Moving the engine back to engage the saildrive

[Martin_J]

Next question... Does the engine really need lifting more than a fraction to enable it to slide?

If the engine bearers are parallel to the splined shaft (when viewed side on), then sliding the engine forward/back without changing it's height or angle should be all that's needed.

Are engine bearers usually parallel to the shaft (when looking side on)? I'm sure they are on mine unless I was just lucky.

The other reason for the forward leg face not being parallel to the rear of the engine could be that the forward face of the leg was lifted a bit.. Is the leg in the photo by any chance being supported from below with a chock that's slightly too high?

 

[Alex_Blackwood]

Next question... Does the engine really need lifting more than a fraction to enable it to slide?

If the engine bearers are parallel to the splined shaft (when viewed side on), then sliding the engine forward/back without changing it's height or angle should be all that's needed.

Are engine bearers usually parallel to the shaft (when looking side on)? I'm sure they are on mine unless I was just lucky.

The other reason for the forward leg face not being parallel to the rear of the engine could be that the forward face of the leg was lifted a bit.. Is the leg in the photo by any chance being supported from below with a chock that's slightly too high?

The engine bearers are resilient mounts and will move a little. No?

 

[Halo]

Daft question but have you put some oil or diesel to lubricate the process?
Any way you could slide some thin steel or tin under the feet to help it move then pull it out after?

 

[Martin_J]

Daft question but have you put some oil or diesel to lubricate the process?
Any way you could slide some thin steel or tin under the feet to help it move then pull it out after?

Those cheap HDPE chopping boards are slippery and available in either thick or thin versions..

 

[Martin_J]

The engine bearers are resilient mounts and will move a little. No?

I was expecting the engine and saildrive to be mounted on something similar to the moulding shown below...



In this case the mount surfaces look to be parallel to the saildrive diaphragm ring, thus no real lifting would be required (but the rear of this engine and the forward face of the leg do need supporting as they're separated).

 

[Alex_Blackwood]

I was expecting the engine and saildrive to be mounted on something similar to the moulding shown below...

View attachment 152991

In this case the mount surfaces look to be parallel to the saildrive diaphragm ring, thus no real lifting would be required (but the rear of this engine and the forward face of the leg do need supporting as they're separated).

If the attachment in #8 is the engine then the mounts just under the injector pumps will flex.

 

[Tranona]

It is indeed - see the photo in post#8. Standard Bavaria/Volvo bed bonded into the hull. .

My guess is the leg is propped up too high at the front, Support at the rear of the engine is required to keep it level because it pivots on the 2 forward mounts (the third mount is on the back of the gearbox. If both the engine and gearbox are level it will just slide back with perhaps a slight turn on the crank (or prop if installed) to line up the splines.

This brings back horrid memories of trying to line up an MGB engine with the box in the car!

 

[Tranona]

If the attachment in #8 is the engine then the mounts just under the injector pumps will flex.

That os not necessary. Just need to get the engine and the gearbox lined up and the engine slides back until the shaft engages.

Problem is (as in my MGB example) you get to the point that you have got them close, and bolts in when the 2 are not in alignment and no amount of waggling and forcing, or drawing in with the bolts will do it. You have to write off the 3 hours of huffing and puffing and take the engine forward to start again.

 

[MagicalArmchair]

All that trouble to replace a diaphragm that was probably good for another ten years.
Not saying you did the wrong thing, but it's annoying that Volvo don't publish some real life data on that part

Quite right! The diaphragm that is ten years old has some very mild crazing, but is completely fine. I have read in hotter climates it fails quicker, but at these latitudes they will easily last 20 years. I would have left mine, however there was rusting around the sealing ring that made me nervous. Also, I didn't like the idea of having a part that Volvo stipulate must be changed every seven years, ten years old in my boat.

The positive from changing it was the previous engineer that changed the diaphragm had NOT used anything between the (stainless) machine screws and the aluminum body of the saildrive. Some of the holes had some significant galvanic corrosion, and if I hadn't have changed the diaphragm, I wouldn't have spotted it. On reconstruction I have used TefGel to insulate the machine screws from the aluminum body.

Note, in this quite awesome write up from Sailing Britaily he doesn't use anything either between the machine screws and the body.

Serious question. Is it good to lift an engine, using an airbag, by its sump?

I did some reading around this, and I think we are okay. We are only supporting perhaps a third, at most a half of the 250kgs, and if we spread with a plank of wood ABOVE the back to avoid spot loading, I am relatively relaxed about the forces on the bottom of the sum (so long as I avoid all fittings like the oil drain pipe!)

That os not necessary. Just need to get the engine and the gearbox lined up and the engine slides back until the shaft engages.

Problem is (as in my MGB example) you get to the point that you have got them close, and bolts in when the 2 are not in alignment and no amount of waggling and forcing, or drawing in with the bolts will do it. You have to write off the 3 hours of huffing and puffing and take the engine forward to start again.

I don't think I'll need to move it that far forwards again, but certainly a little way. Nevermind! All part of the adventure... didn't feel that way as the rain started on Saturday

 

[Laser310]

I was expecting the engine and saildrive to be mounted on something similar to the moulding shown below...

View attachment 152991

In this case the mount surfaces look to be parallel to the saildrive diaphragm ring, thus no real lifting would be required (but the rear of this engine and the forward face of the leg do need supporting as they're separated).

i am pretty sure this is what I have with my Volvo in a French-built J-Boat.

if there is enough "runway" on that to slide the engine enough to disengage it from the sail drive, then maybe it doesn't have to be lifted ...

I bought my boat used, so I don't know that it has never been replaced.., but I would guess it hasn't.

The boat is from 2007, so 16 years more or less. The gasket looks okay.., to the extent that I can see it.

I'd feel better with a new one though.

 

[Daydream believer]

I only have a much lighter MD 2020. However, I was on my own & whilst I was able to pack the engine up high on pieces of 18mm ply I could not stop the saildrive from tipping such that the shaft was pointing downwards.
i solved that by putting a load strap around the front of the keel & round the sail drive. I slowly ratcheted it up & this gradually pulled the saildrive verticall as it pivoted against the mounting at the rear inside.
Once the shaft was level the engine just slid back using a nail bar against the engine bearers.
I would not have tried to force it by using the bolts as suggested by the OP. The shaft only engages by a small amount & there is every chance that in the OP's case it has not actually engaged yet.

 

[Martin_J]

I only have a much lighter MD 2020. However, I was on my own & whilst I was able to pack the engine up high on pieces of 18mm ply I could not stop the saildrive from tipping such that the shaft was pointing downwards.
i solved that by putting a load strap around the front of the keel & round the sail drive. I slowly ratcheted it up & this gradually pulled the saildrive verticall as it pivoted against the mounting at the rear inside.

Just for next time you do the job, there are a pair of holes in the forward sides of the upper leg into which you can insert a couple of rods (which can then be supported on blocks of wood), arrowed below...



I used 8mm threaded rod with duct tape to bulk the ends out, but you get the idea I hope.

 

[MagicalArmchair]

Just for next time you do the job, there are a pair of holes in the forward sides of the upper leg into which you can insert a couple of rods (which can then be supported on blocks of wood), arrowed below...

I used 8mm threaded rod with duct tape to bulk the ends out, but you get the idea I hope.

Thanks Martin! I did heed your advice previously, I lined up my 12mm rod, and 100mm block as below:

And as per the instructions:

However, 100mm seemed far too low. Once this is all mounted up, I'll put the bars back in and measure how high those blocks should be in reality - another learning from doing the job myself!

 

[Martin_J]

My blocks now have a sloping top face... after, as you say the original blocks were too short.

Nice clear photo by the way.

 

[Boater Sam]

I don't think that you have had much practice refitting gearboxes on cars. You have to get the gap between the box and the engine equal all round , sideways and top and bottom.

It looks like the leg has moved forward under the hull tipping the gearbox face back and up so that the gap us bigger at the bottom than the top. Until you correct this it will not go in. Drawing it in with bolts is BAD, if its not in line it will not go in no matter what you do.

 

[typhoonNige]

I have a dedicated pair of wooden blocks for supporting the saildrive and find that 3/8 socket extension bars are a perfect fit into the holes.

 

[vyv_cox]

I don't think that you have had much practice refitting gearboxes on cars. You have to get the gap between the box and the engine equal all round , sideways and top and bottom.

It looks like the leg has moved forward under the hull tipping the gearbox face back and up so that the gap us bigger at the bottom than the top. Until you correct this it will not go in. Drawing it in with bolts is BAD, if its not in line it will not go in no matter what you do.

Even with everything aligned it is often the case that the splines are a tiny bit misaligned with their slots and rotating/wobbling the engine turns the gearbox at the same time. After struggling for ages, separating the two, rotating one of them and starting again can often result in them slipping straight together.

They do have to be in perfect alignment though, as you say.

 

[MagicalArmchair]

That was an adventure, and whoever suggested those bags is on my Christmas list! It supported the whole weight of the engine (as it was roughly under the middle of the sump) without any drama. Order of attack:

• I greased up the engine mounts and greased up the little black bag.
• I put the little black bag under the engine on top of some pre-cut wooden shims the bring it right under the sump.
• Pumped up the slippery little black bag.
• Removed longer bolts (that was a daft idea and a half, that could have ended in disaster and stripped threads - don't do that!)
• The engine would now wiggle and slide around with ease.
• Grumpily went back to the instructions and undid all the bolts securing the diaphragm and the rear engine mount (VP have up do those up LAST so that the saildrive is free to move and mate with the engine).
• Aligned the saildrive by taking a rope back to the keel, to bring the face of the front of the sail drive up to the engine.
• Wiggled rather a lot, adjusted the splines from the saildrive end, wiggled some more.
• Poof, we are there.

What a struggle, thank you friends for your input and support... wonder if the engine will ever work again ...

 

[Martin_J]

And you'll sit down with a beer now and wonder what all the fuss was about... Just as I do after working on the car.. Annoying at the time but what a great feeling afterwards.

We just need to remember how we did it when time comes for it to be done again!

 

[Martin_J]

And you know... I'd forgotten about doing up all those clamp ring bolts last and yet I only did one a year ago.

Looking back at the photos, I'd put the clamp ring bolts into place but not torqued them up until the engine was slid fully back.