Man Over-Board Deployment - Student Project

[prv]

Having lost a couple of horseshoe buoys we use a pair of bungees with balls on the ends to keep our horseshoes on the boat.

And indeed I have an elastic strap over the top of mine with a big ring to grab and release it. Nothing wrong with a quick-release attachment system, but that's not what these charter boats generally had. Typical would be the line from buoy to drogue clove-hitched around the buoy frame where it can't be seen, or the end of the grab-rope on the buoy fastened around the rail with a bowline, or several turns and a big messy knot made in the line from horseshoe to dan bouy, again with the coil shoved on top so that the knot is hidden.

Pete

 

[rogerthebodger]

I had a cover made for my horseshoe buoys that is held on by velcro so one pull and the cover is off and a second pull and the life buoy, light, dan buoy and drogue is released all within arms reach of the helm. The cover is also released giving a crumb trail as well.

The cover also protects the life buoy from the sun.

 

[KellysEye]

Jess another thought that I've mentioned before when a design student was asking for ideas. Design is the same as starting a new business if you start a company where there is already competition you will almost certainly fail, if nothing else they will undercut your price. The only way to succeed is to start something that is new, for example I started the UK's first web design company and the world's first and now biggest discounted yacht charter company. In the design area Dyson is the perfect model.

This assumes that you want to design something to make loads of money. If you just want to impress in the exam then a design that has improved something should work. But it might be easier in an area larger than sailing.

 

[alant]

Unless they've changed it, the piston at the end of the CO₂ tube actually just knocks the Jon Buoy buckle open to release it, no blades or cutting.

It's always seemed a bizarrely overcomplicated system to me, but I guess the rationale was to avoid having electrical components sitting on the rail getting wet. So the electrics are kept safe below decks and the more robust gas-operated part of the system is all that protrudes above.

I've considered making my own which would use a bowden cable to pull the release handle down, activated either manually (like a red-painted engine-stop knob) or by a substantial solenoid mounted below deck and one or more pairs of trigger buttons (have to hold down both buttons in a pair simultaneously to prevent accidental release).

I'm glad to hear it inflates "violently", as one account of the Prue Nash incident suggested it activated rather sluggishly in that case. I service mine each year but have never tried it - I almost did a trial activation drill last month in fact, but Ocean Safety never responded to my email about getting a replacement cylinder.

Pete

The cylinder on ours, was same as LJ cylinder.

 

[alant]

I agree that more people probably fall out of tenders, and that most MOB's can be prevented at source by tethers etc.
However, the point remains that people occasionally fall of yachts, and some of them are recovered.
It is clear to me from the boats I've sailed on that many MOB setups could be improved.



I am drawn back to the old RORC rule:
One item of MOB equipment shall be able to be IMMEDIATELY deployed by the HELMSMAN
or words to that effect.

In my view, many yachts could improve their MOB gear.
It must go over the back instantly
The Helmsman must be able to do that with one hand, while keeping control of the boat.

The key thing is to get the horseshoe and danbuoy in the water damn close to the MOB
That means it needs to be over the side in seconds, so the casualty has a chance of swimming to the float.
On my boat, we have a danbuoy in a tube in the transom.
The two horseshoes each have a light and a weighted drogue and some floating line holding it all together.
It is all packed so one hand taking the horseshoe off its bracket dumps the light.
It works, because the wheel is right at the back of the boat.

My instructions are that you dump the nearer horseshoe. If that's not the one with the danbuoy pole, dump that as well if it might help.

Making it all work so quickly in a boat where the helm is not so close to the transom might be interesting.
Or so that it can be done from elsewhere on the boat.

You see a lot of boats with nasty tangles, or even clips that have to be released to get the horseshoes out.

A mate went MoB off the back of his Moody 38, off Port Elizabeth (possibly having a pee & no LJ).
Helm couldn't deploy any horseshoe & by the time he & off watch crew turned the boat around, it was too late, they never found him.
Not sure he, or any of his 'hitchhiker' crew, had ever practised MoB.

 

[Ripster]

Done - good luck with the project. A very worthwhile subject.

 

[alant]

All done, If it could fire off all the equipment by the person who fell in the water (proximity) that would be good.

Raymarine already have a basic MOB device, that sounds an alarm on every Raymarine device on board the boat and additional speakers if fitted.

I would get the person on watch to wear this

http://store.switlik.com/products/isplr

The owner on my boat, attested that when MoB button was hit (several in different positions) the autohelm would try to steer back to that position. Never tested this.
More alarming, was the fact, that the co2 bottle was found in a used condition, having sailed across Biscay undeployable (I found it when checking system before starting my leg).

 

[AntarcticPilot]

I would challenge putting an EPIRB down as MOB equipment. A PLB maybe, but an EPIRB is intended to be activated in MAYDAY conditions where the boat is unlikely to survive.

 

[prv]

The cylinder on ours, was same as LJ cylinder.

For the gas-operated remote trigger, yes. I meant the large cylinder inside the Jon Buoy itself.

Having serviced it myself each winter for the last five years, I was thinking of letting it off at the end of this season and then giving it to Ocean Safety to "service", which would include them replacing the used bottle and the light which is now out of date. Save me the bother of obtaining them seperately, and also give peace of mind from an expert inspection.

But they ignored my email, so I'll check it myself as usual and work out a system for activating a different kind of light.

Pete

 

[alant]

I would challenge putting an EPIRB down as MOB equipment. A PLB maybe, but an EPIRB is intended to be activated in MAYDAY conditions where the boat is unlikely to survive.

I would be happy to be rescued & argue about it later!

 

[alant]

For the gas-operated remote trigger, yes. I meant the large cylinder inside the Jon Buoy itself.

Having serviced it myself each winter for the last five years, I was thinking of letting it off at the end of this season and then giving it to Ocean Safety to "service", which would include them replacing the used bottle and the light which is now out of date. Save me the bother of obtaining them seperately, and also give peace of mind from an expert inspection.

But they ignored my email, so I'll check it myself as usual and work out a system for activating a different kind of light.

Pete

When the Jon Buoy inflated, it was Scary.
This huge fluorescent greeny yellow monster erected itself with much noise, just alongside.
Warn your neighbours if testing.

 

[prv]

When the Jon Buoy inflated, it was Scary.
This huge fluorescent greeny yellow monster erected itself with much noise, just alongside.
Warn your neighbours if testing.

I was going to do it out on the water, probably off Netley. I was going to warn the Coastguard first in case they received any spurious calls from people watching.

(I know what it looks like when inflated, as I pump it up for a pressure test each winter and leave it in the living room overnight )

Pete

 

[Graham_Wright]

I was going to do it out on the water, probably off Netley. I was going to warn the Coastguard first in case they received any spurious calls from people watching.

(I know what it looks like when inflated, as I pump it up for a pressure test each winter and leave it in the living room overnight )

Pete

SWMBO and I went on a sea survival course (which I would strongly advise to anyone).

One of the instructors demonstrated (in the pool) a Jon Buoy. By the time he had entered it, he was very close to exhaustion - and he was experienced. Comments?

 

[JessicaMarais]

I'd imagine it being incredibly difficult, in full wet weather gear, with a life jacket, in cold water and with an element of shock and panic...hmmm

 

[prv]

One of the instructors demonstrated (in the pool) a Jon Buoy. By the time he had entered it, he was very close to exhaustion - and he was experienced. Comments?

Even if you can only manage to hang onto it, it's a very visible marker.

To be honest, the main reason I originally bought it was because I didn't want the aesthetic clutter of a traditional rigid dan buoy and big yellow horseshoe on the stern of a pretty little gaff yawl.

Pete

 

[jwilson]

Done the survey, however the hardest part of any MOB situation is getting the person back on board

+1000% - I've run practical exercises as instructor at sea with humans in the water playing unconscious and that is the really hard bit. I was also the skipper being examined for instructor many years ago when a similar exercise was done with a big burly RN diver who went overboard: he lay face-down in the water for about 4 minutes - very very frighteningly realistic. I think I passed because I managed to stop anyone else jumping in untethered....

 

[alant]

+1000% - I've run practical exercises as instructor at sea with humans in the water playing unconscious and that is the really hard bit. I was also the skipper being examined for instructor many years ago when a similar exercise was done with a big burly RN diver who went overboard: he lay face-down in the water for about 4 minutes - very very frighteningly realistic. I think I passed because I managed to stop anyone else jumping in untethered....

So they jumped in, tethered?

 

[KAL]

Done. Good luck with the project Jess.

 

[jwilson]

So they jumped in, tethered?

One did, once safely tethered: it was totally the only way on a high-topsides 45 ft racer with no sugarscoop to attach an "unconscious" body to lift it out with a halyard winch. Then the person examining me deliberately put a riding turn on the winch.

Practicing with a fender, bucket and boathook is better than nothing, but I can get most boats back stopped alongside to do that very fast. Actually getting a human out is the difficult bit.

 

[BlueSkyNick]

It is far more important to stop the boat going too far away, keeping visual contact at all times and getting back to the MOB with the boat under control.

Deploying lifebuoys more than 5 seconds after the incident is a waste of time and manpower.

If the boat returns to the MOB but not yet ready to recover him, then give him a lifebuoy to hang on to until the boat comes back a second time.