MBM Princess 42 v Sealine F42 Video Boat Test

[Deleted User YDKXO]

http://www.motorboatsmonthly.co.uk/news/509809/princess-42-vs-sealine-f42

Come on MBM, this video is just rubbish. You call it a boat test. That implies there's a degree of comparison between the 2 boats, even some kind of spoken commentary but this is just a copy and paste montage of some old video footage and pics. Its not a boat test at all. Its a waste of my broadband subscription
Your video boat tests make the video boat tests on http://www.boattest.com/ look like Hollywood epics in comparison

 

[volvopaul]

http://www.motorboatsmonthly.co.uk/news/509809/princess-42-vs-sealine-f42

Come on MBM, this video is just rubbish. You call it a boat test. That implies there's a degree of comparison between the 2 boats, even some kind of spoken commentary but this is just a copy and paste montage of some old video footage and pics. Its not a boat test at all. Its a waste of my broadband subscription
Your video boat tests make the video boat tests on http://www.boattest.com/ look like Hollywood epics in comparison

Carefull Mike I had Tim B on my case for voicing my opinion last week.

 

[DAKA]

http://www.motorboatsmonthly.co.uk/news/509809/princess-42-vs-sealine-f42

Come on MBM, this video is just rubbish. You call it a boat test. That implies there's a degree of comparison between the 2 boats, even some kind of spoken commentary but this is just a copy and paste montage of some old video footage and pics. Its not a boat test at all. Its a waste of my broadband subscription
Your video boat tests make the video boat tests on http://www.boattest.com/ look like Hollywood epics in comparison

Iam probably not going to gain many buddies from this post Mike but please watch it again only this time bear in mind my last post on the Sealine F42 as the clip demonstrates perfectly what I tried to explain..........

Sealine were bought by Bayliners and have taken much of the design concept into the sealine F42.

Bayliners are very economical as they run on a flat aft hull and skim across the water, they are deliberately beamy and flat bottomed (at the aft).

Now watch the clip and note how much of the Bayliner hull is in the water and then notice the full waterline length of the Princess is in use.

You know as well as I do which one will give an acceptable ride in a F5 and which one will slam.

Now before anyone shoots at me please note I am a Bayliner lover, they are exceptionally good value and are very light making them the most ideal boat to trail, having taken one across the channel though I recognise their limitations.

I also played with one in the little russell earlier in the year and confirm the hull hasnt improved with age.

It should be noted that I have a great deal of respect for the Sealine 350, F36.F37, infact the whole range from 1989-2006 but the new brick shape models will without doubt leave many family's disappointed with their cruising holidays as they only briefly attempt to leave the solent once before being beaten back before the Shingles.

 

[longjohnsilver]

It should be noted that I have a great deal of respect for the Sealine 350, F36.F37, infact the whole range from 1989-2006 but the new brick shape models will without doubt leave many family's disappointed

An exclusive direct from Sealine

Thousands of designer man hours and millions of pounds were spent on development before this new shape evolved.

Unfortunately the final design, which was supposed to be announced at the London Boat Show, went instead to the London Brick Co (an easy mistake to make) and we ended up with the design for their latest brick, but by then it was too late, the press launch was imminent so we had to run with it.

 

[PowerYachtBlog]

Yes many Sportfish boats are flat aft, and have a wide beam and will give make many deep vees to shame in Force 5.
So comparing a Sealine to a Bayliner is very short minded.
Saying that your Princess is a deep vee hull is also wrong, as many Olsenski hulls do infact have a medium vee with an 18 degrees deadrise. The new 42 Squadron is like 12 degrees aft! There is some exceptions to this. A med vee is 10 to 19 degrees. You can call it a deep from 20 degrees upwards, and many few crusiing boats do actually have such a deadrise.
Still a deep vee does not always mean better comfort in rough water, a sure advantage is in a following sea, but even that depends on many factors. Hull design is a very complicated affair and if you think that a lot of angle aft, and being slim is just it you are 1000% wrong.
Surely if you want to go at 50 knots plus and jump on waves on a minus 30 feet a deep vee, or a Cat with high angles is your choice but under that speed, and over that size various other circumstances come to factor.
What is considered one of the best planning mono hulls that of the eighties Bertram 54 is infact a medium 18 degrees vee aft, with a 50 degrees forwards, and bell shape. I think the Olsenski hulls are very similar to this, altough still far away from its perfection.
Olsenski best hull in my opinion is also a medium vee which is that of the old Fairline 50 having an angle of 15 degrees aft.

 

[MikeJ42]

Iam probably not going to gain many buddies from this post Mike but please watch it again only this time bear in mind my last post on the Sealine F42 as the clip demonstrates perfectly what I tried to explain..........

Sealine were bought by Bayliners and have taken much of the design concept into the sealine F42.

Bayliners are very economical as they run on a flat aft hull and skim across the water, they are deliberately beamy and flat bottomed (at the aft).

Now watch the clip and note how much of the Bayliner hull is in the water and then notice the full waterline length of the Princess is in use.

You know as well as I do which one will give an acceptable ride in a F5 and which one will slam.

Now before anyone shoots at me please note I am a Bayliner lover, they are exceptionally good value and are very light making them the most ideal boat to trail, having taken one across the channel though I recognise their limitations.

I also played with one in the little russell earlier in the year and confirm the hull hasnt improved with age.

It should be noted that I have a great deal of respect for the Sealine 350, F36.F37, infact the whole range from 1989-2006 but the new brick shape models will without doubt leave many family's disappointed with their cruising holidays as they only briefly attempt to leave the solent once before being beaten back before the Shingles.

The princess is on conventional shafts. The Sealine is IPS.

Very different hull design and ride characteristics.

 

[DAKA]

I was just looking at the two videos view of evidence in the video.

I called the new sealine a Bayliner just to distinguish the 'new brick shape' from the old lines of pre Bayliner amalgamation.

It appears the Princess has been filmed during a F4-5 as there are plenty of distant white tops.
The whole length of the hull is utilised and in contact with the water.


It appears the Sealine (brick hull) is filmed in a 3-4, as there are no white tops but note the forward hull only makes contact with the water occasionally.

Its a bit like owning a 42 foot caravan (great use of space) but when out at sea it is reduced to a 28 foot fat , flat bottom hull , thats going to hurt in a F5 wind against tide.

This is just my opinion which I have deduced from watching the YBW video, I only posted in an attempt to suggest to Mike that the videos do have value to add .

 

[PowerYachtBlog]

Lol if that is a F5 you surely dont go out in real F5 a lot. That is a 3 and is a strecht to call it that way too. Not even 2 feet of wave height ter.
Enjoy your F5 I am sure I can do 100 knots in that sort of water even with a 10 footer.

BTW some new Sealines have also a Micheal Peters hull as the SC35 so saying they are **** behind the waterline is pure bullocks.
I personally dont like their shape too but to each his own. The world has a lot of different colors for this reason....

 

[Ubergeekian]

It appears the Sealine (brick hull) is filmed in a 3-4, as there are no white tops but note the forward hull only makes contact with the water occasionally.

It seems to be pitching a fair bit. To me, knowing nothing about motor boats, that looks potentially very tiring and uncomfortable. What would it be like with significant waves? (Genuine question)

 

[scubaman]

I was just looking at the two videos view of evidence in the video.

I called the new sealine a Bayliner just to distinguish the 'new brick shape' from the old lines of pre Bayliner amalgamation.

It appears the Princess has been filmed during a F4-5 as there are plenty of distant white tops.
The whole length of the hull is utilised and in contact with the water.


It appears the Sealine (brick hull) is filmed in a 3-4, as there are no white tops but note the forward hull only makes contact with the water occasionally.

Its a bit like owning a 42 foot caravan (great use of space) but when out at sea it is reduced to a 28 foot fat , flat bottom hull , thats going to hurt in a F5 wind against tide.

This is just my opinion which I have deduced from watching the YBW video, I only posted in an attempt to suggest to Mike that the videos do have value to add .

It may be just me, but to my eyes the Princess seems to be going somewhat slower (I'd say ~20 knots on most shots) than the Sealine (closer to 23 - 25 knots on most shots)? This is probably due to the difference in test conditions.

 

[DAKA]

It seems to be pitching a fair bit. To me, knowing nothing about motor boats, that looks potentially very tiring and uncomfortable. What would it be like with significant waves? (Genuine question)

In my opinion.........

as soon as you try to get passed Hurst point SWMBO will say

Urgh, oooh Pete is it going to be alright

Yes, its just wind against tide, dont worry it will calm down 1 mile passed the shingles.

Can we slow down please.

Daughter
I dont like it daddy can we go back

yes of course we will spent the holiday in Yarmouth

Yeh great we love it there daddy..............


After 3 days of been storm bound head for Gunwharf and put the family on a fast cat to St Peter Port, and take the Brick across on your own.

Most of it will be fine but anything above a F4 and you will be compressed as the boat slams into the on coming waves.

After about 4 days you will be able to take a gentle walk around the marina.

You often hear people grumbling about weather getting worse, I dont think it is, its just the boats are designed for boat show sales and dont give comfortable family cruising, families buy into a dream, get knocked about on the way to the Needles and sell up.

 

[DAKA]

just a thought .........

As others have said Sealine have spent a huge amount on designing this boat and in comparison I know nothing, suppose they actually knew exactly what they were designing in the knowledge that the cost of diesel would stop long sea passages and people would be happy to put up with 30 miles of driving a brick knowing that the accommodation is comparable to a 45 foot Prinlineseeker .

 

[gjgm]

http://www.motorboatsmonthly.co.uk/news/509809/princess-42-vs-sealine-f42

Its a waste of my broadband subscription

Times are tough for us motorboaters

I have only watched a few of these trips out on what looks like someones pond. And in these cases we didnt even get to see that dramatic high 5 of crossing 60cm of wake.
However, I do note that unlike most f/bridges these dont seem to be running at the obligatory 45 degree angle to the sky.
Bit dull to watch , I agree, but they usually are. But then, perhaps f/bridges are a bit boring !!
Over to JTB ...

 

[Ubergeekian]

You often hear people grumbling about weather getting worse, I dont think it is, its just the boats are designed for boat show sales and dont give comfortable family cruising, families buy into a dream, get knocked about on the way to the Needles and sell up.

It's similar in the sailing world. Bit flat cockpits and roomy cabins are great for entertaining in the marina or a gentle day sail but absolutely lousy for a bouncy trip at sea.

 

[mjf]

Lol if that is a F5 you surely dont go out in real F5 a lot. That is a 3 and is a strecht to call it that way too. Not even 2 feet of wave height ter.
Enjoy your F5 I am sure I can do 100 knots in that sort of water even with a 10 footer.

BTW some new Sealines have also a Micheal Peters hull as the SC35 so saying they are **** behind the waterline is pure bullocks.
I personally dont like their shape too but to each his own. The world has a lot of different colors for this reason....

Yes I have to agree its no way a F5 ;and F3 for the Sealine is pushing it too imho

 

[Carl MBM]

F42 vs P42 video

Ordinarily I'd take great pleasure in disagreeing with Mr F, but on one count (only one mind) he's right, we do suggest you will see the results of this head to head test and you don't, apologies, I'll change the wording.

The video, which is not old footage, shows the latest version of the P42 and is there more as an accompaniment to the magazine test. Of course it also shows how these boats run, which as MikeJ42 points out is very different due to hull design and a clash of pod vs shaft drive systems. I can't remember who posted it, but the point about running for a few hours into a F5 is an interesting one...

Looking forward we will be improving our video content quality and adding commentary so I trust you will see an overall improvement very soon...

 

[DAKA]

Of course it also shows how these boats run, which as MikeJ42 points out is very different due to hull design and a clash of pod vs shaft drive systems. I can't remember who posted it, but the point about running for a few hours into a F5 is an interesting one...

Whats the actual problem in finding waves ?

We seem to find a few somewhere everytime we go out !

Is the problem the amount of fuel it costs to get to sea ?
or lack of time due to corporate entertaining after the seatrial ?

Do cmpanies invite MBM for a seatrial or do MBM have to grovel and charter a boat to trial it ?


I dont see the point in clearing the Hamble speed limit, pulling a few donuts for the camera shoot and going back, its just not a seatrial , is it ?
where ever the seatrial is from there are usually waves to be found off the next headland , 1 hour away at most.

 

[AdeOlly]

I can't remember who posted it, but the point about running for a few hours into a F5 is an interesting one...

I posted that on the previous Sealine F42 'is it any good in a chop' thread. As mentioned by others, every other time we go out, even in the Solent, we seem to find much more chop than most of the tests. I would love to see video of these boats in one metre waves, and with F4 wind against tide you'll find these west of Cowes off Gurnard, at different speeds, and pictures of the helm and crew showing how much discomfort they're in. IMO, this is important stuff; pretty much the only time there is any sign of mutiny or concern on board our boat is when the sea cuts up and the going gets hard. Knowing just how much weather a boat can handle is vital and this is greatly influencing my thoughts as we look to upgrade from our current boat. (Though I'm not in the market for a 42 footer)

 

[MikeJ42]

Wide beam does not = poor ride quality.

I used to own an SC35. Obviously a completely different boat, but one of the new 'bricks' I keep seeing them referred to.

It won Mobo of the year in 2008. Not just cos of its internal space, but because of its class leading ride and handling. It was light years ahead of the 'old design' 34ft sports boat I had before that. My comments are based on practical experience.

Love them or hate theem, Sealine have changed the game with these new boats. The old rules don't apply (especially when you also factor IPS).

 

[Deleted User YDKXO]

Wide beam does not = poor ride quality.

Agree with that. Both of my Ferrettis, like most of them, are beamier than the average Brit built boat but I certainly wouldn't say the ride is worse, especially my current 53 which is a very good sea boat IMHO. Its a balance of many factors including deadrise angle, total weight, weight distribution and fore/aft trim. To say narrow beam = good ride is an over simplification certainly in the 20-35knot speed range that most leisure boats perform at.
To be fair to the new F42, I dont think you can tell from this video how the boat rides in the rough compared to the P42. For starters, we dont know where the tabs are set; the P42 looks very trimmed down to me. We dont know the relative speeds and we certainly dont know how each feels when they are being driven (that'll be because the video doesn't tell us) but I'm prepared to believe the good things the mags say about the F42 as far as it's seakeeping is concerned