LOA, Registered Length, and flares

Norman_E

Norman_E

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My Jeanneau 45.2 has a length overall quoted in its manufacturers literature as 14.15 metres. This length is recorded as "overall length" on the SSR certificate and is therefore the registered length. As far as I know, because I have not actually measured the boat this length includes the pulpit and its projecting seat. I have however seen a definition of length that says that the length of a British ship is defined as the greater of 96% the distance from the forepart of the stem to the aft side of the head of the stern post (I am assuming this really just means the length of the hull) or if there is no stern post 96% of the distance from the stem to the axis of the rudder. (I have now lost the link to this and would appreciate it if anyone can find it . I think it was from an MCA PDF file.)
From my perspective 96% of my current registered length would be 13.584 metres, and if I could re-register the boat at that length I could get rid of all the flares I am currently required to carry. Is this allowable?

P.S. I don't want this to be a debate about flares. I do carry a small flare pistol with both red and white flares, and If I can get rid of the hand held flares and Parachute rockets I will get an LED flare as well.
 
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My view would be that you are correct. If you use the MCA method of calculation, which often results in a figure smaller than most of us would expect, how can anyone in authority challenge that?
 
The guidance notes alahol links, and the definition the OP has come across to seem to be a little at odds with the guidance on the MCA's SSR registration pages. These state that "'Overall length' is the distance between the foreside of the foremost fixed structure and the aftside of the aftermost permanently fixed structure of the ship." It includes a series of drawings to clarify what this means with different configurations.
https://mcanet.mcga.gov.uk/ssr/ssr/notes.asp

However, reading alohol's link in more detail reveals two types of length (what a wonderfully arcane world we float on):
plain old length is "the greater distance of the following distances –
(a) the distance between the fore side of the stem and the axis of the rudder stock; or
(b) 96 per cent of the distance between the fore side of the stem and the aft side of the stern;

Whereas length overall "means the extreme length of the hull of the ship measured between the
foremost part of the bow and the aftmost part of the stern."

In other words, LOA is much as the SSR notes describe.
 
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A look at the diagrams that macd linked to, it is clear that the definition of overall length that is used for SSR measurement puposes is effectively the length of the hull, and does not include projections like the pulpit, or even the anchor roller. I will have to use a tape measure on my boat, because I think that the quoted LOA from the French manufacturer may well include everything. I am going to Turkey in January, and will take a long tape measure!

EDIT: Oh Bugger! I just found this http://sailboatdata.com/viewrecord.asp?class_id=6251 If it is correct the LOA is 13.72 metres. Just about 3/4 inch too long!
 
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Norman_E said:
A look at the diagrams that macd linked to, it is clear that the definition of overall length that is used for SSR measurement puposes is effectively the length of the hull, and does not include projections like the pulpit, or even the anchor roller. I will have to use a tape measure on my boat, because I think that the quoted LOA from the French manufacturer may well include everything. I am going to Turkey in January, and will take a long tape measure!

EDIT: Oh Bugger! I just found this http://sailboatdata.com/viewrecord.asp?class_id=6251 If it is correct the LOA is 13.72 metres. Just about 3/4 inch too long!
Click to expand...

Sailboatdata.com is unfortunately often inaccurate (you can send in corrections, such as the spec sheet below, but have to register on their forum, which didn't work last I tried). The LOA as stated by the builder is 14.15m and hull length 13.8m - both are on the spec sheet for your boat (nevermind the charter company stamping their logo on it).
 
macd said:
That still leaves a discrepancy between definitions. However perverse it may seem, LOA, as defined by both SSR and Part 1 registration guides, is more akin to what's called hull length in your link than it is to stated overall length.
Click to expand...

Which is why I pointed out both. As an engineer, I happily stick to merely supplying the measurement data and leave the arguing over how various regulations interpret it (or how to interpret the various regulations) to others ;-)
 
Yngmar said:
Sailboatdata.com is unfortunately often inaccurate (you can send in corrections, such as the spec sheet below, but have to register on their forum, which didn't work last I tried). The LOA as stated by the builder is 14.15m and hull length 13.8m - both are on the spec sheet for your boat (nevermind the charter company stamping their logo on it).
Click to expand...


Thank you for the link. I had lost the spec sheet. I could clearly register the boat as 13.8 metres, but that still requires me to carry flares, which is something I would prefer not to do.
 
Norman_E said:
Thank you for the link. I had lost the spec sheet. I could clearly register the boat as 13.8 metres, but that still requires me to carry flares, which is something I would prefer not to do.
Click to expand...

As you may know there is an on going discussion between the RYA and MCA about removing this requirement for private boats. Maybe worth a call to the RYA. Assume you have checked that you are not subject to an overriding requirement under Turkish rules rather than flag state.
 
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