portofino]

It’s because builder particularly French can and do get away with it .
Weight is a killer in a sail boat performance wise so they migrated to lightness for this .Cheapness ie profit came later once buyers were hooked on the extra performance over say a Hallberg Rassey size equivalent.
They just carried on with balsa cores + other materials when they waded into the mo Bo market .
As said light weight brings the smaller HP engine savings .Let’s face it in a mobo the motors can be the most expensive component .So if you can knock off 10 s or 100s of thousands off the machinery side of the cost you are quids in .

How ever in defence of buyers as I said earlier build is all pushed down away out of sight at shows the “ wow “ is the mid cabins and with IPS the joy stick parking etc

It’s even more absurd in the Med with typical Med use as most of the time is spent outside in the outside spaces .
Ok there are few 1% exceptions who winter on board but 70 % just do June to Oct .A lot lift and hanger in the winter anyhow even 20-24 M FBs like San Lorenzo s , and of course big sports cruisers like Riva s Itama , Otams , Magnums , Baia , S/Skr Preditors .
All ^^^ sports cruisers with trad shafts/ Arnesons and big engines to shift them cruise mid thirties and top out near or above 40 knots . You don’t have to get any where near max rpms btw .I cruise around 1760 rpm ( wot 2150 ) never see 2000 don’t need to .
Thats my choice because I can .I don’t have to screw the nuts off the motors .
Fat lot of good a mid cabin is when the owners are wintering in a alpine ski resort , or 8uggered off to the Caribbean for Xmas .
.I mean a few years ago we ( the new boat industry) went through sharp furniture edges and no fiddles “ Kelly Hoppen “ interiors etc .We ( the forum ) collectively called that out .But it’s not stopped folks buying them .Just because they all do sharp edges does not mean it’s right as just because a lot do cored hulls or every French builder does equally means it’s not right .
Shop else where !
As I said it’s the Wild West out there at shows .Anything goes .
Is it because todays buyer is less technically minded ?
I mean who would tackle a IPS boat ? In terms of what could go wrong out of warranty .
Same with vast acreage of bonded glass ……Fix those leaks and / or glass cracks when normal hull flexing runs it’s course .Or after a few lifts .Oh Yeh two straps on a hoist are no substitute for the hull sat in the water in terms of distribution of flexing forces .
Does any one at a show ever question about lifting ? Erh Nope !
Does anyone ever think about lifting and blocking the thing off ? Erh Nope .

 

[Mark62]

I know it’s several years later but I’d love to know what the outcome was. I’m having similar issues with my prestige 620

 

[Seastoke]

I know it’s several years later but I’d love to know what the outcome was. I’m having similar issues with my prestige 620

You will be able to send him a pm .

 

[Mark62]

? I just joined