Macmillan Reeds Almanac.

[poter]

I have been looking a new set of books for Shady, & I noticed that the 2004 Almanacs are on the bookshelves. As my channel Almanac is now well out of date I was looking at buying an update, but it seems an awfull waste to just dump the old one!

Is it not a sensible idea to give someone else the benifit of any old sailing books/Almanacs?
Do the RYA have such a scheme? Perhaps for kids taking up the sport?
Any thoughts?

I also note in the Reeds catalogue that they do a loose leaf system I assume that the update info is tides & any notices is it a better option than the fixed binders?

I am a big fan of cruising companion books, but was interested to find out what the best West Country companion/pilot is, befor ordering a new one.

poter

<hr width=100% size=1>

 

[Johnjo]

I think mark fishwick's "Guide to West Country Cruising "
To be about the best, IMHO

<hr width=100% size=1>

 

[Joe_Cole]

I'll second that! A new edition came out last year so it's pretty much up to do date too.

<hr width=100% size=1>

 

[LadyInBed]

Re: Macmillan Reeds loose leaf system.

You would expect it to be rationalised and just have replacement pages / sections but you would be wrong, you get a complete new insert. Tide data is still with the port info, which has its benefits, but personally I would prefer it as a separate section.

<hr width=100% size=1>

 

[poter]

Re: Macmillan Reeds loose leaf system.

Nigel
Sorry........ermm..... you are joking?? Do you mean that they give you a COMPLETE new insert?? if so thats a scandle...more of the rain forest cut down!
So really the only benifit is that you get to keep the binder?

Is the insert the same as the normal channel almanac?

poter

<hr width=100% size=1>

 

[charles_reed]

I keep the old ones, till they fall apart, at home as reference works.

You pay a considerable premium for the loose-leaf version.

Personally I have a 7-harmonic tide model mounted on the computer which covers the whole world and lasts until 2025.
It only cost $29.29 and is within 20 mins and 100mm of the 13 harmonic Admiralty tables - when they come out.

I've found that the Bloc Marine Livre en Bord is superior to Macmillan Reeds for continental European waters - it's €21 which is, I think, rather less than Macmillans.

However who can blame Macmillans for exploiting their monopoly.

My complaint about all the "disposable" pilots is that they only list ports and marinas and totally ignore the wealth of comfortable, free anchorages all round the coasts of our continent. You have to pay big money for the Imray Pilots to get any of that Info and the quality of information is very variable and sometimes diabolically inaccurate.

Ideally someone should produce an internet-accessed pilot - that would allow for easy update (all pilots are 18 months out of date by publication time) and allow download of only the portion relevant to one's own use.
Copyright could be covered by either a regular subscription or an internet purchase.

this sounds like a good opportunity for ybw and say the CA or RCC. Mind you Imrays might feel a little nose-wrung.

<hr width=100% size=1>

 

[sailorman]

try Amazon for prices much cheaper 2 yrs ago

<hr width=100% size=1>

 

[Boathook]

Re: Macmillan Reeds Almanac. re: mike27

I'll third Mike Fishwicks West Country Cruising Companion. Very good and list anchorages though some had been covered in moorings between writting and visiting !

<hr width=100% size=1>

 

[LadyInBed]

Re: Macmillan Reeds loose leaf system.

I kid you not.
I've never done a comparison between the two versions, logic would say that they are the same, but whenever has logic played a part. You would hope that the loose leaf replacement pack is cheaper than a bound volume.


<hr width=100% size=1>

 

[poter]

Charles.......
<Ideally someone should produce an internet-accessed pilot - that would allow for easy update (all pilots are 18 months out of date by publication time) and allow download of only the portion relevant to one's own use.
Copyright could be covered by either a regular subscription or an internet purchase.>

What a good idea I wonder if say IPC or Macmillans would do that???(One for Kim)
I am sure they would get subscribers.

I am very puzzled as to why the information is not internet based or on a CD rom anyway?? I did ask the question sometime ago but got no joy.

Both PBO & Yachting have a wealth of information that must be available electronically, maybe IPC could start the ball rolling and put the information into a database and issue a password whatever to suscribers or fee pay over the net?
And as you say you could download only the information that is relevant.

poter.

<hr width=100% size=1>

 

[kimhollamby]

Interesting idea

The biggest weakness of any printed almanac is its increasing age through the course of even a current year, so I can see the sense of an Internet based system both for preparatory print-off and also, increasingly, for those who can access it on the boat (provided it was relatively fast to load).

If nothing else food for thought at this stage.

I have to say that I have nothing but admiration for editors of almanacs; the task seems daunting. The danger with an Internet-based one is that it would be tempting to cut corners to amass the material and for my money that would be a huge mistake. Also I would like to to some of the thinking that goes into publications life Pooley's Flight Guide come into the world of yachting (detailed approach info in a rigidly defined format, plus in the case of marinas detailed charts for each one so you don't have to go looking for invisible berth numbers on the end of fingers on that night arrival). Again, Internet-based would enable that to be added to and updated as required, although copyright issues would be fierce as the UK is the worst possible place to publish anything of this nature in the world and I suspect UKHO would not be supportive.

Subscription would be required, using a system where you couldn't simply pass your password on to many other willing users without contribution -- as if!

We certainly have the venue here for recruiting local contributors...

<hr width=100% size=1>

 

[kingfisher]

Re: Macmillan Reeds loose leaf system.

I have the looseleaved version. One of the advantages is that I leave non-used chapters on far away regions at home to save weight (actully it's to prevent them going moldy, but that just doesn't have the same ring to it)

<hr width=100% size=1>Group of people on the pontoon: skipper is the one with the toolbox.
http://sirocco31.tripod.com

 

[charles_reed]

"What a good idea I wonder if say IPC or Macmillans would do that???(One for Kim)
I am sure they would get subscribers."

I've sent a copy of the post to Kim saying "how about it?"

"I am very puzzled as to why the information is not internet based or on a CD rom anyway?? I did ask the question sometime ago but got no joy."

In fact you could get the Macmillan's Almanac on CD in 2001 - I don't know if they've continued that or dropped it.
One of the problems is that of inertia, Macmillans' is a publishing house and even the CD they produced was just a digitised copy of the almanac - a singular lack of imagination - and they're so busy dodging the trees of their conventional business that they have no idea of the shape or extent of the wood.
My experience of Macmillans is that they're good at the technology of printing/publishing but their commercial and marketing nous leaves a lot to be desired.

As with any information-based project, the costs of setting up an internet-based pilot would be all front-end loaded, any sponsor would have to cough up about 90% of the total before seeing any hope of an income-stream. Once set up the running costs would be very low but volume would be all important to make the project viable.
How many people would be prepared to pay say £35pa for the right to access such a database - which could easily encompass continental european waters.

The people with the corpus of knowledge are the CA or RCC, both in their own way in hock to Imrays. Neither probably have the IT resource to undertake the project (though Frank Singleton and Ray Glaister are extremely gifted IT pioneers).
I also fear that Droggie would burden any such venture with impossibly high royalties - given his present dog-in-manger attitude.

It really needs someone like Kim to take it up, and I fear his masters would ask for an impossibly accurate cash-flow and profits forecast.


<hr width=100% size=1>

 

[Robin]

I agree completely about the Bloc Marine 'Votre Livre De Bord', I don't think it even costs 21 Euros (current one is on board), the 2002 one I have at home was just 16.50 Euros. We buy the PBO almanac initially, then the Bloc Marine one on our first trip over if we don't go over to play golf over New Year. The pilotage section is pretty good with major ports even having English text as well and I noticed a couple of times the UK Port charts were more up to date than over here!

<hr width=100% size=1>

 

[kimhollamby]

Good and bad news

Good news: We do have the technical nous to do something with the idea; while not always obvious we are increasingly harnessing print and online exercises via databases, or structuring new projects so they can be managed this way in future.

Bad news: forget cash flow and so on, the biggest worry without exploring it further is copyright and the likely overhead this would present before getting the project off the ground. If this was the US with a liberal NOAA to work with then that would be a great encouragement but from past experience I fear what we would be asked to contribute towards provision of online annual tides and detailed chartlets, as just two examples. That, incidentally, is why we only offer two-week rolling tide tables on ybw.com at present.

Nevertheless, as I stated in my other post, it is good food for thought and thanks for that...I will bounce the idea around when I get back to the office.


<hr width=100% size=1>

 

[Novice]

An Alternative Method

Microsoft have a combination method for updating copies of Encarta which gets around the problems of copyright theft via the Internet. You have to buy a CD copy of Encarta, and then once it is installed on your PC, you can go on the www and download updated articles etc. This is enabled for a period of time, usually until the next CD version comes out, and then you have to buy the upgrade CD and start over again. However, the time period for which upgrades can be downloaded could be set to anything - say 3 years between buying new CDs. This seems like a workable method to me.

Jon

<hr width=100% size=1>

 

[dick_james]

Re: Macmillan Reeds loose leaf system.

Don't get the loose leaf version. It's unwieldy to use, the pages tear out if you just look at them. If you drop it half the pages fall out. It's awful.

<hr width=100% size=1>

 

[LadyInBed]

Re: Macmillan Reeds loose leaf system.

This is all true but as was said by kingfisher, sections can be archived and brought into play as, when and if required.
I keep unused / little used sections in press seal A4 plastic bags.


<hr width=100% size=1>

 

[poter]

Thanks all...
The published channel Almanacs look like a real 'mish mash' although getting Kim 'on board' as it were, sounds like we may get somewhere with some useful database information, even if its not tides (thanks UKHO) or chart info.
But just the pull out guides collated and available on-line would be great, as also already suggested, info. on anchorages. I am sure the Forumites on here could be persuaded to submit pilotage notes & Yachting monthly/PBO must have reams of pilotage info that is not subject to HMG/other copyright issues.
If IPC then put it together for a web based database, I would bet the serious boat user’s would welcome an on-line database that gives information on port destinations and anchorages, & dare I say pay for the privilege. As Kim says 'food for thought’

Meantime an Email is winging its way to Mac Reed, will wait for a response and if interesting report back here.


poter

Mike Fishwicks West Country Cruising Companion is a definite for Xmas....ta.

<hr width=100% size=1>

 

[BrendanS]

I'm not sure people will pay. This is the exact concept that Boathow.com used. Their pilotage notes with their own basic charts and even photographs of entrances and leading lines were excellent. They didn't survive

<hr width=100% size=1>