Loch Stornoway

I seem to remember Ch16 warnings of RN minesweepers advertising bangs in Ettrick Bay and the book by the Stornoway CG winchman (I forget his name) certainly refers to his time in the RN diving squad making bangs in the bay. Quite what the RN blow up there I dinnae ken.
 
awol said:
I seem to remember Ch16 warnings of RN minesweepers advertising bangs in Ettrick Bay and the book by the Stornoway CG winchman (I forget his name) certainly refers to his time in the RN diving squad making bangs in the bay. Quite what the RN blow up there I dinnae ken.
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That brings back a memory of various RN boats in there about 10-12 years back. Milling round in there for days I remember, but what exactly they were milling I also dinnae ken.
 
I have come to the conclusion over many years that if you believe everything the pilot books say, or sailing magazines for that matter, then only the foolhardy or thrill seekers would sail anywhere. Almost everything they say relating to passage planning and navigation is negative gloom and doom. Many a time I have read details on a particular destination and thought "sod that, it looks very dangerous, so we better not go there". It's rare for any of them to say anything positive about anywhere. But the funny thing is when I read these guides and the numerous warnings of danger, in relation to waters I know well, I have to do a double read because in my experience, often what they say doesn't relate to reality.
 
asteven221 said:
But the funny thing is when I read these guides and the numerous warnings of danger, in relation to waters I know well, I have to do a double read because in my experience, often what they say doesn't relate to reality.
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Very true, but I guess they've got to allow for numpties with little practical seamanship skills.
 
I know, simply from reading Paddy Ashdown's book, that the Cockleshell Heroes used some of the bays on Bute for part of their training - maybe just on their way to the Gironde, though. He talked about HMS Tuna being in Kilmarnock Water and Scalpsie Bay being on the east side of the island! Being a pedant I contacted him and got a very nice reply agreeing he meant Inchmarnock Water and the west side...

I have a hunch that Ettrick Bay may have undetected things that go bang if provoked!
 
JD, do you think there is some irony in someone starting a thread asking for information about a potential anchorage and then spending most of it decrying the consequences of someone having gone to considerable effort to provide the sort of information you seek ???
 
awol said:
I seem to remember Ch16 warnings of RN minesweepers advertising bangs in Ettrick Bay and the book by the Stornoway CG winchman (I forget his name) certainly refers to his time in the RN diving squad making bangs in the bay. Quite what the RN blow up there I dinnae ken.
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RN minesweepers hover about N of St Ninian's Bay for days on end. When they do advertise 'bangs' on Ch16 it is because they are blowing up ordnance that they put in the water as part of their training.

The Kyles from Colintraive to Skate were out of bounds for the duration of the war. The castle at Caladh was a training school for inshore navigation. My parents house on Kames was requisitioned by the RN. If you have time have a look at the inscription on the plaque opposite An Lochan (Royal Hotel as was) which gives information on the losses incurred by the US Rangers as part of their training landing on the previously mentioned beaches for D-Day, hence the 'tank landing strip' just outside of Kames. There is still a lot of evidence of barbed wire at Kilbride Bay and I assume that is what makes Ettrick Bay a no-no.

Donald
 
I agree it's now Chinese Whispers.
The Clyde pilot books still contain loud echoes from the post war years when a very few yacht club stalwarts recounted tales of their adventures amongst the abandoned Boom Defences and crumbling piers of the West Coast.
With the usual caveats - I reckon the chances of fouling on wartime barbed wire or mooring cables in the aforementioned bays are virtually nil. I've sniffed round Etrick bay with the fishfinder and Mk 1 eyeball in clear seas and reckon it's as clean as a whistle.
But Loch Striven - There be Monsters ! ( but no yachts )
 
awol said:
I seem to remember Ch16 warnings of RN minesweepers advertising bangs in Ettrick Bay and the book by the Stornoway CG winchman (I forget his name) certainly refers to his time in the RN diving squad making bangs in the bay. Quite what the RN blow up there I dinnae ken.
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the book is by Chris Murray, possibly writing as William Murray seeing as that's his actual name.
 
Homer Simpson's Lovechild said:
But Loch Striven - There be Monsters ! ( but no yachts )
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I went up there a couple of years ago and wrote a short report here. It was one of my haunts as a boy sailing a 10' dinghy from Port Bannatyne. The notoriously flukey winds at the entrance don't extend far, but it's pretty boring and although you can anchor in the small shallow patch by the burn on the east side at the north (drop the anchor in 5m, float in 20m) it's surprisingly noisy because of the constant grind of traffic up the steep roads on each side.
 
Quandary said:
JD, do you think there is some irony in someone starting a thread asking for information about a potential anchorage and then spending most of it decrying the consequences of someone having gone to considerable effort to provide the sort of information you seek ???
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I think the word you are looking for ...

JumbleDuck said:
Of course that's probably what the other people in anchorages where I've gone in with Antares are saying, so I may just be a hypocrite.
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... is "hypocrite".

However, in this case what piqued my curiosity was the mismatch between the UKHO and CCC advice ("Abandon hope all ye who enter here") and the Antares Chart and comments.

There are other inconsistencies around. For example, the CCC timings for going round the Mull of Kintyre are (a) the same in my 2000's edition as they were in 1934 (b) several hours different from the Admiralty pilot and (c) wrong. Perhaps they have fixed that in the most recent edition.

I should say that I think the CCC guides are a remarkable feat of co-operation over many years and that I have a renewed resolve to send them corrections and updates when it seems appropriate. Assuming they take them from non members, of course. Loch Stornoway to start with, if I can.

Perhaps an Antares - CCC collaboration would make sense? I still have a set of CCC sketch charts, which in many - but by no means all - cases have been superseded by Antares.
 
MM5AHO said:
That brings back a memory of various RN boats in there about 10-12 years back. Milling round in there for days I remember, but what exactly they were milling I also dinnae ken.
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There was a Big Grey Boat in there for a day or two just two or three years ago, but I didn't hear any bangs.

In the days of my youth the RN moorings in Kames and Rothesay bays were character forming, being (a) black and (b) unlit. Great fun at night. Now just one left, and it's painted yellow which spoils the fun a bit. However, the charts show foul areas where some of the others were, so I presume they left the anchors, perhaps so they could re-attach buoys if needed or perhaps because they just couldn't be bothered getting them up.
 
MM5AHO said:
That brings back a memory of various RN boats in there about 10-12 years back. Milling round in there for days I remember, but what exactly they were milling I also dinnae ken.
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+1 A few years ago when going towards Ardlamont, North. A couple of RN boats thoroughly close inshore - with Ribs / Men in Black buzzing around as well, Ettrick Bay and the one further south. No idea what they were doing. Not during Joint Warrior, so presumably RN training only?
 
There are other inconsistencies around. For example, the CCC timings for going round the Mull of Kintyre are (a) the same in my 2000's edition as they were in 1934 (b) several hours different from the Admiralty pilot and (c) wrong. Perhaps they have fixed that in the most recent edition.
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I don't have a recent edition of the CCC's Clyde SDs (it's not 'my area') so can't check, but if you think they are wrong, let the Editor know. I'm still using the Martin Lawrence pilot (1993) and, the few times I've been around the Mull, they seem to have worked. Maybe a local to the area could comment.

I should say that I think the CCC guides are a remarkable feat of co-operation over many years and that I have a renewed resolve to send them corrections and updates when it seems appropriate. Assuming they take them from non members, of course. Loch Stornoway to start with, if I can.
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The Editor welcomes comments from all.

Perhaps an Antares - CCC collaboration would make sense? I still have a set of CCC sketch charts, which in many - but by no means all - cases have been superseded by Antares.
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They already do. Antares are being used to update the chartlets in the SDs.
 
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Minchsailor said:
I don't have a recent edition of the CCC's Clyde SDs (it's not 'my area') so can't check, but if you think they are wrong, let the Editor know. I'm still using the Martin Lawrence pilot (1993) and, the few times I've been around the Mull, they seem to have worked. Maybe a local to the area could comment.
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I'll recheck when I'm next on the boat. I now use the guide on the Campbeltown SC web site, which seems - unsurprisingly - to be spot on.

They already do. Antares are being used to update the chartlets in the SDs.
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Excellent. In Ye Olde Days the CCC used to publish an annual update, free to members and cheap to everyone else, to the SDs. I haven't seen modern equivalents - do they still exist?
 
JumbleDuck said:
I'll recheck when I'm next on the boat. I now use the guide on the Campbeltown SC web site, which seems - unsurprisingly - to be spot on.



Excellent. In Ye Olde Days the CCC used to publish an annual update, free to members and cheap to everyone else, to the SDs. I haven't seen modern equivalents - do they still exist?
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Until recently the CSC advice used to send you to Belfast Lough via Sanda Sound, pleased to see that has been omitted, perhaps they picked up on a previous thread in here.

I think CCC are hoping that most of the corrections have been made by now and they can make more money selling updated books, my blue book grew to about double its thickness during the time I had it, with confetti like strips of text emerging from between the pages, bit sore on the binding. I recall that toward the end they published a booklet as an addendum and all you had to do was mark which paras. had been corrected and refer to it. Cutting the corrections into strips and sticking them in was one of the tasks for a wet stormy night in midwinter. Nowadays we can come here for an argument instead.
 
JumbleDuck said:
Excellent. In Ye Olde Days the CCC used to publish an annual update, free to members and cheap to everyone else, to the SDs. I haven't seen modern equivalents - do they still exist?
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They certainly do:

https://www.clyde.org/publications/

You will find them for the individual SDs. Generally updated early April each year, or as necessary..
 
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