Long term live-aboard cruising on European waterways cannot be over for us Brits

saab96 said:
Agreed. The Schengen visa is for 90/180 and we and selected other third countries are exempt so when we visit Schengen we don’t need a visa. My point though was that Schengen came close to a new touring visa allowing a stay from 90 days to a year (extendable to 2 years) and if they did that in 2014 they might be inclined to have another go now that 60 million of us Brits on their doorstep are third country citizens. If they know we would appreciate it.
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Do you know why they didn't proceed last time?
 
seastoke said:
So say you run over a month in portugal what would happen to you , if they got you.
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Why be specific about Portugal❓

Are you thinking of heading that way. As has yet to happen, who knows❓

I think the circumstances would have a significant impact. That and the official you come into contact with.
 
nortada said:
I think the circumstances would have a significant impact. That and the official you come into contact with.
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Graham376 said:
Some info on penalties here but it does say there is no common policy - Brits Overstaying EU's 90/180 Days Rule to Face Penalties - SchengenVisaInfo.com
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With the automation of Schengen Visa Entry and Exit database later this year and the introduction of ETIAS next year, I'd expect it to be more difficult to hide and less variable in penalty.

But to answer the question, any combination of deportation, fine and re-entry ban + a nice illegal overstay stamp in your passport.
 
st599 said:
With the automation of Schengen Visa Entry and Exit database later this year and the introduction of ETIAS next year, I'd expect it to be more difficult to hide and less variable in penalty.

But to answer the question, any combination of deportation, fine and re-entry ban + a nice illegal overstay stamp in your passport.
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Agree, as offshore sailors, it will be almost impossible to hide but landlubbers are less likely to be detected unless they cross the law. Crunch time will come they try to leave the country.

As to penalties, as it is a national transgression, I suspect countries could adopt very different attitudes and within those countries official will be given varying amounts of authority.

I will be interesting to see the attitude taken to those who, due to Covid travel restriction, are unable to leave the Schengen Zone before 1/4/21.

Bottom line for me, I don’t intend to test the system.
 
nortada said:
Agree, as offshore sailors, it will be almost impossible to hide but landlubbers are less likely to be detected unless they cross the law. Crunch time will come they try to leave the country.

As to penalties, as it is a national transgression, I suspect countries could adopt very different attitudes and within those countries official will be given varying amounts of authority.

I will be interesting to see the attitude taken to those who, due to Covid travel restriction, are unable to leave the Schengen Zone before 1/4/21.

Bottom line for me, I don’t intend to test the system.
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I can give you one ,
Ozzie in our marina , he run out of time , CG have stamped him out and told him to keep his head down until he leave.
We in yellow so they could had told him to go .
 
Rebecca & Steve said:
We are indeed talking 2021 not the 1990's.
I would therefore suggest that 2021 rules (post Brexit) more reflect the 1990's (check in/out) than they reflect say 2015 (pre-Brexit)).
I will therefore be basing my cruising plans on the 2021 rules not the (now defunct) 2015 rules. You must make your own judgement as you see fit.
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And just how do you propose to do that given that 3rd country nationals are limited to 90 days out of EVERY 180 days across the entire schengen area?

When you last did this it was on a country by country basis, Spain couldn't care less how long you had spent in France, and vice versa. That situation has no changed entirely. You seem to be assuming that it has gone back to the old ways, which it has not.

In the 90's I lived in the french alps, my partner worked in france, while I worked 2 weeks on 1 week off on ferries and then spent the winter climbing and skiing. It was all easily doable and no problem. We couldn't do that now though. I really don't think the current situation compares at all to what you had experience of.
 
steve yates said:
And just how do you propose to do that given that 3rd country nationals are limited to 90 days out of EVERY 180 days across the entire schengen area?

When you last did this it was on a country by country basis, Spain couldn't care less how long you had spent in France, and vice versa. That situation has no changed entirely. You seem to be assuming that it has gone back to the old ways, which it has not.

In the 90's I lived in the french alps, my partner worked in france, while I worked 2 weeks on 1 week off on ferries and then spent the winter climbing and skiing. It was all easily doable and no problem. We couldn't do that now though. I really don't think the current situation compares at all to what you had experience of.
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Perhaps you need to re-read my post? I suggested 2021 rules quite clearly. I am quite capable of organising my cruising on 1970 rules, 2014 rules, or - as now - 2021 rules. I have no problem with it - if you are unable to adapt then that displays a lack of adaptability on your part not mine does it not? Make your own choice, I shall go cruising. If the EU are open to that idea then we will spend our money within their borders - if not, hey ho.
 
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I haven't seen any explanation of how you could repeat your previous cruising in 2021, and with all due respect, you seem to be suggesting it is entirely possible. If so, I'd love to hear how, because we had intended to spend a couple of years sailing slowly to the med and around it, with short breaks home every 6 weeks or so. This is currently not possible. I have a few alternative plans, but nothing changes the fact that our original ideas are simply not allowed now. And neither is the OP's. I really really would love to be entirely wrong. I read your post, you suggested 2021 was similar to 1990 rules. They are not. It is a completely different scenario now. 1990 was country by country, 2021 has 26 countries operating as one area.
 
I think the problem with this thread and all the others is there many liveaboard and liveaboards/cruisers with so man.y different experience ,
then there other with no experience in cruising or being a liveaboard with just options only .
So we all post on a subject very close to our heart at time forgetting what's right for us isn't right for the next guy .
So we argue and argue who's right and who's wrong ,
In the big Sene of things it's really doesn't matter , most will had made the right decision for them self , others will adapt there plain and some will still be posting and arguing this time next year not moved from the same position there are now.
It's a fact that no one know what the future is going to bring Brexit plus Covid is going to cause everyone some kind of problems .
Some feel that residency is the answer others have other plains and some have decided the EU isn't worth the hussle ,
There them who are or have sold and others that where about to start the adventure of a life time decided now not the time.

Mid Feb at any other time we be doing last min job , we would have some kind of plain for the coming season , boat will slow be turned into a sea going vessel again and we be looking at unvelco the boat within the next few weeks .

Instead we have no real plain , no point in building our hope to leave in a March as we have no idea if we did leave where we could go, job are being stretch out so we not bored , it would be depressing if it wasn't that we are long time cruisers know we have to adapt to what ever life throw at us any min , any day, it's also what makes us good at what we do.
And most of us will adapt to Brexit and Covid , because we know the only other option is going back to living on land which for a lot of us that's much worst then Brexit and Covid put together.
 
steve yates said:
I haven't seen any explanation of how you could repeat your previous cruising in 2021, and with all due respect, you seem to be suggesting it is entirely possible. If so, I'd love to hear how, because we had intended to spend a couple of years sailing slowly to the med and around it, with short breaks home every 6 weeks or so. This is currently not possible. I have a few alternative plans, but nothing changes the fact that our original ideas are simply not allowed now. And neither is the OP's. I really really would love to be entirely wrong. I read your post, you suggested 2021 was similar to 1990 rules. They are not. It is a completely different scenario now. 1990 was country by country, 2021 has 26 countries operating as one area.
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With respect, I think that you are completely missing my point.

Im am NOT saying that I can (or want) to repeat my 1970/80/90 / 2016 cruising!
I am (AM) saying that I cruised in the 70/80/90/2014 's under whatever)rules as they then applied AND FOUND A WAY TO CRUISE UNDER THOSE RULES!
I will continue to be flexible and do the same again.
If you (or anybody else) wishes to hark back to a set of rules that really suited you (say 2015) - and spend the rest of your time wishing that nothing had changed and those same 2015 rules still applied, then fine, that is your choice. I am not complaining about your choice (for you) - it's just not a choice that I will be following myself. I will continue to adapt to the rules that evolve and modify my cruising to suit - you must do as you see fit. Neither the EU or any other political organisation will determine my cruising grounds, never have, never will. I you feel differently then I have no problem with that whatever. Fair winds.
 
There seem to be moves afoot for Saudi arabia to open up for tourism and normalise relations with isreal,the ability to visit the eastern side of the Red sea by yacht would really open up a whole new cruising ground .
With 3 well established marinas in Egypt, and a large marina in Eilat , israel plus good air connections to europe could prove to become popular with brits tired of the shengan shuffle.
 
Rebecca & Steve said:
With respect, I think that you are completely missing my point.

Im am NOT saying that I can (or want) to repeat my 1970/80/90 / 2016 cruising!
I am (AM) saying that I cruised in the 70/80/90/2014 's under whatever)rules as they then applied AND FOUND A WAY TO CRUISE UNDER THOSE RULES!
I will continue to be flexible and do the same again.
If you (or anybody else) wishes to hark back to a set of rules that really suited you (say 2015) - and spend the rest of your time wishing that nothing had changed and those same 2015 rules still applied, then fine, that is your choice. I am not complaining about your choice (for you) - it's just not a choice that I will be following myself. I will continue to adapt to the rules that evolve and modify my cruising to suit - you must do as you see fit. Neither the EU or any other political organisation will determine my cruising grounds, never have, never will. I you feel differently then I have no problem with that whatever. Fair winds.
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@R&S reading your posting you seen to know what's going to work for you , good for you mate ,
I got in a similar discussion with Graham and S/Y Victorian the other day at the end of it , it didn't go anywhere they said one thing I said another all we did was wined each other up,
It didn't do any of us any good or anyone who was reading it.

I can see Steve Yates point , he and other are frustrated that years of planning and dreams are being ripped apart because of Brexit and people the like of you and me posting we going to find our own way around it and carry on doing as we been doing is making it worst because they having a real problem understanding what we saying and seeing any way around it without leaving after 90days which in it self isn't that much of a problem if your a cruiser and want to keep cruising.
the people who are going to have trouble dealing with it are the once who had a plain to sail to some where Like Greece and spend all there time in one said country they will no doubt have a problem and if that's their plain residency at the moment is the only answer this also apply to Spain , Portugal or any other country in the EU .

On the other hand if they want to move around then people shouldn't abandon life time plains , there ways around everything it just a matter of finding them and once there out there and talking to other cruisers who are doing the same thing it will all become clear .

I wish everyone luck on the on coming sailing season , personality I need to try and stop posting so much so not to upset others here who disagree with my views .
plus it's getting addicted .
 
sailaboutvic said:
@R&S reading your posting you seen to know what's going to work for you , good for you mate ,
I got in a similar discussion with Graham and S/Y Victorian the other day at the end of it , it didn't go anywhere they said one thing I said another all we did was wined each other up,
It didn't do any of us any good or anyone who was reading it.

I can see Steve Yates point , he and other are frustrated that years of planning and dreams are being ripped apart because of Brexit and people the like of you and me posting we going to find our own way around it and carry on doing as we been doing is making it worst because they having a real problem understanding what we saying and seeing any way around it without leaving after 90days which in it self isn't that much of a problem if your a cruiser and want to keep cruising.
the people who are going to have trouble dealing with it are the once who had a plain to sail to some where Like Greece and spend all there time in one said country they will no doubt have a problem and if that's their plain residency at the moment is the only answer this also apply to Spain , Portugal or any other country in the EU .

On the other hand if they want to move around then people shouldn't abandon life time plains , there ways around everything it just a matter of finding them and once there out there and talking to other cruisers who are doing the same thing it will all become clear .

I wish everyone luck on the on coming sailing season , personality I need to try and stop posting so much so not to upset others here who disagree with my views .
plus it's getting addicted .
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Very much horses for courses.

The question being asked is how do you intend to ‘get around it (Schengen)’. My impression is that rather than get around Schengen, you intend to comply with Schengen 90/180 and re-arrange your sailing accordingly.
 
nortada said:
Very much horses for courses.

The question being asked is how do you intend to ‘get around it (Schengen)’. My impression is that rather than get around Schengen, you intend to comply with Schengen 90/180 and re-arrange your sailing accordingly.
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Nortada I don't really want to keep going around and around with this as I said I posted much to much on this subjust ,
but to answer your question no I do not .
I have my own way with dealing with the 90/180 days , i have posted else where and I just refuse to go through it all again,
Just to get into another discussion with them who don't agree ,
 
sailaboutvic said:
@R&S reading your posting you seen to know what's going to work for you , good for you mate ,
I got in a similar discussion with Graham and S/Y Victorian the other day at the end of it , it didn't go anywhere they said one thing I said another all we did was wined each other up,
It didn't do any of us any good or anyone who was reading it.

I can see Steve Yates point , he and other are frustrated that years of planning and dreams are being ripped apart because of Brexit and people the like of you and me posting we going to find our own way around it and carry on doing as we been doing is making it worst because they having a real problem understanding what we saying and seeing any way around it without leaving after 90days which in it self isn't that much of a problem if your a cruiser and want to keep cruising.
the people who are going to have trouble dealing with it are the once who had a plain to sail to some where Like Greece and spend all there time in one said country they will no doubt have a problem and if that's their plain residency at the moment is the only answer this also apply to Spain , Portugal or any other country in the EU .

On the other hand if they want to move around then people shouldn't abandon life time plains , there ways around everything it just a matter of finding them and once there out there and talking to other cruisers who are doing the same thing it will all become clear .

I wish everyone luck on the on coming sailing season , personality I need to try and stop posting so much so not to upset others here who disagree with my views .
plus it's getting addicted .
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Oh I'm not abandoning plans Vic, as I said, I have alternatives, the first being the one year tourist visa for france, and then we will always be moving on, so once we reach the med then we have every intention of cruising turkey and tunisia too, so can do the schengen shuffle. I do understand there are ways to keep sailing, but the OP's original post was about cruising the canals and inland waterways, there is simply no way round schengen for doing that that I can see.

It may be the internet but what I took from S & R's posts were that "oh well, its just how it used to be before shengen so there's no problem really." There is a problem, there are ways round it and ways of mitigating it, but there is a problem,with the added risk now of being banned from the entire area if you are too cute and some jobsworth gets in your way.

Ok, it's very much a first world problem, but hey ho, I still want to know all possible ways of dealing with it or adapting to it. (You keep mentioning some other thread by the way where you said how you were dealing with it, care to link to it? I havent seen it)
 
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