Sticky Fingers
Well-Known Member
It means at the very least that there’s no usable evidence that VAT is paid.
Market Madness?
- Thread starter Farmer Piles
- Start date
Seastoke
Well-Known Member
When are we seeing your new boat.
henryf
Well-Known Member
[
QUOTE="ShaneAtSea, post: 7828419, member: 180626"]
Ive seen loads of second hand boats online where they say 'VAT NOT PAID'
Maybe theyre imported
[/QUOTE]
I suspect it means the boats are vat qualifying. They were purchased by a vat registered entity who used them in the course of their business and as such were able to reclaim the vat.
Upon selling the vessel vat will be applied and listed separately on the invoice. Vat may be reclaimed if exporting from the UK or using as part of your vat registered business.
There are other scenarios where a boat is used somewhere on a temporary basis Or brought into the UK by a vat registered entity with the sole intention to re-sell.
In terms of risk the larger and newer the boat the higher the risk. An old rib on a trailer is less likely to be questioned than a large shiny boat pulling into a port. As has been mentioned already when it comes time to sell on thats where problems can arise. You definitely want to see proof of vat status if buying second hand. Ideally a string of invoices from new or back to a point where vat is listed and paid.
QUOTE="ShaneAtSea, post: 7828419, member: 180626"]
Ive seen loads of second hand boats online where they say 'VAT NOT PAID'
Maybe theyre imported
[/QUOTE]
I suspect it means the boats are vat qualifying. They were purchased by a vat registered entity who used them in the course of their business and as such were able to reclaim the vat.
Upon selling the vessel vat will be applied and listed separately on the invoice. Vat may be reclaimed if exporting from the UK or using as part of your vat registered business.
There are other scenarios where a boat is used somewhere on a temporary basis Or brought into the UK by a vat registered entity with the sole intention to re-sell.
In terms of risk the larger and newer the boat the higher the risk. An old rib on a trailer is less likely to be questioned than a large shiny boat pulling into a port. As has been mentioned already when it comes time to sell on thats where problems can arise. You definitely want to see proof of vat status if buying second hand. Ideally a string of invoices from new or back to a point where vat is listed and paid.
Martxer
Well-Known Member
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ShaneAtSea
Well-Known Member
Sales tax on a boat in Florida is only 6% up to a maximum of $18,000 & just a little further up the coast in South Carolina its 6% with a maximum of $500
The USA has its faults but they really love their boaters
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Portofino
Well-Known Member
Arh good old “ sales tax “ .What ever happened to that ?Sales tax on a boat in Florida is only 6% up to a maximum of $18,000 & just a little further up the coast in South Carolina its 6% with a maximum of $500
The USA has its faults but they really love its boaters
Thank the EU for the current VAT predicament.
On 1 January 1973 the UK joined the European Economic Community and as a consequence Purchase Tax was replaced by Value Added Tax on 1 April 1973. The Conservative Chancellor Lord Barber set a single VAT rate (10%) on most goods and services.
Bit early yet and few plates spinning in gov at the mo , but the UK can call it’s own shots now .
ShaneAtSea
Well-Known Member
Would be good for the government to introduce different tax bands depending on the value of the boat.
So a low tax band for boats under £500,000 then another one for boats under £1m....etc etc
As an island nation we should encourage people to get on the water not make it harder
Cant see that happening when they are raising taxes and inventing new ones.....expect a new tax on meat, sugar and salt any day now
?
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Portofino
Well-Known Member
Precisely. Baby steps and all that .
re boat industry.
Stimulus .Menu .
MPs for Poole / Plymouth/ Oundle lobby for …..
As you say lower tax in new boats.
I,ll go further …..tax relief on E boats = bats , solar , scale of Hp s so lower D speeders are better .
Rate holidays for the factories.
Free gov loans to buy land next door to expand .
PAYE and NI reductions for said factory workers .
Hows a bout this one tax relief on boat loans ( mortgages ) to buy a U.K. manufactured boat only .
Gov subsidiary for manufacturers taking on apprenticeships folks .
The list is endless .Once you have “ taken back control “ of course .
You can pull and adjust the “ playing field “ as you want .Welcome to a high wage , high skill , high manufacturers ( in terms of value and quality ) economy …..see Switzerland ??.
This inc boats Brit boats the quality will catch up and shine through.
Ferretti group changed there culture circa 2018 ish .Despite fears of the current Chinese owners wanting to drag it down to a more global wider market quality wise , counterintuitively they went the other way .Quality up market with that extra price premium.
They still sell its a niche low vol market boats effecting the 0.01% …..new boats that is .
ari
Well-Known Member
Hmmm... I guess if you wanted to make it really fair, you could make it so that the bloke A buying a new boat for twice as much as bloke B pays twice as much VAT?
Some sort of percentage calculation perhaps...
AllanG
Well-Known Member
No chance in hell that the Gov will reduce VAT when we currently owe ££££ trillions!!! ??
ShaneAtSea
Well-Known Member
Portofino
Well-Known Member
Not so sure ,They have reduced duty on U.K. wine and cider .So differentiating it from say EU identical products.……….because they can NOW no running for permission from Andrea VDL et al .
Did not mean all VAT , meant bend the playing fields , tweak the rules - in fact write your own in favour of U.K. produced goods .
UKs growths forecast @6.5 % by the OBR.
EUs states a lot lower if any at all ?
Yes there’s a bit of Covid debt but a growth spurt( with associated inflation) will wipe that out .Suneeeker / Princess / FL are at full capacity , it’s just a case of growing those volumes .
Nice for the workers nearby and the supply chains .
If the boats are selling themselves with a hefty VAT rake from HMG then jolly good .The industry’s playing fields do not need a tweek .Yet !
The bigger ones bought by U.K. citizens and sent to the Med can now benefit from the TI scheme.
Not restricted to U.K. boats to any EU boat tax free based in the Med .What’s not to like ?
I think there will be growth of Brits in the Med boaty scene near the boundaries as more and more take advantage of the 3 P vat free status .Loyal bunch so good news for U.K. builders .
Or a tech solution to 3 P leaving EU waters ?Plotter trace etc then a equal spread of vat free Brits through out the Med .
Either way works .
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petem
Well-Known Member
We've always been free to set our own wine and beer duty, that's why it's announced in every budget.
Hooligan
Well-Known Member
This actually is not the point. There are many reasons to finance things. One could be that that is the only way to do it. Another is that you can actually invest cash for a greater return than the cost of your finance therefore you may feel that paying cash for 100 pc of the boat is not sensible given where rates are. . In fact over the past 10 years this is entirely the case in most scenarios. Everyone who buys a boat makes choices that work for them. The concept that they are foolish because they finance it is idiotic. Your Father made choices based on what was good for him I assume based upon his income his liabilities and the choices he wished to make. Good for him. It would be sensible not to assume that your Father’s choices should apply to everyone.
Hooligan
Well-Known Member
A sensible balanced equity portfolio would have far outperformed any cost of finance over the past 10 years. With interest rates likely to rise now I would personally be a little more cautious going forward but I suspect that if you are sensible you are always better to take out some finance.
ShaneAtSea
Well-Known Member
The maximum you can boat finance for is 15 years but you have to pay 30% up front.
The reason i plan to sell the boat after 2 years is because a new boat comes with 3 years warranty and i want to sell with at least 1 year warranty left on it. That way i hope it holds a bit more value than if it had no warranty.
And obviously having yearly servicing on the engines, generators etc will help to
Fortunately, i have enough assets that i dont need to take specific boat finance and i can get a cash loan so it gives me more wiggle room and a lower APR so 2 years of payments on a 15 year loan is going to be a really small amount.
If i sold the boat after 2 years and broke even i would be happy but its not likely. But its no different from buying a car.....as soon as you drive it off the forecourt it starts to lose money
prinex
Well-Known Member
I think depreciation in the first years is the most ? At least for cars.
If you have cash as security you may be better off buying a 5 years old boat if you plan to sell it 2 years later.
If you have cash as security you may be better off buying a 5 years old boat if you plan to sell it 2 years later.
ShaneAtSea
Well-Known Member
Why do i want to buy a boat that 5 years old?
The older boats they are the more TLC they need and would take the fun out of boating.
Also, as i said in my previous comment i want a boat that has a warranty
Portofino
Well-Known Member
1 - depo risk is better managed .Why do i want to buy a boat that 5 years old?
The older boats they are the more TLC they need and would take the fun out of boating.
Also, as i said in my previous comment i want a boat that has a warranty
2- PO s lavish upgrades are effectively free like extras on car to a point .Like the jet rib etc , audio , SS steel anchor + chain etc etc etc
3- It’s debugged .
Above are no brainier facts
Then in imho your phone .
Yep the pressure to up grade you mob is removed because a lower bat life is more liveable because you won’t be on tenterhooks every day waiting for the repair guys under warranty .Or wasting your life organising repairs and debugs .Stressing out with the arguments etc etc .
Wondering if the dealer is gonna go bust ( particularly in the states ) before fixing the faults .
Or marina stuck awaiting a replay to a msg .
Or sat in the middle of a ping pong match , twitching every time said phone pings = builder blames supplier ? supplier blames installer ( builder ) = fault lingers on and on .You are waiting with a mile long email trail with the same intermittent fault .
This is because the PO went through all this for you within the first 2/3 years .
Cruising plans ……more likely foiled by a newie .- not a factor in the floating apartment usage granted .
If it’s a new shaper , new hull or low HIN then all of the above but toss in structural defects surfacing and being stone walled .
All avoidable ^^^^ as said buy a 5 y old one with a double digit HIN .
GravyStain
Well-Known Member
Agree.
Mortgage rates are so cheap currently. Accessing 5 year fixed deals at sub 1.5% {personal} or at 3% for a business is easy.
These rates make it relatively easy to make money in the medium term.
Do the bankers know something we don't? I can't believe there is a financial storm coming any time soon when I am being offered these rates regularly.
Additionally, if you're financial profile is such that affording finance is relatively risk free then I see no issue with it.