Graham376
Well-known member
We entered by sea but wonder why TA paperwork needed if overland as both methods are imports.
Moving the boat to Spain
- Thread starter citygent111
- Start date
We entered by sea but wonder why TA paperwork needed if overland as both methods are imports.
westernman
Well-known member
If you did not re-export them, they would have asked you to cough up for the import duty and VAT when you left.
mainsail1
Well-known member
My understanding is that you can leave your boat in any EU country for up to 2 years without any problems. Each EU country is treated separately for taxes/duty so after 2 years all you need to do is pop the boat over the border and keep it in another EU country for 2 years and so on.
greeny
Well-known member
I suspect the initial entry to the EU will be the risk time. If they wave you through, then just travel to your base and use the boat on SSR.
Here in Portugal if you comply with the local rules i.e. pay light dues each year, the authorities don't bother you and very rare any interest in vat position. Donkeys years since they were occasionally asking for Vat documents especially without other issues and suspicions about the boat.
If you get stopped on the initial entry and made to declare temp. importation then at some point you will need to leave and take it out (after 2 yrs? maybe). Lots can change in 2 yrs so I'd just bring it, with paperwork to effect the temp import if stopped.
If not stopped then just carry on.
At the moment I'm sailing a 20 footer sailer-trailer down here, bought in UK but in Portugal on B day with bills to prove it. No one ever bothers me and as long as I pay the local light dues and keep my safety equipment to their standard, I get no problems. Spain may be slightly different so you need input from Spanish expats to find that out.
Or change your mind and come to Portugal.
Just had a thought. Base in Via real San Antonio on Portugal side of the Guadiana river for 2 years then go to Ayamonte over the river in Spain for a few days/ months/years, After 2 years return. Base yourself in one side or the other. Not long to drive each way over the Big bridge. Or some variation on that theme. Ayamonte was the place British boats from Portugal used to go to once a year for a few days to prevent being liable for the "Circulation" Boat tax here in Portugal., Pre Brexit that was.
Here in Portugal if you comply with the local rules i.e. pay light dues each year, the authorities don't bother you and very rare any interest in vat position. Donkeys years since they were occasionally asking for Vat documents especially without other issues and suspicions about the boat.
If you get stopped on the initial entry and made to declare temp. importation then at some point you will need to leave and take it out (after 2 yrs? maybe). Lots can change in 2 yrs so I'd just bring it, with paperwork to effect the temp import if stopped.
If not stopped then just carry on.
At the moment I'm sailing a 20 footer sailer-trailer down here, bought in UK but in Portugal on B day with bills to prove it. No one ever bothers me and as long as I pay the local light dues and keep my safety equipment to their standard, I get no problems. Spain may be slightly different so you need input from Spanish expats to find that out.
Or change your mind and come to Portugal.
Just had a thought. Base in Via real San Antonio on Portugal side of the Guadiana river for 2 years then go to Ayamonte over the river in Spain for a few days/ months/years, After 2 years return. Base yourself in one side or the other. Not long to drive each way over the Big bridge. Or some variation on that theme.
Ayamonte was the place British boats from Portugal used to go to once a year for a few days to prevent being liable for the "Circulation" Boat tax here in Portugal., Pre Brexit that was.
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dunedin
Well-known member
What is your basis for that?
AFAIK you can get temporary import to the EU Customs zone without having to pay VAT for up to 18 months. To reset the clock you need to leave the EU (not the individual,country) - which might be easy to do from Northern France, say, but from Spain many have to cross to Morocco.
Good news is only need to be out of the EU for a day to reset the boat clock.
For the crew the 90 / 180 Schengen rules may be an issue - and unfortunately no quick way to reset.
st599
Well-known member
There's a separate treaty for vessels arriving by sea.
Graham376
Well-known member
Ayamonte still is but, being mooring based no-one knows where we've been so we tell them we went to Spain. Local Capitania also lets us off with just one light dues payment each year instead of the 2 x 6 months.
mainsail1
Well-known member
Apologies, I think I may be wrong about the two years but I was told this by someone who has had their UK boat in the EU for some years. The point made was that duty and taxes are a state issue not an EU issue and that is why you could only be taxed if you were in a particular country for more than 18 months. I was also told that to reset the clock on the boat, all you have to do is go outside the 12 mile limit into International waters which you could prove by your GPS track record. I would love to know if any of this is correct......... Schengen , on the other hand, is an EU issue relating to people movements.
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Graham376
Well-known member
My understanding is that the EU set min and max levels for some taxes including VAT but it's up to each state to set their own level within the range.
AFAIK, VAT will be charged on overstaying boats in the EU by the country they are in at the end of the 18 months. Can't just move to another EU country every 18 months to avoid it. I would be surprised if a GPS track is sufficient proof of exit from EU waters.
greeny
Well-known member
The OP has a 6 m boat on a trailer. Doubtful he's going to be country hopping by sea to avoid the vat. He will probably have to tow it somewhere out of the EU and that will be expensive. He could take the car ferry to Morocco and back. Again it will not be cheap.
On top of the boat, think trailer as well. Most if not all EU countries require trailers of this size to be mot'd and registered just like your car. That means matriculation. Uk trailers historically in my experience do not have sufficient paperwork to satisfy the system and often have to go for expensive engineering inspection to get the paperwork. etc etc it just goes on and on once you get into it.
Doing it all "under the radar" is possible but you need to have your wits about you at all times if challenged by the road police.
He could just pay the vat if he wanted. Pick the lowest vat level that is convenient in EU and pay it. The vat will be based on the current boat value not the new price. Then there's no reason to dodge the authorities and if you're smart you could keep it on SSR.
Or he could sell the boat in UK and buy another one where he wants to be. No tax issues, boat is where you want it and no expensive ferries and car journeys.
On top of the boat, think trailer as well. Most if not all EU countries require trailers of this size to be mot'd and registered just like your car. That means matriculation. Uk trailers historically in my experience do not have sufficient paperwork to satisfy the system and often have to go for expensive engineering inspection to get the paperwork. etc etc it just goes on and on once you get into it.
Doing it all "under the radar" is possible but you need to have your wits about you at all times if challenged by the road police.
He could just pay the vat if he wanted. Pick the lowest vat level that is convenient in EU and pay it. The vat will be based on the current boat value not the new price. Then there's no reason to dodge the authorities and if you're smart you could keep it on SSR.
Or he could sell the boat in UK and buy another one where he wants to be. No tax issues, boat is where you want it and no expensive ferries and car journeys.
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Graham376
Well-known member
As an alternative to Spain, the Algarve is worth considering. Quite a few people dry sail out of Bruce's yard (Nave Pegos) at Faro, which is 10 mins from the airport by taxi or 20 mins by bus. Unlike most Spanish yards, DIY is allowed, as is living on board. We've been based in the area for 17 years and no hassle from authorities, UK flagged. The area also has the advantage of being in the sheltered waters of the Ria Formosa as well as being fairly central for sailing east or west along the coast with choice of marinas or anchorages.
David156
New member
Any advice on economical marinas within 50 miles of San Sebastian, Spain. 50ft sloop. Thanks, David
John_Silver
Well-known member
Zumaia worth a try. Seemed to be quite a number of well travelled 40-50 footers in there, when we passed through, the summer before last. Stargazer is a relative tiddler, at 9.5m, and we were on Passeport Escales, so didn't have to pay, which means that I don't know the mooring rate for sure. But many of the boats in there were in the full-time-cruisers-on-a-budget (aren't we all) category....... Fabulous mountain backdrop (as with the whole of that coast) and good shelter (at the head of a dog-legged entrance canal). About 10 nautical miles from San Sebastian. Welcoming bunch.
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David156
New member
Many thanks for that. David
Nina Lucia
Active member
We had little Etap 23 for a number of years in Croatia, Istria, Rovinj.
It was around 200E for storage per year, on her trailer and launch ( in and out) was more less the same.
Fantastic sailing area, from Istria all the way to Dubrovnik, Venice is straight across 50NM
There is a lots of farms, open storages for caravans and boats over there.
You can fly to Pula, Trieste, Zagreb, Ljubljana...number of airports.
Vignette was about £50.00 per month and I think about £3.00 per day tax for crew.
Best holidays ever!
PM if you need more info about Croatia
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PlanB
Well-known member
Another vote for Zumaio (despite a couple of frightening You Tibe vids of a yacht trying to enter).
Cap Breton is round the corner in France, but a nice marina, if a bit tricky to enter in some conditions.
Also Getxo, near Bilbao in the other direction.
Some years since I was there, and don't know current costs but I recall they were no out of line with others in the area.
Cap Breton is round the corner in France, but a nice marina, if a bit tricky to enter in some conditions.
Also Getxo, near Bilbao in the other direction.
Some years since I was there, and don't know current costs but I recall they were no out of line with others in the area.
citygent111
Active member
OP here - sorry for the delay in getting back to you all!
I never thought about the trailer needing mot etc - that's a bit of a b*gger as the trailer is "past it's best"....
You're last line greeny is what I'm thinking currently. We'd likely be spending £20k or so, so not a big budget where boats are concerned, and I suspect we may get a good deal given just how many boats are out there.
citygent111
Active member
Sent you a PM Nina