Mr Birt and Gridlocked Britain

[Guest]

Could commercial coasting make a comeback in view of future prospects on our roads ?

It seems to me that lorries are causing most of the problems due to cheapness and a very powerful lobby that this government fears.

It was nice to hear that on the East Coast, a spar maker in Brightlingsea recently used a ballast barge to transport a large mast to the South Coast.

Unlike many countries we have an enormous plus as a coastal race Could it be that the unboating public are just unaware of this resource ?

 

[Jeremy_W]

For all his "blue sky thinking" Mr Birt seems to be trundling down the tried and failed route. I am certain that the unboating public are unaware of the possibility of using coastal shipping or canals.

 

[david_e]

All those years at the Beeb must be tremendous experience for sorting out the nation's roads. It is re-assuring to know that the great success achieved at the beeb will be reflected on our roads. So while they have lost the main sporting events etc by not imposing pay charges, will he manage to lose the traffic whilst not imposing road tolls?

Jobs for the boys.

 

[tony_brighton]

Perhaps canals will make a commercial come-back? Cheap per mile costs but slow; and you need to be based near a canal!

 

[Guest]

You have brought up a very interesting topic, in the area of increasing coastal and inland waterway traffic. Here in the Channel Islands we have had to rely on freight coming to the Islands by sea since my family came here in 1172 from Normandy.

There is no reason at all why goods/freight have to get from A to B in the shortest time possible. Perhaps the days have gone when the manufacturer would load his goods on to a barge moored to the adjoining canal, to be taken to the nearest coastal port for transhipment to wherever. However, a similar system could be adopted for many reasons. We are seeing the cleaning up of old canals and with today's technology this could be taken a step further. Coastal shipping could be increased, not just with the coasters, but RO-RO as well around the UK's water highways.

Rejuvinating a whole industry that went to sleep in the early 60's would eleviate many social and economic problems that the UK is and will be facing. This vision, as yet, has been missed by the "Think Tanks" and freight transport policy makers. The investment is there and it comes under the heading of economic and sustainable development.

Since 1972 I have been creating major projects, that eventually obtain World Bank and IMF Funding for the developing countries concerned. As my company is an official participating institution of United Nations Environment Programme there is a laid down criteria for identifying a Third World developing country. It is common knowledge that when this criteria is placed against the UK, it was shown that in the 70's the UK was one such country, but today it is now an emerging one. The country is going backwards. Unfortunately, the UK has to depend on EU Funding for economic development, and that is in competition with other Member States.

The time has surely come, in some other context, to lobby for the rebirth of a coastal and inland waterway freight and transport system.

 

[Guest]

Does anybody remember the project to build a fleet of sailing cargo vessels to carry Cornish mine waste to Foulness (?), the site of a proposed 3rd London airport? No return cargo, though, so they would have sailed light against the prevailing winds; and then the airport wasn't built. Neither were the ships.

 

[Gordonmc]

There are some signs its happening... but I wonder if the MCA and DTI are aware of the benefits of building up coastal trade. The amount of regulation seems to indicate not.
One or two good signs... ABP introduced Timberlink to the West Coast of Scotland shifting thousands of lorry journeys onto log carrying coasters. In Glasgow huge granaries are being demolished... and thousands of tens of concrete and brick are being shifted by boat.
A small start?

 

[mtb]

Re:Lincolnshire still is 3rd world

The huge cost re pilotage light duties and tugs is prohibitive to induce trade.
The yard that I got my tug from ( went into liquidation !! )
Had to pay over £900.00 for the Boston tug to tow ships out then there's the pilots fees light duties .
Cost of shipping !!!!

These cost are also along with the problems of unloading and so on .
Compare this to running a small fleet of lorrys that would also still be needed to move the goods from port to customer !!!

I agree its a good way of helping the crisis on the roads and would work if and only if the inferstructure was put in place to keep it both efficient and cost effective.

Mick

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/boats
I want a big steel ex trawler / tug v / cheap or swap for tug

 

[Guest]

Re:Lincolnshire still is 3rd world

In essence that's right. Lateral thinking, if you forgive me, will allow the authorities concerned to research this thoroughly as this is on another level but using what is already there as the basis for the inferstructure. When I carry out an enviromental audit that will include the socioeconomic aspects, for a country as a whole to reorganise a whole industry, every aspect of it comes under scrutiny. It is only at this point that we can then take each individual aspect into account.

I am using a professional opinion here in my comments, but will or do the politicians want to see change for a coastal/inland waterways freight/transportation plan?

 

[pugwash]

I live and work overlooking the tidal Thames in west London. I don't suppose I see any sort of commercial vessel (apart from sightseeing boats) more often than once a month. My office wall is thick the with old pictures of barges and coasters that crowded these very waters a century ago. Such a waste of a great resource.

 

[hlb]

Re: In The Beginning.

God created the seas, the rivers and the land. But the land was all bumpy and boggy. God in his wisdom, had not thought to build a truck. So it came to pass. That all goods that could. Went by water. And where there was no water, they built canals. But then some one called Stevenson. Built a rocket. Not your average rocket, but one that traveled on rails. So the canals, having just been built. Were hardly used. Because the trains could go much faster and carry more goods than the boats. But then someone invented tarmacadam. And made the roads all flat. Nuther bloke came along and invented a truck. Now the truck did not carry as much as the train or the boat. But it could go anywhere. Door to door. But neither the train or the boat could. So still needed the truck to first take goods to the boat or train. Then run round to the other end to take them off again. Then trucks got bigger and faster. So could go any where in the country faster and cheaper, than running back and forth to station or port. So hence forth nearly all goods go by road. A helicopter or balloon would be better IMHO. But untill then------------??

No one can force me to come here-----------
----- I'm a Volunteer!!!

Haydn

 

[Rowana]

There is reason to believe that the commercial guys are also seeing the benefit of sea transport. A new ferry service has just started from Rosyth on the Firth of Forth to the continent this week. This hopefully will take lorries direct, and save them having to drive to the south coast. You poor folks down there will be saved the rumblings and pollution.
It is also worth noting that since Mr Brown has increased the road tax on lorries, many of the transport firms now register their lorries in Holland. I see quite a few here in Aberdeen with Dutch plates, and HMT is getting the square root of sod all in road tax!

 

[pugwash]

Well said! nm

x

 

[bedouin]

A couple of years ago I used to work overlooking the Thames by London Bridge. There are a few regular commercial users of that stretch - the most frequent are barges carrying what I assume to be rubbish down to a landfill somewhere.

 

[heerenleed]

Careful now because

your wishes might be granted!

Living aboard in the Netherlands, and sailing mostly in the Dutch South-West except during holidays, we are confronted with massive commercial shipping. Of course, we have a complete network of inland waterways so the infrastructure is there. But did it occur to you that, with increasing commercial shipping, there will be less and less room for us yachties? The landlubbing authorities will pester you with ever more regulations because they feel that you are not entiltled to any rights as your sailing is just for fun.

In the Netherlands we have to strengthen the sailing lobby by trying to convince the authorities that, from an economical point of view, yachting has grown more important than the complete commercial inland shipping and the fishing industry together. As far as yet it did'nt do us much good. Examples: no more tacking in wide and important waterways like Hollands Diep, Volkerak, Merwede and Nieuwe Maas, obligation to keep your engine standby if you insist on sailing (they seem to think that sailing is ridiculous); more congestion at important locks where commercial shipping is often let through first, filling up the locks very quickly; bridges won't open just for yachts anymore, you'll have to wait until a commercial barge comes through. Need I say more?

Just let road traffic block the motorways. Nothing is better than passing through an opened bridge seeing the jam caused on the motorway high above. Expecially in hot weather!

happy sailing

Peter a/b SV Heerenleed, Steenbergen, Netherlands

 

[DanTribe]

Re: Careful now because

On the quayside in Dordrecht there is a sign board with diagrams of the passing types of ship and the equivalent number of lorries needed to carry their cargoes.The volume of goods carried is amazing.
In your post you say that you should not tack in the Volkerak or Hollands Diep.
Is that correct, have I been breaking rules?
Dan

 

[Guest]

Anything that takes lorries off the roads is just fine by me, since some bastard pulling out without looking on the M25 just came pretty close to sending my partner and myself to the great yacht haven in the sky, wrote off my beautiful car, drove into the sunset completely insensible of the spinning vehicle in the rear view mirror and prevented me seeing the restoration work being done on my boat.

On a lighter note, and thinking about yachting, having been on the canals recently (it was lovely - mooring by pulling the boat in sideways by rope, like walking the dog) I wouldn't take a non-canal boat anywhere near them - those great steel narrowboats whack each other with complete and utter impunity. It would be like floating around in a cracked eggshell. Or perhaps I'm just sensitive about collisions.

On a lighter note again, Pugwash - that sounds like home, I reckon you're based pretty near me...<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1>Edited by The_Fruitbat on Wed May 22 22:41:32 2002 (server time).</FONT></P>

 

[heerenleed]

Re: Careful now because

Yes, you probably have. But then, so does everybody. There has been a ban on tacking for more waterways then the ones I mentioned. There's also Nieuwe Merwede, there's the R. Amer and some more. But they have lifted the ban on some waterways, and anyway, the police some to close an eye on it. Just look what the others are doing and you'll be allright.

And yes, I know that water transport would lighten the road traffic. But it would cause more problems for our sailing lot. So that's why I'm not very much in favour.

happy sailing

Peter a/b SV Heerenleed, Steenbergen, Netherlands

 

[oldgit]

Sporting events good riddence .You want to watch it you pay for it.

My wife reckons I spend to much time on here.

 

[halcyon]

Uptill around 1990 all the coal, timber, cement and oil was delivered to Falmouth by sea for local distribution, now it's all by road. Now all the wharfs have gone, and the artics hit the iron bridge on Goss Moor closing the A30 every other week.



Brian