Mind and Body

[moomba]

Mind and Body
Hey all myself and the family are heading out in around a year once my partner finishes of some Environmental work , planning a circumnavigation , no real time limit .

The question is it is my impression that it is mostly retires out there living and cruising on your boat , I appreciate there are others including families so all answers welcome.

So the questions are How do you feel as in health and mental stability being out there.

Does the warm weather and easier lifestyle make it easier on sore bodies and joints, does the mind become more effective and calmer, (less stress on the mind, less stress on the body)

Do you think if you were back on land say in a typical UK weather pattern that your body would act differently.

Does your diet changes (i.e local foods maybe more fish) allow a better dietary eating , better weight control and a healthy body

Is there anything that you do differently or on your boat that keeps you fit (yoga etc) i,e is there other hacks that you can think of to keep the body fit during long passages


I ask because I am pretty ill with a lot of pain and stress on my mind and body, I am working very hard through rehab to get to the point with my adapted boat to take up this challenge but , my concern or my hope is that constant warm weather , swimming , and daily stressors will help in the healing process.

 

[AndrewB]

To answer this fully would need the better part of a book to answer (or an Ocean Yachtmaster course). So I’ll give a short answer to each question based on my own experience and you might want to seek more in later threads.

1. You really must start with a clear plan, say for a five-year circumnavigation, or you’ll get nowhere. Work out a route you’d like to follow, then see how you can fit that with weather patterns (e.g. hurricane seasons) and with limitations on length of stay in the countries you plan to visit.

2. All sorts go ocean cruising but the single biggest demographic is early retiree couples, 55-65.

3. Physically, ocean cruising is not too hard but it takes more effort than sitting on a sofa in front of the TV on a rainy day in the UK. Your physical fitness will improve without any need for extra exercise, with a lot of walking and swimming as well as sailing, and most people become leaner and trimmer. You live in clean air and will suffer less from infectious diseases, but more from cuts and bruises. (But I say this from the point of view of someone who starts reasonably healthy, not knowing the nature of your illness).

4. Mentally, ocean cruising is a challenge, and presents its own stresses, even if these are very different from those of a more conventional lifestyle. Coping with bad weather, organising repairs in out of the way places, and dealing with bureaucracy are obvious external ones. But these are challenges most people overcome. More problematic can be that living at close quarters all the time puts pressure on relationships.

5. No-one does this for the food. Whatever the hype, do not expect to eat particularly well, but more, and your fitter body will cope better with what you get. (I once worked out I needed about 3,000 kilocals per day, 50% more than a sedentary lifestyle).

6. If you are in recovery from a major illness, you may want to think not only about the level of stress in ocean cruising but the also problems of managing the boat should you have a relapse and the risks of being a long way from advanced medicine. Many people at this stage prefer the more relaxed liveaboard life of the Mediterranean to full-on ocean cruising.

 

[Yngmar]

You need to be reasonably fit to start, the rest will come as your body adapts to the needs of the livestyle. I.e. you'll grow some muscles if you were previously an office drone and now have to pull ropes (unless you get electric winches) and go swim and freedive a couple times a day. We get fat in winter when we're doing that a lot less. Expect more minor cuts and bruises (good first aid kit recommended).

Any kind of health issue can be far more problematic on a boat. For example, I once strained my back a bit. Nothing serious, passed after a week or two, but during that time it was seriously limiting. Couldn't pull the outhaul, had to winch furling lines I normally pull by hand quite easily. Difficult getting in the dinghy and definitely no rowing.

As for stress. Generally less stress, but that depends on how you approach the lifestyle. Some people seem to rush through places in days where we've spent months and push through rough weather to hurry on to the next place where we rather wait for better weather. At times you'll also get caught out and have to deal with it. You definitely also have your sleep deprived nights sometimes and high stress moments when a sudden squall sees half the anchorage dragging, another boat pulls up your anchor and you end up on the boat behind yours.

Dietary changes, yes. You eat what you can buy in the place you're at. And you get to try lots of new food in every place. When you run out of fresh food, you'll be eating canned stuff, rice, pasta, etc.. Very helpful to enjoy a bit of creative cooking.

Yoga? Yes, boat yoga. That means you crawling into a locker too small to be in, and twisting your neck and spine into a corkscrew shape until you can see where the problem is. Then work out how to get at least one of your insufficiently jointed limbs in a place where you can do the work. Ok, that depends a lot on how well your boat was designed, but sooner or later you'll be doing something much like this.

 

[dansaskip]

Ok I started late - after retiring at 66.
I think AndrewB is only partly right in saying you need clear plan say a 5 year circumnavigation. Yes you need to work out a route and find out about the sailing seasons in different places, where not to be at certain times. But you don't need a fixed plan of how long to take. I meet several boats who had a fixed schedule and it seemed to me that they could never fully enjoy where they were - always looking on to the next place. Better to be more flexible, if you find a place you enjoy then stay there longer. meet other cruisers and be told of other places that maybe you had not considered at first etc.
For example when I set off from UK I had thought to go straight through to Panama but on getting to Caribbean enjoyed it so much I spent two seasons there before moving on.
Cruising can be hard if you get bad weather, it is tough being thrown around and looking after the boat or cooking then but there are plenty of 'easy times' too.
AndrewB is right that - Mentally, ocean cruising is a challenge.
I disagree about his comments on the food. I have always eaten well on my travels and enjoyed the experience and tastes of different food from different cultures. Too many to really list but the custard tarts in Lisbon, Canary potatoes , Fresh Mai Mai , Swordfish and "provision" in Trinidad, Jerk pork, fresh Tuna in Polynesia, Fresh coconuts, pineapples, bananas like you have never tasted before, Tonga feasts
I know many cruisers that do yoga, pilates is good too.
All I can say is to approach it with an open mind give it a try and above all enjoy it

 

[AndrewB]

I disagree about [AndrewBs] comments on the food. I have always eaten well on my travels and enjoyed the experience and tastes of different food from different cultures. Too many to really list but the custard tarts in Lisbon, Canary potatoes , Fresh Mai Mai , Swordfish and "provision" in Trinidad, Jerk pork, fresh Tuna in Polynesia, Fresh coconuts, pineapples, bananas like you have never tasted before, Tonga feasts

Rose-tinted glasses, I'm afraid. Stop focusing on the times you arrived somewhere when pineapples - or whatever - just happened to be in season and heavenly; not that you can live on pineapples. And of course it's interesting to try local staples, though things like salted bacalau, taro, and poi-poi (in Polynesia) take some getting used to.

While on passage diet tends to get rudimentary, probably mainly canned food, prepared in a basic fashion because of the conditions. On the plus side even the simplest cooking tastes delicious. But much of our cooking effort on ocean crossings was on keeping ourselves supplied with bread, essential for the necessary calories.

Once you arrive at an exotic island, yes, probably there will be a limited range of fresh fruit and vegetables, specially in season. Remember though, we stand at the bottom of the pecking order for buying it. The best is exported to western supermarkets, local tourist restaurants get the next cut, then regular customers (or the producers in subsistence economies), and finally what's left, us.

I can't count the times I've arrived somewhere with apparently a robust fishing industry and yet there is no decent fish we can buy, or I'm offered something that smells high. And often no meat either other than frozen chicken legs and anaemic low grade "beefburgers" from the USA that have been defrosted en route so many times they are unfit for consumption'.

Ah well, open another Fray Bentos steak & kidney pie. Or become vegetarian, and live on dried pulses. Or go out to a restaurant.

Of course, if you are good at fishing, that helps a lot. We did well up until the 90's. But many island localities are fished out now, and there isn't much in open ocean.

It's not always like that of course. There are excellent supermarkets in the more civilised places, but we do hope to see more of the world than Sainsbury's, Carrefour and Walmart.

 

[moomba]

Great feed back and very welcome.
I have been planning this for 4 years now and have the route mainly worked out , but everything is flexible, following the Milk run across the Atlantic , and spending most of the time in the leeward Islands, Heading through the canal and heading up Mexico and on the Hawaii , up to Alaska and down through the waterways of Canada ,to Mexico , then onto the Pacific, NZ to Aus then up through to Asia Thailand, Maly, India , through the Indian Ocean Islands, onto S, Africa.
Taking into consideration the weather patterns , and seasonal changes
I will be 49 by then the Wife 42 and my Daughter 10 , my illness is widespread pain and difficultly moving and though processing after a bang on the head , this can flare to be housebound or I can manage it , winter is a real problem with the cold and dampness and darkness, while over Summer I tend to get more better days,
I was a very fit and determent person , so my illness in a sense has taken me back to 40% of what I used to be , but I can still do more than most (if that makes sense)
I am trying to reduce my medication over the next 2 years and find alternative ways , this will hopefully allow me to be less dependent on finding the stuff
In regards to food , I agree with Andrew B I was able to cruise around Tonga for 3 weeks with the Father in law and we found if the supply boat was delayed food was very scarce and fish went to the locals

Questions...
How did you insure your trip , both personnel and boat wise , and were you held back from places because of this

Did anyone need medication on a regular basis and how did they get their prescription and how easy was it to use

Did anyone enter the USA and have any issues my Daughter and Wife are both US citizens

As mainly running with the Wind and in seasons , is it necessary to take a drogue or sea Anchor

Is Radar more important that AIS (My old radar needs replaced is it worth it)

How much solar is really necessary , ;the old saying as much as you need , there will be the usual Auto pilot , fridge , lighting Instruments etc, but hoping to get away with 400 w

is a wind self steering system a no brainier , or in reality I can get the essential spares for the auto pilot and save money.

And now for the rumble in the Jungle question , did any one take a shotgun onboard for safety from people and wildlife (bears) I am considering it , but this is a 50 / 50 dilemma of protecting my family and the moral issues it causes,


thank you for reading and responding and thanks for those that have taken the time already

 

[Yngmar]

Did anyone enter the USA and have any issues my Daughter and Wife are both US citizens

Yup, they were rude, asked a lot of impertinent questions and had teenagers with machine guns striding around the back of the airport terminal. Very worrying, and that was just visiting by plane.

As mainly running with the Wind and in seasons , is it necessary to take a drogue or sea Anchor

Suggest reading Heavy Weather Sailing. Covers this topic very well, amongst many other useful tidbits.

Is Radar more important that AIS (My old radar needs replaced is it worth it)

AIS is too cheap and useful not to fit now. Radar certainly has its uses too. Good for finding your way into places in the dark/fog, and very useful for tracking squalls at night. Moderately useful for collision avoidance at sea. Must learn how to use it properly, and make it part of your watchkeeping, or it won't do you much good for that.

How much solar is really necessary , ;the old saying as much as you need , there will be the usual Auto pilot , fridge , lighting Instruments etc, but hoping to get away with 400 w

400W sounds about right. We have 600W and power to spare on sunny days (which we aim to convert into freshwater soon) and can make do on cloudy days with a bit of power management. Fridge eats a lot, depending on size and insulation, especially once you get to places where it's really warm where most run non-stop. Autopilot can also be hungry, the worse the conditions, the more it uses.

is a wind self steering system a no brainier , or in reality I can get the essential spares for the auto pilot and save money.

It can be tricky swapping out parts of your steering while at sea. You will not be able to steer while doing so, for once. Personally I would like to have some kind of backup self-steering system fitted and ready to use rather than in spare parts boxes, either windvane or a second independent autopilot. Many crossed oceans without such backup, but some of them had to hand-steer for weeks and found it rather exhausting.

And now for the rumble in the Jungle question , did any one take a shotgun onboard for safety from people and wildlife (bears) I am considering it , but this is a 50 / 50 dilemma of protecting my family and the moral issues it causes,

Oh please. Have a google before you derail your own thread with a silly question like this. There's not a lot of news about bears swimming to boats and boarding them. As for people, this is what happens if you have a shotgun onboard and they do come for you.

 

[AndrewB]

Yngmar is right about this. I could add a few comments based on my own experience.

1. If you have a problem with cold, skip Alaska and northern Canada.

2. A radar is not essential for tropical sailing but would be very helpful on the Alaska - USA coast which is busy in places and dense fogs are common.

3. Do fit wind-vane steering. Compared to an auto-pilot it is not power hungry, copes better in strong winds, and is more readily fixable when it breaks down. The auto-pilot is better in very light winds or when motoring. As Yngmar says, having a backup is important, you never want to find yourself in a situation of having to hand-steer 24/7 in a shorthanded boat.

4. You are going to be tight for power. Solar is good in the tropics but is less use for places like the north Pacific which is often overcast. Consider a towed generator as well. Many people carry a small petrol generator to spare running the engine.

5. In northern Canada and Alaska you may be advised to carry bear-spray. On my experience it is not essential on a boat unless you intend rambles in the wilderness. Get it there: bear spray is illegal in many countries.

6. As the Pardeys wrote: "In a storm at sea, luck is highly biased toward the sailor who has a plan." It is surprising how many don't, or have equipment they have never tested. Even heaving-to in strong winds and big seas is tricky, and needs practicing to get just the right combination of sails. I found trailing warps, or later a partial series drogue, a great help many times, not just in 'survival' conditions, as it steadied the steering and made life more comfortable, if slower. But maybe that was my boat.

7. Consider how you are going to manage water supply on long passages.

8. Many marinas worldwide, and even some countries, require you to have third-party boat insurance. Some insurance companies will question your experience/qualifications before issuing world-wide cover.

9. As a UK citizen you will need a visa (B1/B2) to enter the USA which should be obtained well in advance. Australia also requires a visa, and there you must give advance notice of arrival. What with all the bureaucracy these two countries are expensive to enter.

 

[Grehan]

I think that The Plan has more relevance before you go, than when you're actually 'off'. By that I mean Preparation. Use your boat as much as possible, now, so you get thoroughly in tune with her, how to cope confidently with the process of sailing and being aboard. Anchoring! Towards 'second nature'. Read lots of books and blogs, get the benefit of others' experience, learn and assess.
This also applies to your family. And it applies to the powerfully relevant aspect of living together in a confined space - if you're all not attuned to it, it can be very stressful. There's no 'escape' if you start thinking like that.
So that when you depart you're able to modify, or even abandon, the plan in the light of experiences or circumstances without feeling that you're trapped or committed to it. The great joy of buggering off is following one's nose, having a dream, being qualified and competent to follow that dream. Wandering, but not having to follow a rigid path.
I appreciate that planning ocean passages demands rigour. Of course. But expecting to be somewhere particular in a particular timescale imposes the kind of landlubber 9 to 5 pressure that you're wanting to escape from.
15 years down the line, having pootled around the Med, we have been very happy to deviate from a vague plan to sail to New Zealand in favour of the calmer but rich pleasures of the inland waterways. By selling up we 'bought' the freedom to follow our thoughts and desires. To have no plan at all.
Two books by Beth Leonard that we thought very good
Voyager's Handbook - [U]https://amzn.to/2KnQsMd[/U] - advice
Following Seas - [U]https://amzn.to/2Kqnkno[/U] - their first 2 years story, starting as newbies

 

[KellysEye]

Jane and I were away for six and a half year and had no health problems, to some extent you lose fitness if you don't walk and swim, as said, but increase upper body strength by using winches and reefing and vice versa. You and crew member must do the RYA's first aid and sea survival courses. The reason for the first aid course is you will be far away from any medical help. They give a list of prescribed drugs to take covering everything including, ears, nose, throat broken bones etc and two that stop an appendix burst for24 hours so you can call for help. If you press the appendix in it doesn't hurt let go and it does. They teach CPR and give a list of medical kit to take such as steristrips for cuts, flamzine cream for burns, kitchen role is sterile out of the pack and is pressed firmly on the cut to stop bleeding. Cling film is sterile out of the pack and is used to cover burns and lots more including taking blood pressure kit . To recognise symptoms take The Ship's Captains Medical Guide is free as a PDF online at https://www.gov.uk/government/public...-medical-guide. . What we did is go to see our doctor and told him we were going long distance sailing away from any medical facilities, then we gave him the RYA list, and he prescribed some drugs and we bought the rest. The sea survival course in done in a swimming pool and includes getting into to the life raft.

I hope the rehab goes well and you can set off, if your family includes children then take the relevant text books and give lessons every afternoon. The children we met were the best educated and personable that we had ever met.

 

[dansaskip]

Rose-tinted glasses, I'm afraid.

I am sorry but I can't let that pass without comment. It is just my experience of 4 years live aboard cruising from UK to New Zealand and I stand by my original comment. I have never had any difficulty getting fresh fruit and veg anywhere, just go to then local markets.
I feel sorry that you find you had to rely on mainly canned food on passage. That is certainly not my experience either on passage or at remote islands or of many other cruisers I have meet.

 

[One A.]

Is this your dream, or is it a committed family dream.?

 

[GHA]

I am sorry but I can't let that pass without comment. It is just my experience of 4 years live aboard cruising from UK to New Zealand and I stand by my original comment. I have never had any difficulty getting fresh fruit and veg anywhere, just go to then local markets.
I feel sorry that you find you had to rely on mainly canned food on passage. That is certainly not my experience either on passage or at remote islands or of many other cruisers I have meet.

Would agree with that, round the Atlantic anyway. Then growing beansprouts on passage makes a delicious healthy fresh addition, have a few lots constantly on the go.
https://sv-jedi.smugmug.com/GalleyRecipes/Tauge/i-H8nwZNF
Plus good chance of a nice big fish now and again. Canning onboard in a pressure cooker works well as well, keep some fish for later and do a load of stews or whatever before leaving. Fresh yogurt also nice, can be made with powdered milk. Food gets a bit more important on passage No need to live just out of a can for weeks

 

[moomba]

Ok I started late - after retiring at 66.
I think AndrewB is only partly right in saying you need clear plan say a 5 year circumnavigation. Yes you need to work out a route and find out about the sailing seasons in different places, where not to be at certain times. But you don't need a fixed plan of how long to take. I meet several boats who had a fixed schedule and it seemed to me that they could never fully enjoy where they were - always looking on to the next place. Better to be more flexible, if you find a place you enjoy then stay there longer. meet other cruisers and be told of other places that maybe you had not considered at first etc.
For example when I set off from UK I had thought to go straight through to Panama but on getting to Caribbean enjoyed it so much I spent two seasons there before moving on.
Cruising can be hard if you get bad weather, it is tough being thrown around and looking after the boat or cooking then but there are plenty of 'easy times' too.
AndrewB is right that - Mentally, ocean cruising is a challenge.
I disagree about his comments on the food. I have always eaten well on my travels and enjoyed the experience and tastes of different food from different cultures. Too many to really list but the custard tarts in Lisbon, Canary potatoes , Fresh Mai Mai , Swordfish and "provision" in Trinidad, Jerk pork, fresh Tuna in Polynesia, Fresh coconuts, pineapples, bananas like you have never tasted before, Tonga feasts
I know many cruisers that do yoga, pilates is good too.
All I can say is to approach it with an open mind give it a try and above all enjoy it

Yes Ty for reply we are planning 4 to 5 years maybe we less maybe longer , do have a plan we tend to as a family fall into things as new doors open and new adventures come, I watch some U tubers from the beginning and into their long voyages and they start as the usual pasty some what weary looking travellers to becoming enlightenment in their faces and body fat down and years younger.

 

[moomba]

Yup, they were rude, asked a lot of impertinent questions and had teenagers with machine guns striding around the back of the airport terminal. Very worrying, and that was just visiting by plane.



Suggest reading Heavy Weather Sailing. Covers this topic very well, amongst many other useful tidbits.



AIS is too cheap and useful not to fit now. Radar certainly has its uses too. Good for finding your way into places in the dark/fog, and very useful for tracking squalls at night. Moderately useful for collision avoidance at sea. Must learn how to use it properly, and make it part of your watchkeeping, or it won't do you much good for that.



400W sounds about right. We have 600W and power to spare on sunny days (which we aim to convert into freshwater soon) and can make do on cloudy days with a bit of power management. Fridge eats a lot, depending on size and insulation, especially once you get to places where it's really warm where most run non-stop. Autopilot can also be hungry, the worse the conditions, the more it uses.



It can be tricky swapping out parts of your steering while at sea. You will not be able to steer while doing so, for once. Personally I would like to have some kind of backup self-steering system fitted and ready to use rather than in spare parts boxes, either windvane or a second independent autopilot. Many crossed oceans without such backup, but some of them had to hand-steer for weeks and found it rather exhausting.



Oh please. Have a google before you derail your own thread with a silly question like this. There's not a lot of news about bears swimming to boats and boarding them. As for people, this is what happens if you have a shotgun onboard and they do come for you.

Thanks for the answers very helpful ,
the gun question is a reality we have to face in certain areas as crime and poverty increase people become more desperate, I intend to travel down to Columbia , and then up through the china Sea both having issues with pirates, not that this is going to help with machine guns, and I would not put my family in danger , but a skiff full of Machetes wielding nutters might be put off by as shot over their bows. Their is always a moral dilemma , regarding guns especially in the UK , but to protect ones family in my mind is my sole purpose and will do it with my life or someone else's if that is the only way.
The chances of it happing are rare I appreciate that but I have learned through my life that stacking odds in your favour makes for a safer life.

 

[moomba]

Is this your dream, or is it a committed family dream.?

My Wife and Me are fully committed boat bought last year just finished the refurb and looking forward to the season 2019 , then in 2 years off . clearly if thinks happen along the way plans will change, my daughter is a bit to young to really grasp it but will be around 10 to 11 so should be a decent deck hand by then,
And as a parent we need to make choices for them , and I consider this an opportunity of a lifetime which will hopefully have an influence on her for the rest of her life.

 

[moomba]

I am sorry but I can't let that pass without comment. It is just my experience of 4 years live aboard cruising from UK to New Zealand and I stand by my original comment. I have never had any difficulty getting fresh fruit and veg anywhere, just go to then local markets.
I feel sorry that you find you had to rely on mainly canned food on passage. That is certainly not my experience either on passage or at remote islands or of many other cruisers I have meet.

No either for me when in Tonga fresh fruit and fishj was a plentiful , canned , and meat products and other household goods were not.

 

[De.windhoos]

Thanks for the answers very helpful ,
the gun question is a reality we have to face in certain areas as crime and poverty increase people become more desperate, I intend to travel down to Columbia , and then up through the china Sea both having issues with pirates, not that this is going to help with machine guns, and I would not put my family in danger , but a skiff full of Machetes wielding nutters might be put off by as shot over their bows. Their is always a moral dilemma , regarding guns especially in the UK , but to protect ones family in my mind is my sole purpose and will do it with my life or someone else's if that is the only way.
The chances of it happing are rare I appreciate that but I have learned through my life that stacking odds in your favour makes for a safer life.

forget about guns, it's pain in the ass to have one onboard, a lot of countries either forbid, or have extremely rigorous procedures regarding bringing guns into their country.
just follow the relevant websites, talk to other cruisers in the area (and try to verify what they say.....) and switch of your AIS transmitter in dodgy areas. The number of pirate attacks on sailing yachts is extremely small, and think how you feel if you mistakenly kill an innocent fisherman that approaches you to trade some fish for a bottle of beer...

You have a bigger change to get mugged when onshore.

 

[De.windhoos]

JTo recognise symptoms take The Ship's Captains Medical Guide is free as a PDF online at https://www.gov.uk/government/public...-medical-guide. .

wrong URL, correct one is https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/the-ship-captains-medical-guide

 

[moomba]

forget about guns, it's pain in the ass to have one onboard, a lot of countries either forbid, or have extremely rigorous procedures regarding bringing guns into their country.
just follow the relevant websites, talk to other cruisers in the area (and try to verify what they say.....) and switch of your AIS transmitter in dodgy areas. The number of pirate attacks on sailing yachts is extremely small, and think how you feel if you mistakenly kill an innocent fisherman that approaches you to trade some fish for a bottle of beer...

You have a bigger change to get mugged when onshore.

Y up the down side of the gun, I more inclined not to , more hassle than its worth , but thanks for the input