Mirror dinghy under bermudan rig?

[Greenheart]

In East Looe last week, I saw parked Mirror dinghies with either the traditional short lower mast, or a permanent tall mast which must create a bermudan rig...

View attachment 34651

...I hadn't realised the bermudan rig was accepted by the class association, and I hadn't noticed recognition of a difference in recent Portsmouth Yardstick listings...

...isn't it likely that the taller non-gunter version outperforms the traditional rig? Why else would there have been any inclination to adopt it?

 

[TimBennet]

Why else would there have been any inclination to adopt it?

Cheaper.
Less faff.
More attractive, modern image for youngsters

 

[Woodlouse]

It was accepted a few years back or the reasons outlined above. I don't think there is much difference in performance.

 

[emsworthy]

AFAIK there is no PY difference in the bermudan vs gunter rigs. As Tim says, as lot less hassle to rig is the main advantage. A properly set up gunter halyard turns the mast/gaff into a virtual single spar anyway so I guess it was a simple decision for the class association.

 

[dylanwinter]

AFAIK there is no PY difference in the bermudan vs gunter rigs. As Tim says, as lot less hassle to rig is the main advantage. A properly set up gunter halyard turns the mast/gaff into a virtual single spar anyway so I guess it was a simple decision for the class association.

for what I do the gunter is abrilliant

in my opinion it is the ideal rig for a trailer sailer

D

 

[sailorman]

for what I do the gunter is abrilliant

in my opinion it is the ideal rig for a trailer sailer

D

The very reason it was chosen in the first place, the rig is short enough to go on the roof rack with the dinghy

 

[VicS]

The very reason it was chosen in the first place, the rig is short enough to go on the roof rack with the dinghy

The mast of the gunter rig version will in fact (just) stow within the length of the boat whether trailered or roof topped.

 

[sailorman]

The mast of the gunter rig version will in fact (just) stow within the length of the boat whether trailered or roof topped.

Correct it was my very first boat

 

[prv]

The mast of the gunter rig version will in fact (just) stow within the length of the boat whether trailered or roof topped.

Yep, we towed ours all the way to West Wales behind a Metro, with all the kit in the boat under a fitted PVC cover

Pete

 

[sailorman]

Yep, we towed ours all the way to West Wales behind a Metro, with all the kit in the boat under a fitted PVC cover

Pete

we went to Devon Mini van towing the dinghy full of camping gear.
That same Mini van toewd my very first Yacht a Silhouette Mk 2 from Battle to near Cambridge then onward to Woodbridge after a refit

 

[dunedin]

Yep, we towed ours all the way to West Wales behind a Metro, with all the kit in the boat under a fitted PVC cover

if we are going to start a sub-thread on how far we have taken Gunter rigged Mirrors, I'll raise you a Dundee to Yugoslavia on the roof of an old Mk IX Jag.

Or to return to the original thread a key factor I believe was to make the boat more similar to things like the 420 for which the Mirror is a 2 person junior feeder class. I believe centre mains were being consider for similar reasons.

 

[A1Sailor]

if we are going to start a sub-thread on how far we have taken Gunter rigged Mirrors, I'll raise you a Dundee to Yugoslavia on the roof of an old Mk IX Jag.

Or to return to the original thread a key factor I believe was to make the boat more similar to things like the 420 for which the Mirror is a 2 person junior feeder class. I believe centre mains were being consider for similar reasons.

Did you sail back through the Med?

 

[dylanwinter]

Uk to the black sea

Did you sail back through the Med?

little book review

 

[Seajet]

In my 'umble opinion, the Mirror lost it's USP - user friendliness - when they allowed a Bermudan rig; not so easy to tow to Cornwall now, is it ?!

The original Laser dinghies fell off the edge too when they diversified into ' radial ' rigs etc, so completly rodgered the ' One Design, everyone's equal ' ethos.

I'm a huge fan of the Gunter rig, my first boat ( a Caricraft 10 ) had this and performed very nicely Ta, including to windward; one would have to be a real duffer to find the yard a problem when raising or lowering the main.

 

[Greenheart]

Thanks for these updates. I'd no idea that the class had accepted the change.

For years I scorned the Mirror as slow & cramped...but seeing how widely they're used & enjoyed, I wish I'd discovered their versatility when their dimensions were all I could manage.

Am I deceived in this photo, by the misleading use of very little crew-members? The boat looks 30% bigger than any Mirror I've seen before:

View attachment 34658

 

[Iain C]

Towing a mirror hasn't got any more difficult...it's the car topping that's now harder. But these days so few people seem to car top dinghies, I can see the Mirror's USP was a bit irrelevant anyway.

WRT Lasers, radials, 4.7s and full rigs were never designed to fleet race together anyway, so the one design ethos is alive and well (ignoring the XD, non XD boats, non equalised hulls, folded v rolled sails and Kirby Torch fiasco...). In practice, when I did OOD at my club the other Wednesday there wasn't much in it at all between the boats. The radial boats were carrying less weight on average so it all evens out...

 

[TimBennet]

Towing a mirror hasn't got any more difficult...it's the car topping that's now harder. But these days so few people seem to car top dinghies, I can see the Mirror's USP was a bit irrelevant anyway.

WRT Lasers, radials, 4.7s and full rigs were never designed to fleet race together anyway, so the one design ethos is alive and well (ignoring the XD, non XD boats, non equalised hulls, folded v rolled sails and Kirby Torch fiasco...). In practice, when I did OOD at my club the other Wednesday there wasn't much in it at all between the boats. The radial boats were carrying less weight on average so it all evens out...

Spot on with both points. In fact allowing people to switch between rigs during events and racing the different rigs in the same race, has totally revitalised Laser sailing here in the NW.

 

[Keen_Ed]

Well, with combi trailers I doubt that anybody car tops them anymore. So I don't think that the move to bermudian mast will make much difference.

 

[emsworthy]

Thanks for these updates. I'd no idea that the class had accepted the change.

For years I scorned the Mirror as slow & cramped...but seeing how widely they're used & enjoyed, I wish I'd discovered their versatility when their dimensions were all I could manage.

Am I deceived in this photo, by the misleading use of very little crew-members? The boat looks 30% bigger than any Mirror I've seen before:

View attachment 34658

I suspect the entire crew are midgets!!! Looking at the fashions the picture was taken well before Photoshop was that common. Also glad to see the joy on my children's faces when we first put them on a Mirror are matched by the little cherub sat on the thwart!!

 

[Greenheart]

...glad to see the joy on my children's faces when we first put them on a Mirror are matched by the little cherub sat on the thwart!!

How true. That kiddie seems to be saying "one more time...if that boom hits me one more time, I'll scream!".