Marine conservation Zones

[Daydream believer]

I am just reading the March Issue of PBO - logbook which mentions proposed marine conservation areas
as anybody had the time to wade through all the documents on line to establish what this means for yachtsmen?
Apparently the good old RYA are in favour as they only object to one area
But the article suggests restrictions on anchoring etc
We all know these rules are designed on the " EU" system whereby they get going then gradually add bits that were never declared at the start but were clearly intended

So does anyone know what the real underlying intention is & how it will affect yachtsmen.
Other than protecting seas slugs & giving jobs to their landbased equivalents which is obvious

 

[vyv_cox]

Use the search facility up above, enter 'conservation zone' or even just 'zone' and you will find many theads and posts on the topic. Search does not seem to work on 'MCZ'. You could also search on the poster 'oldharry' who is a leading figure in representing yachting interests in fighting MCZs.

 

[Sans Bateau]

Indeed, as VC says. In fact if it were not for OldHarry and the RYA, reigning in teh career conservationists, restrictions within the MCZ's would be far more draconian than they are.

 

[oldharry]

Take a look at http://boatownersresponse.org.uk/. Menu LH side "BORG list of MCZs" gives up to date info on whats happening where.

PM me if you want to know more

 

[st599]

I am just reading the March Issue of PBO - logbook which mentions proposed marine conservation areas
as anybody had the time to wade through all the documents on line to establish what this means for yachtsmen?
Apparently the good old RYA are in favour as they only object to one area
But the article suggests restrictions on anchoring etc
We all know these rules are designed on the " EU" system whereby they get going then gradually add bits that were never declared at the start but were clearly intended

So does anyone know what the real underlying intention is & how it will affect yachtsmen.
Other than protecting seas slugs & giving jobs to their landbased equivalents which is obvious

I don't think that's fair - the RYA have done a lot of work on this - the proposals are down from 130+ locations to 20+.


Simon

 

[prv]

I don't think that's fair - the RYA have done a lot of work on this - the proposals are down from 130+ locations to 20+.

Plus there's more to it than just locations - more important is what restrictions are going to be placed on each site. I think the career control-freaks wanted the default assumption to be no activity whatsoever - a completely sealed area you'd have to sail round - but that looks less and less likely.

Pete

 

[Marmalade]

The salami slicing of the plan makes it difficult to make a coherent objection - or indeed to know whether an objection is warranted. At the moment, the consultation is purely about whether the proposed areas should be designated as MCZs. What happens once an area is designated? Well according to the documents, there will then be a management plan aimed at managing activities which are deemed harmful to the objectives of the conservation area. So (in extremis I hope) if the objective is to protect species A, and sailing over their heads is deemed harmful (or anchoring near their habitats???) then the harmful activity will be "managed" which I take to mean banned.

They say that further consultation on these management plans will take place prior to them being implemented. Thing is... it's hard to object at this stage because you have no idea what they're going to ban, curtail, restrict or make unlawful. Simply put (and I sail in a proposed MCZ) if they designate the area and limit the amount of commercial oyster fishing (reduced pots and floaty obstructions) I'm pretty relaxed (although some Oystermen won't be). If, on the other hand, they ban sailing altogether I'd be pretty un-relaxed.

Whatever they do will upset a subset of the current users of the area. Whether you object may well depend on which subset you fall into...

 

[Daydream believer]

I don't think that's fair - the RYA have done a lot of work on this - the proposals are down from 130+ locations to 20+.


Simon

I am only going by the report in PBO. If you think they are unfair to the RYA I suggest you tell them. Clearly if the RYA have been actively engaged in reducing these proposals then that is good.
However, i suspect that is like the Daily Mail. They they are starting some campaign or other then do little but when the objectives of the campaign are reached due to some outside influence or other the Mail claims responsibility. I suspect the original proposers did not want 130 but put them up as possibles. Hey presto those that object can claim a victory if only 20 get accepted
I was not actively setting out to knock the RYA . There are enough knockers about. However, i am concerned that these proposals may affect our moorings & club activities on the river Blackwater. Once we have the principle law in place it will creep up on us. Antifoulling will be the first item

 

[Grumpybear]

I am only going by the report in PBO. If you think they are unfair to the RYA I suggest you tell them. Clearly if the RYA have been actively engaged in reducing these proposals then that is good.
However, i suspect that is like the Daily Mail. They they are starting some campaign or other then do little but when the objectives of the campaign are reached due to some outside influence or other the Mail claims responsibility. I suspect the original proposers did not want 130 but put them up as possibles. Hey presto those that object can claim a victory if only 20 get accepted
I was not actively setting out to knock the RYA . There are enough knockers about. However, i am concerned that these proposals may affect our moorings & club activities on the river Blackwater. Once we have the principle law in place it will creep up on us. Antifoulling will be the first item

Suggest you and others need to set up an organisation like BORG to make a properly researched and logical contribution to the debate, challenging poor science and prejudice wherever it arises. OldHarry and his team have shown that the extremists can be pushed back, and rational argument listened to. You may find such a group existing or germinating on your patch already.

As responsible water users, we can make a difference.

 

[prv]

i am concerned that these proposals may affect our moorings & club activities on the river Blackwater. Once we have the principle law in place it will creep up on us. Antifoulling will be the first item

But you've only just noticed, whereas the rest of us have been worrying about (and in some honourable cases, doing an excellent job of fighting) them for literally years. Obviously you can't help not having heard until now, but it does make you sound a little silly when you pop up as if it were a new thing.

Pete

 

[Matador]

Hello, the River Lynher where our sailing club is and our boats are moored is already a SSSI, conservation area and AOONB! Now they want to make it an MCZ, does that override the previous status of the river? Cheers, Matador.

 

[Daydream believer]

But you've only just noticed, whereas the rest of us have been worrying about (and in some honourable cases, doing an excellent job of fighting) them for literally years. Obviously you can't help not having heard until now, but it does make you sound a little silly when you pop up as if it were a new thing.

Pete

Steady on!!
How was i supposed to know?
It is not the sort of thing that comes up in the daily mail or on the news every day & if i have not read this forum for some years then apart from the odd mag article where would i have been told ?
I am an active yacht club member & to the best of my knowledge no one has ever mentioned it
I look after 84 moorings but no one has written to me & said -"oi we want to b....r up your mooring rights"
I thought that when the gov't wanted to introduce new legislation they asked all interested parties -first then introduced it
I never suggested it was new but the article in PBO just raised my awareness to ask the question
Perhaps I should have trawled through hundreds of forum entries first but i also have a life
As for others doing an excellent job fighting -then perhaps you can give some evidence- or is that another "daily mail campaign?" Job

 

[RobbieW]

Steady on!!
How was i supposed to know?
It is not the sort of thing that comes up in the daily mail or on the news every day & if i have not read this forum for some years then apart from the odd mag article where would i have been told ?
I am an active yacht club member & to the best of my knowledge no one has ever mentioned it
I look after 84 moorings but no one has written to me & said -"oi we want to b....r up your mooring rights"
I thought that when the gov't wanted to introduce new legislation they asked all interested parties -first then introduced it
I never suggested it was new but the article in PBO just raised my awareness to ask the question
Perhaps I should have trawled through hundreds of forum entries first but i also have a life
As for others doing an excellent job fighting -then perhaps you can give some evidence- or is that another "daily mail campaign?" Job

P'raps Pete was a little harsh, esp given your join date of Oct 2012. For evidence of the work try a Google search on 'ybw studland seahorse' that'll give you a good start. oldharry has already given you a link to BORG, set up to combat specifically these MCZ designations, and offered more info via a PM - I'd suggest you take him up on that

 

[oldharry]

Hello, the River Lynher where our sailing club is and our boats are moored is already a SSSI, conservation area and AOONB! Now they want to make it an MCZ, does that override the previous status of the river? Cheers, Matador.

No, simply reinforces it, and makes it easier to apply further restrictions or limitations in the interests of 'conservation'

 

[Daydream believer]

But you've only just noticed, whereas the rest of us have been worrying about (and in some honourable cases, doing an excellent job of fighting) them for literally years. Obviously you can't help not having heard until now, but it does make you sound a little silly when you pop up as if it were a new thing.

Pete

As a total coincidence the chairman of our mooring committe handed me a letter 1 hour ago from the National Maritime Team which he received this morning
It is telling him( as a landowner) that they intend to start surveying the area
Like me he had not a clue about any of this but presumably the yacht club etc will now start to take note.
As the clerk to the fairway committe i will be expected to update the mooring holders etc
So i do need now to start beginning to understand the implications
Thanks for the BORG link as a starter. Any other links would be appreciated

 

[Tranona]

Steady on!!
How was i supposed to know?
It is not the sort of thing that comes up in the daily mail or on the news every day & if i have not read this forum for some years then apart from the odd mag article where would i have been told ?
I am an active yacht club member & to the best of my knowledge no one has ever mentioned it
I look after 84 moorings but no one has written to me & said -"oi we want to b....r up your mooring rights"
I thought that when the gov't wanted to introduce new legislation they asked all interested parties -first then introduced it
I never suggested it was new but the article in PBO just raised my awareness to ask the question
Perhaps I should have trawled through hundreds of forum entries first but i also have a life
As for others doing an excellent job fighting -then perhaps you can give some evidence- or is that another "daily mail campaign?" Job

This issue has been widely reported in the yachting press, particularly PBO ever since it came up. Although the RYA were a bit slow off the mark, once they took it seriously they have been very active at both a local and national level and provide members with a regular update on progress.

As you will see when you read BORG material one of the big problems is the moving goalposts and the number of organisations which have an interest in pushing the legislation forward. Changing government policy does not help, although the result is that government seems to have listened a bit to the objections and backed off. This has put perhaps more emphasis on local plans so making it even more important for local people to fight their corner by finding out how the published plans are likely to affect them and gathering their evidence to support their case.

 

[l'escargot]

...Any other links would be appreciated

You can get the official government line from DEFRA http://www.defra.gov.uk/environment/marine/protect/mpa/mcz/ and the conservation view from the government conservation advisers JNCC http://jncc.defra.gov.uk/page-4525

 

[Sans Bateau]

Steady on!!
How was i supposed to know?
It is not the sort of thing that comes up in the daily mail or on the news every day & if i have not read this forum for some years then apart from the odd mag article where would i have been told ?
I am an active yacht club member & to the best of my knowledge no one has ever mentioned it
I look after 84 moorings but no one has written to me & said -"oi we want to b....r up your mooring rights"
I thought that when the gov't wanted to introduce new legislation they asked all interested parties -first then introduced it
I never suggested it was new but the article in PBO just raised my awareness to ask the question
Perhaps I should have trawled through hundreds of forum entries first but i also have a life
As for others doing an excellent job fighting -then perhaps you can give some evidence- or is that another "daily mail campaign?" Job

I agree with RobbieW, Pete has been a little harsh with his post, I'm sure he didnt mean any offence.

However your OP and the one at #15 highlights a concern which I have had for a very long time and that is of publicity. The conservationists have had the benefit of BBC air time, not just once, but on several occasions. Not everyone buys a sailing mag, if you only buy one on the odd occasion, it would be easy to miss the news of MCZ's. There are many people who only visit their boats at a weekend in the season, those who are 'holiday' boat owners. I have spoken to several people in my own marina who have been surprised when they hear of the emerging MCZ's. I have inserted a couple of articles in our berth holders newsletter, to be greeted with reassurance from a well meaning individual, who assured me "I'm sure that the harbour conservancy will be taking care of it", will they? Will they hell!

There are people on this forum who will be surprised to hear of the developments, I'm convinced, they spend loads of time arguing the toss about this that and the other, but will leave the hard work of fighting for the rights of boat owners to others.

You would not begin to believe the hard work and time that OldHarry has dedicated to this, and that goes back to 2008 when the first alarm bells rang.

If you have concerns for your own area, and that is aimed at anyone reading this post, then you need to do some reading, get Mr Google working and do some research because one it will be too late and there will be no going back.

 

[Sans Bateau]

. Although the RYA were a bit slow off the mark, once they took it seriously they have been very active at both a local and national level and provide members with a regular update on progress.

The RYA were not slow off the mark, Gus Lewis, Legal and Government Affairs Manager at the RYA, did a lot of work thrashing out a better deal right at the outset. What the RYA were not good at was publicity. Old Harry and I gave them a roasting over this on our first meeting there. To some degree the RYA still rely on Borg and the forum as a channel to the boating community. I suspect more people visit the forum than the RYA web site.

 

[Boathook]

The RYA were not slow off the mark, Gus Lewis, Legal and Government Affairs Manager at the RYA, did a lot of work thrashing out a better deal right at the outset. What the RYA were not good at was publicity. Old Harry and I gave them a roasting over this on our first meeting there. To some degree the RYA still rely on Borg and the forum as a channel to the boating community. I suspect more people visit the forum than the RYA web site.

To be fair to the RYA, they have had articles in a magazine over the last couple? of years, but this did seem to happen after it had been a sticky on Scuttlebucket for a period. I do agree that they have not pushed it heavily as they should have and rarely visit their website as there is more interesting items here !