Mast Sail Track Extension?

[conks01]

Hi,

I'm looking for the best advice here as I have an issue and I'm over-complicating things as normal.

So, I'm looking to return all lines to the cockpit including the main halyard. Prior to this I was going forward to hoist and the new mainsail whilst stored in a stack pack, went up fine albeit I had to feed in the last 4 slides by hand as for whatever reason (& probably when the new sails were made they were not sized correctly for the sail track?) there's not enough room for them to sit in the existing mast sail track.

I need to extend the track therefore by approx 265mm. The track is 4mm wide.

I've thought about fixing to alu' angled strips either side to form the 4mm gap/track extension but this won't work due to the lip/height of opening above (the gap is also 22mm wide). See pics below.

I'm wondering if anyone else has had this issue and had a workable solution? I was thinking whether I could fit a length of ply (strip) within the 22mm gap and then fix to that with an Allen (or similar) sail track extension but can't see this working either.

As I say I'm sure I'm over-complicating this!

Any guidance greatly appreciated.

Thanks.

 

[andsarkit]

It looks like you have a sliding gooseneck and downhaul as I have. It is not easy to bring the lines back as you need to adjust the halyard, downhaul, kicker and topping lift. I have given up and accept going to the mast for raising the main and reefing.
A machine shop could make up suitable track from aluminium bar but it might be expensive. I don't know if you can source a short length of something like this in UK and bend the tabs to align the track perhaps riveting on the inside of the existing gap. It would require careful alignment to run smoothly. Track

 

[Daydream believer]

It looks like you have a sliding gooseneck and downhaul as I have. It is not easy to bring the lines back as you need to adjust the halyard, downhaul, kicker and topping lift

If one has the halyard back to the cockpit there is no need to go forward to adjust the boom downhaul. Just leave it permanently locked down & adjust the halyard on a winch on the cabin. One would want to adjust tension when sailing anyway. The kicker is easy to bring aft . The topping lift can be fixed & then adjusted by a small tackle on the end of the boom with a cleat. This is a very convenient system when in the cockpit.
I might ask if the mast was originally meant for a bolt rope rather than sliders. Also , being a short length why is it necessary to worry about that amount of unsupported sail. Or is the problem when the sail is in the lowered position? ie. it does not stack low enough to the boom & is too high for reefing.

To experiment you might insert a piece of 15mm osma water pipe suitably split in its length & shoved up the groove . Perhaps Overflow pipe or similar might do.

 

[conks01]

It looks like you have a sliding gooseneck and downhaul as I have. It is not easy to bring the lines back as you need to adjust the halyard, downhaul, kicker and topping lift. I have given up and accept going to the mast for raising the main and reefing.
A machine shop could make up suitable track from aluminium bar but it might be expensive. I don't know if you can source a short length of something like this in UK and bend the tabs to align the track perhaps riveting on the inside of the existing gap. It would require careful alignment to run smoothly. Track
View attachment 152934 View attachment 152943

Thanks!

 

[Dellquay13]

I’m looking at fabricating (big word for what will most likely be a bodge) two plates to close my mast gate from aluminium carpet door tread plate, including turning the edge over to match the internal depth of the mast track, so I can replace my bolt rope main with one with sail slides that packs neat down to the boom track.
I’ve got the worst of both worlds at the moment, a bolt rope that needs feeding in at the mast from the stack pack, but a halyard taken back to the cockpit which I can’t tension or make fast from the mast.

 

[Tranona]

A common way of solving that problem when changing from rope to slides is to do what is on the mast in the original post. A split pin through a hole drilled in the mast wall. Pin on a wire or rope strop so it does not get lost.

 

[conks01]

I’m looking at fabricating (big word for what will most likely be a bodge) two plates to close my mast gate from aluminium carpet door tread plate, including turning the edge over to match the internal depth of the mast track, so I can replace my bolt rope main with one with sail slides that packs neat down to the boom track.
I’ve got the worst of both worlds at the moment, a bolt rope that needs feeding in at the mast from the stack pack, but a halyard taken back to the cockpit which I can’t tension or make fast from the mast.View attachment 152972

Nice one. If you can let me know how it goes please

 

[Dellquay13]

A common way of solving that problem when changing from rope to slides is to do what is on the mast in the original post. A split pin through a hole drilled in the mast wall. Pin on a wire or rope strop so it does not get lost.

An alternative I was told was to simply drill and tap a bolt in at the top of the gate to stop the sliders falling down and out, but it would be a bit high for reefing and I would like to get the sail to pack away low down into the existing stackpack, to save expensive canvas alterations

 

[DownWest]

You could pop rivit two bits of ally strip to 'lengthen' the narrow bit of the track ? So as to keep the sliders in place. It won't effect the strength of the mast.

 

[wilkinsonsails]

Selden do a short insert track section that we have fitted to get over this issue ,it fits in the space of the bolt rope entry and can be cut to make up the distance to the gooseneck l

 

[Dellquay13]

Selden do a short insert track section that we have fitted to get over this issue ,it fits in the space of the bolt rope entry and can be cut to make up the distance to the gooseneck l

I have seen one or two from Selden online but whatever the quality and ease of use, and hidden expenses of production, at around £130 it’s way over my budget, hence attempting DIY from sub £6 bits

 

[Dellquay13]

You could pop rivit two bits of ally strip to 'lengthen' the narrow bit of the track ? So as to keep the sliders in place. It won't effect the strength of the mast.

There are some examples of that done on a website by ‘the stingy sailor’ that gave me my ideas

 

[conks01]

If one has the halyard back to the cockpit there is no need to go forward to adjust the boom downhaul. Just leave it permanently locked down & adjust the halyard on a winch on the cabin. One would want to adjust tension when sailing anyway. The kicker is easy to bring aft . The topping lift can be fixed & then adjusted by a small tackle on the end of the boom with a cleat. This is a very convenient system when in the cockpit.
I might ask if the mast was originally meant for a bolt rope rather than sliders. Also , being a short length why is it necessary to worry about that amount of unsupported sail. Or is the problem when the sail is in the lowered position? ie. it does not stack low enough to the boom & is too high for reefing.

To experiment you might insert a piece of 15mm osma water pipe suitably split in its length & shoved up the groove . Perhaps Overflow pipe or similar might do.

Thanks and yes, the problem is the stack and reefing position.

 

[conks01]

You could pop rivit two bits of ally strip to 'lengthen' the narrow bit of the track ? So as to keep the sliders in place. It won't effect the strength of the mast.

Yes thanks and I've tried that. The wider opening above sits proud so the alu strips would be higher and not flush as I found out!

 

[Daydream believer]

Thanks and yes, the problem is the stack and reefing position.

That is a problem. Adding strips to the outside may be an issue because any pop rivets etc will poke into the track void & interfere with the slider movement.
If you thing that you can place pop rivets such that they do not foul the sliders then B & Q sell an anodised nosing approx 25mm wide with a small "L" angle on the front which would turn into the channel & help hold the sliders back into the groove.

I would still look for a plastic pipe with a thin walled section. Plastic will not damage the aluminium anodising etc when experimenting.
If the plastic is thin walled it should not stop the sliders dropping as you lower the sail. I would then slit the pipe enough to enable it to be compressed & pushed up the void. The slit will close up as it will be in compression. It needs to be so it fits tight round the edge of the luff groove. Then using a fine toothed saw gently run up the sail groove & remove enough of the plastic to allow the sliders to drop down by widening the slot in the plastic tube. It will stay in place as it will be in compression. You can widen it at the very bottom to allow you to remove the sail.

 

[Dellquay13]

Yes thanks and I've tried that. The wider opening above sits proud so the alu strips would be higher and not flush as I found out!

I think my problem is simpler than yours, but my early experiments at home involved turning the edge of the aluminium strip by gently hammering to form a lip that hopefully matches the inner profile of the mast slot.
I’m planning on getting to the boat this coming weekend and will report back if I have any success with my carpet strip gates.

Looking again at your pictures, I would consider the split plastic tubing as well, it isn’t disimilar in concept to nylon inserts made by MastGate for American catalina masts

 

[oldbloke]

You could just adjust the spacing of the slides so that you have 4 fewer

 

[Egbod]

I have a mast with a slot entry like Dellquay 13. I made up 2 shaped plates from pieces of Z Spars spreader extrusion. These are attached with self tapping screws. The angle at the back edge was correct to link up my track that now allows sail sliders to reach the bottom of the track. The extrusion is stronger than some aluminium and is anodised.

 

[Daydream believer]

You could just adjust the spacing of the slides so that you have 4 fewer

But surely that still does not solve the problem of the sail dropping out of the track when it is lowered or when he wants to reef

 

[oldbloke]

But surely that still does not solve the problem of the sail dropping out of the track when it is lowered or when he wants to reef

Does mean he has enough space. Stopping them dropping out is a hole and a split pin