Mooring a yacht with a bowsprit on a swinging mooring

[clyst]

Hi all what's the recommended method of mooring on a swinging mooring with a bowsprit ? My concern is a wind over tide/flow situation with the mooring strop/strops bearing on the bobstay stressing the lower fitting which is very close to waterline .
Cheers

 

[FWB]

The usual method is to rig up line to tryce up the bobstay. I don't bother though. I have a plastic tube over the mooring chain to stop the mooring chain rubbing directly on the bobstay chain. My bowsprit extends 13ft from the boat's stem, so a long bobstay. Although at times the bobstay can be under some strain from the mooring chain, it's never been a problem. Trycing though is the "correct" way.

 

[Deleted member 36384]

What is 'to tryce up'? Is it a 3 leg bridle with a leg either side of the bobstay and below a single leg onto the mooring line? Or is to a method of removing the bobstay or retracting the bowsprit? Just curious.

 

[FWB]

What is 'to tryce up'? Is it a 3 leg bridle with a leg either side of the bobstay and below a single leg onto the mooring line? Or is to a method of removing the bobstay or retracting the bowsprit? Just curious.

A line attached to the bobstay which is used to pull the bobstay up out of the way of the mooring/ anchor chain. Release the bobstay tension and pull it up.
If the jib is out at the end of the bowsprit any tension on it should be taken off first.

 

[prv]

Depends whether you have a "cutter" style bowsprit or a "sloop" type one. Before they came to refer simply to the number of headsails, part of what these terms implied was the forestaying and bowsprit arrangements. A cutter's forestay ran to the stemhead, so the bowsprit wasn't involved in holding the mast up. The sprit could thus generally be run in on deck, or steeved up out of the way in harbour. A few types of boat would actually alter the position of the bowsprit, to project more or less of it out in front, depending on the size of jib they were setting at the time. More common than that was to bring the spar in on deck when no jib was being carried in heavy weather; I've done that myself on one occasion. Topmast too in theory although very few people do that any more:

Anyway, back to the point of this thread, if you have a cutter type bowsprit then the bobstay should be adjustable, so rig a tricing line halfway along it and then when moored or anchored you can slacken away the stay and then take in the tricing line to keep it from dangling in the water.

A sloop type bowsprit is more permanent, carrying the main forestay that holds the mast up. They're generally shorter and more robustly built, and removing it is a major derigging job. The bobstay becomes an important part of the rig, adjustable only slightly by a bottlescrew or similar. In the past, sloop bowsprits were more of an American thing whereas cutters (as a whole, not just the sprit) were considered quintessentially English - you can see the legacy of this in an American tendency towards heavily-built bowsprits with walking platforms on top, solid guardrails right round them, fixed rod bobstays, etc.

With this sort of arrangement you can't get the bobstay out of the way of the anchor chain or mooring, so you either have to accept that the two will collide and perhaps guard against chafe with plastic tubing etc. Or you could possibly run a line to the end of the bowsprit and back to the buoy, to pull it forward away from your stem. I've heard this called a "bull rope". It doesn't feel quite right to me to take mooring loads on the end of a bowsprit, but if you have the sort of heavy sprit that goes with a fixed bobstay, and you're trusting it to hold your mast up, perhaps it's ok.

Pete

 

[Plum]

Depends whether you have a "cutter" style bowsprit or a "sloop" type one. Before they came to refer simply to the number of headsails, part of what these terms implied was the forestaying and bowsprit arrangements. A cutter's forestay ran to the stemhead, so the bowsprit wasn't involved in holding the mast up. The sprit could thus generally be run in on deck, or steeved up out of the way in harbour. A few types of boat would actually alter the position of the bowsprit, to project more or less of it out in front, depending on the size of jib they were setting at the time. More common than that was to bring the spar in on deck when no jib was being carried in heavy weather; I've done that myself on one occasion. Topmast too in theory although very few people do that any more:

Anyway, back to the point of this thread, if you have a cutter type bowsprit then the bobstay should be adjustable, so rig a tricing line halfway along it and then when moored or anchored you can slacken away the stay and then take in the tricing line to keep it from dangling in the water.

A sloop type bowsprit is more permanent, carrying the main forestay that holds the mast up. They're generally shorter and more robustly built, and removing it is a major derigging job. The bobstay becomes an important part of the rig, adjustable only slightly by a bottlescrew or similar. In the past, sloop bowsprits were more of an American thing whereas cutters (as a whole, not just the sprit) were considered quintessentially English - you can see the legacy of this in an American tendency towards heavily-built bowsprits with walking platforms on top, solid guardrails right round them, fixed rod bobstays, etc.

With this sort of arrangement you can't get the bobstay out of the way of the anchor chain or mooring, so you either have to accept that the two will collide and perhaps guard against chafe with plastic tubing etc. Or you could possibly run a line to the end of the bowsprit and back to the buoy, to pull it forward away from your stem. I've heard this called a "bull rope". It doesn't feel quite right to me to take mooring loads on the end of a bowsprit, but if you have the sort of heavy sprit that goes with a fixed bobstay, and you're trusting it to hold your mast up, perhaps it's ok.

Pete

A very good reply. I too trice up the bobstay when on a swinging mooring but will often rig a bull-rope strop using a very thin (6mm) line from the buoy to the bowsprit end. This line keeps the buoy from abrading the bow if the wind is blowing the boat over the mooring. It is a thin line so it will break before excessive load comes on the bowsprit.

Colin. Www.solocoastalsailing.co.uk

 

[Hadenough]

Hi all what's the recommended method of mooring on a swinging mooring with a bowsprit ? My concern is a wind over tide/flow situation with the mooring strop/strops bearing on the bobstay stressing the lower fitting which is very close to waterline .
Cheers

Assuming that you cannot trice the bobstay, I can't, I have a bridle in 20mm three strand with a shackle and swivel at the point of the vee. I deploy this through the port and starboard fair leads onto the mooring cleats, crossing them over to get a good lead, shackle and swivel to the mooring bouy. The bridle is long enough to position the swivel ahead of the bobstay. Works for me 9 times out of ten but it does mean your bow is a long way off the mooring bouy. Sometimes in weird wind against tide situations I put a lot of slack onto one side of the bridle and hang off one fair lead / cleat. Interestingly, I took a swinging mooring in Poole harbour this summer which had a long, very heavy (as in weight rather than size) chain off the bouy with a loop held by a substantial pick up bouy. With this deployed on my usual centre bow roller I found that the weight of the chain sank it virtually straight down (even in a good tide) and kept it off the bobstay. Not familiar with this type of chain but it was around 10mm barsize but much heavier than usual.

 

[Hadenough]

A very good reply. I too trice up the bobstay when on a swinging mooring but will often rig a bull-rope strop using a very thin (6mm) line from the buoy to the bowsprit end. This line keeps the buoy from abrading the bow if the wind is blowing the boat over the mooring. It is a thin line so it will break before excessive load comes on the bowsprit.

Colin. Www.solocoastalsailing.co.uk

Hmm, might try that.

 

[lw395]

A very good reply. I too trice up the bobstay when on a swinging mooring but will often rig a bull-rope strop using a very thin (6mm) line from the buoy to the bowsprit end. This line keeps the buoy from abrading the bow if the wind is blowing the boat over the mooring. It is a thin line so it will break before excessive load comes on the bowsprit.

Colin. Www.solocoastalsailing.co.uk

Also seen it done on modern racing yachts with plumb bows, using the spinny pole instead of a bowsprit.

 

[C08]

I had a Macwester with a bowsprit on a drying mooring at Red Wharf Bay that can have 3-4 knots running through the mooring and I never had any problem with the mooring chain conflicting with the bobstay even in strong wind over tide situations however I anchored in the upper reaches of the Mersey and before the boat floated off the anchor chain bearing across the bobstay broke the substantial iron fitting on the end of the bowsprit. The part that stretched until it broke was about 8mmx8mm steel, probably not the best steel but there must have been some load to do that. I think the Op is right to give this possible problem some thought.

 

[simonfraser]

dyneema bob stay, plastic over the mooring strops works for me.
i also put the boom out to the oposite side as this turns the bob stay away from the mooring in a blow.

 

[clyst]

Thanks for all your replies chaps certainly food for thought there . Thank you .

 

[Hadenough]

dyneema bob stay, plastic over the mooring strops works for me.
i also put the boom out to the oposite side as this turns the bob stay away from the mooring in a blow.

Probably OK with a light boat but with a heavy boat it may stop the chafe but it doesn't stop the stress on the fixings or graunching noises when you have WAT.

 

[Poignard]

A very good reply. I too trice up the bobstay when on a swinging mooring but will often rig a bull-rope strop using a very thin (6mm) line from the buoy to the bowsprit end. This line keeps the buoy from abrading the bow if the wind is blowing the boat over the mooring. It is a thin line so it will break before excessive load comes on the bowsprit.

Colin. Www.solocoastalsailing.co.uk

I have rigged a spinnaker pole as a sort of temporary bowsprit with a bullrope. It works very well in wind-against-tide situations. I got the idea from "Cruising Under Sail" by Eric Hiscock, where it's decribed and illustrated with a photo.

 

[Hadenough]

I have rigged a spinnaker pole as a sort of temporary bowsprit with a bullrope. It works very well in wind-over-tide situations. I got the idea from "Cruising Under Sail" by Eric Hiscock, where it's decribed and illustrated with a photo.

I presume you did that to avoid overriding your anchor rode rather than preventing the the problem of clashing with your bob stay as per the OP's query?

 

[Poignard]

I presume you did that to avoid overriding your anchor rode rather than preventing the the problem of clashing with your bob stay as per the OP's query?

Just so. But I was responding to Plum's post rather than the OP's. Thread drift.

ps I've corrected my mistake. I should have written wind-against-tide, not wind-over-tide

 

[Hadenough]

Just so. But I was responding to Plum's post rather than the OP's. Thread drift.

Not a problem. But it is interesting how a non bow sprit boat introduces a bow sprit boat's difficulty to resolve a similar but different problem. ---- if you see what I mean!

 

[William_H]

I have always moored my little Trailer sailer by the winching eye mounted well down on the stem.
I use a big ss snap hook on polyester line. Makes me wonder why you can't moore to the bottom of the bob stay attachent. I attach and detach from the dinghy and have a back up line to deck cleat which is the first to be picked up and last to be let go.
This has many advantatges. Mostly it gets the mooring line down low and protected from any boats that come adrift. it also means the swing radius is that much shorter. In my case however the buoy still hits the bow in gentle conditions of tide and wind.
However I did break off the original U bolt due to the large side loads when the boat swings. A large saddle with big bolts replaced the original U bolt which was wasted(reduced) down to a smaller diameter for the thread. So make sure the bottom bob stay fitting is stout. of course yous till need a back up mooring line. I wonder if this arrangement would suit those with bow sprit? good luck olewill

 

[prv]

Makes me wonder why you can't moore to the bottom of the bob stay attachent.

My uncle does exactly that.

His boat is small enough to reach the bobstay chainplate from the deck, though. Otherwise you'd need either some serious gymnastics or to do it from the dinghy after temporarily securing with a line on deck. Of course if you're at your home mooring the odds are that you do have a dinghy available, but it's an additional faff and there's the possibility of forgetting to do it as you leave.

Pete