Liferaft service - how difficult can it be?

[Neil_Y]

I think an important part is it should all be done in a humidity controlled environment. Our usual damp weather means packing it with moisture, a temperature drop means it will all be damp which will result in corrosion and possibly perishing. I know when I went to see my raft tested/packed it was all done in a room with aircon and moisture meters.

Now all you need is a large estate with the aircon turned on, now that would be quite entertaining to watch

 

[contessaman]

Presumably if the cylinder is empty or needs refilling one could take it to a diving centre & have it refilled if the connection is a standard one.

Anybody into diving know if that is possible??

I dont think divers fill their tanks with Co2!!!!

 

[contessaman]

Thanks for the link to the U-TUBE video. We inherited an almost new "Revere" Coastal Commander 6 man life raft with our boat. It is now out of service and no one in the UK wants to do it. I was thinking if doing it myself as it is a fairly expensive bit of kit. Its too good to chuck away and replace with what could be an inferior product.

how come? I know that they get cranky about servicing a raft thats too old (15 years is often quoted) but thats the first time I have heard of them turning their nose up at a particular make thats almost new. In my opinion, if you can't get it serviced but its quite new then maybe just carry out an 'inspection' your self? perhaps take it out of canister, check its dry in its vacuum bag, maybe check bottle for corrosion. then thats it. some rafts I have had even have a pressure gauge on the cylinder so you could check that if you have one. I wouldnt do any more than that -probably do more harm taking it all apart!
if there are perishables inside the raft that you are worried about, just duplicate them in a grab bag which you keep next to the raft.

also out of interest -im not familiar with your raft- but you have to really check the spec on some 'coastal' rafts. In conditions that have caused me to abandon the yacht I wouln't want to be anywhere in the UK waters without as a minimum:

2 tubes
full canopy
big water ballast pockets
insulated floor

I have done loads of liferaft drills in the sea around the UK (usually st mawgan) with my time in the military and the insulated floor makes all the difference.

 

[Daydream believer]

Presumably if the cylinder is empty or needs refilling one could take it to a diving centre & have it refilled if the connection is a standard one.

Anybody into diving know if that is possible??

I dont think divers fill their tanks with Co2!!!!

Who said anything about co2?
When they service the raft they pump up with normally aspirated air pump
An ordinary pump is supplied with the kit to top up pressure

 

[Daydream believer]

I think an important part is it should all be done in a humidity controlled environment. Our usual damp weather means packing it with moisture, a temperature drop means it will all be damp which will result in corrosion and possibly perishing. I know when I went to see my raft tested/packed it was all done in a room with aircon and moisture meters.

Now all you need is a large estate with the aircon turned on, now that would be quite entertaining to watch

Why moisture reduced environment
Surely when on the boat a dry package would suck up moisture like a sponge
I

 

[David2452]

Why moisture reduced environment
Surely when on the boat a dry package would suck up moisture like a sponge
I

No, because its properly packed in a hermetically sealed package in and athmosperically controlled environment (at least internally). Yet another example of why the answer to the OPs question is.... as has been atested, actually quite hard really.

 

[contessaman]

Presumably if the cylinder is empty or needs refilling one could take it to a diving centre & have it refilled if the connection is a standard one.

Anybody into diving know if that is possible??



Who said anything about co2?
When they service the raft they pump up with normally aspirated air pump
An ordinary pump is supplied with the kit to top up pressure

no professional outfit would ever fill a Co2 cylinder with breathing air or vice versa. nor put any other gas into a cylinder thats marked or designed for a different gas. Aint gonna happen.

also, rafts presumably use Co2 rather than air for a good reason - like breathing air contains moisture for a start. there will doubtless be other reasons, Im no expert on the matter but I wouldn't go changing the type of gas. by the time one has bu**ered around you might as well just pay for a service.

The raft is packed in the dry then vacuum sealed in a bag inside the valise or canister. the latter is just for physical protection. if the raft was just getting damp on the boat as you suggest it would perish in no time at all.

 

[Daydream believer]

No, because its properly packed in a hermetically sealed package in and athmosperically controlled environment (at least internally). Yet another example of why the answer to the OPs question is.... as has been atested, actually quite hard really.

Having been to premium liferafts & seen them working on liferafts i am not convinced the environment is any different to any normal warehouse
My comment " who said anything about co2" still stands. I have seen them inflating (albeit casually whilst standing in the factory) & there is no immediate evodence of any attempt to inflate with anything other than normally aspirated pumps.
As for hermetically sealing the bags - it just looked like a vacuum pump hooked up to a bag to get the package to a size to fit the canister
Correct me if i am wrong please

 

[AndyJ76]

My comment " who said anything about co2" still stands.

There were several mentions of CO2 in the first few replies. CO2 is generally used as an inflation gas because it can be compressed by around a further 50% over compressed air, so the bottles are smaller and lighter. You wouldn't use the CO2 to inflate a raft during servicing.

I've heard that some of the earlier liferafts were dangerous because the excess CO2 could vent into the inside of the raft, and as it's heavier than air, would sit there and suffocate people who were low down in the boat (typically the young and the injured)

 

[Daydream believer]

My point about testing with normal aspirated pumps scotches the view that co2 is used to avoid moisture because moisture gains access in the testing. Plus it would make no difference in use as it would not matter if there was moisture in it then
However, if co2 can be compressed more then i can see why one would use it to gain more volume

 

[David2452]

As for hermetically sealing the bags - it just looked like a vacuum pump hooked up to a bag to get the package to a size to fit the canister
Correct me if i am wrong please

OK then, a vacuum bag is a hermetically sealed container, less air = less moisture and other airbourne contaminents.

 

[snooks]

Had!

Plastimo have been reborn...

 

[Daydream believer]

OK then, a vacuum bag is a hermetically sealed container, less air = less moisture and other airbourne contaminents.

So why, when i am vacuum bagging a fibreglass model with resin in a fibreglass mat, it does not remove all the resin - which is in a fluid state, like water. Albeit a thicker fluid
I would have said that one is removing some air ( but not all) & that does not leave a hermetically sealed product
Or does it?

 

[AndyJ76]

So why, when i am vacuum bagging a fibreglass model with resin in a fibreglass mat, it does not remove all the resin - which is in a fluid state, like water. Albeit a thicker fluid
I would have said that one is removing some air ( but not all) & that does not leave a hermetically sealed product
Or does it?

Warm air holds much more moisture than cold air. People tend to prefer warmer temperatures. Liferafts tend to sit outside, where it sometimes gets cold.
If you haven't removed the air from the bag, the moisture will condense inside the bag. Removing (most of) the air removes (most of) the moisture (but it wouldn't have much effect on any liquid that was already present)

 

[rotrax]

how come? I know that they get cranky about servicing a raft thats too old (15 years is often quoted) but thats the first time I have heard of them turning their nose up at a particular make thats almost new. In my opinion, if you can't get it serviced but its quite new then maybe just carry out an 'inspection' your self? perhaps take it out of canister, check its dry in its vacuum bag, maybe check bottle for corrosion. then thats it. some rafts I have had even have a pressure gauge on the cylinder so you could check that if you have one. I wouldnt do any more than that -probably do more harm taking it all apart!
if there are perishables inside the raft that you are worried about, just duplicate them in a grab bag which you keep next to the raft.

also out of interest -im not familiar with your raft- but you have to really check the spec on some 'coastal' rafts. In conditions that have caused me to abandon the yacht I wouln't want to be anywhere in the UK waters without as a minimum:

2 tubes
full canopy
big water ballast pockets
insulated floor

I have done loads of liferaft drills in the sea around the UK (usually st mawgan) with my time in the military and the insulated floor makes all the difference.

Ocean safety told me they are not licenced to do it, as well as those lovely people in Liverpool who were recomended. Its an Americam liferaft, but possibly made in Italy. I would love to have it done in the UK but no luck so far. If you know different, please let me know who and where. AFAIK it is a good quality product and appears as good as anything else available within the range of my wallet from the "How to use" disc that came with it.

 

[contessaman]

Ocean safety told me they are not licenced to do it, as well as those lovely people in Liverpool who were recomended. Its an Americam liferaft, but possibly made in Italy. I would love to have it done in the UK but no luck so far. If you know different, please let me know who and where. AFAIK it is a good quality product and appears as good as anything else available within the range of my wallet from the "How to use" disc that came with it.

have u tried cosalt bristol?

 

[David2452]

So why, when i am vacuum bagging a fibreglass model with resin in a fibreglass mat, it does not remove all the resin - which is in a fluid state, like water. Albeit a thicker fluid
I would have said that one is removing some air ( but not all) & that does not leave a hermetically sealed product
Or does it?

The moisture referred to here is airbourne, so removing the air removes it, this has nothing to do with water (or resin) in its liquid state.
The definition of hermetically sealed has nothing to do with removing all (or even some) of the air or other contents, it simply means nothing can get in or out, in this case most of the moisture laden air has been removed by vacuum bagging and no more can get it even if stored in a wet environment.

 

[contessaman]

So why, when i am vacuum bagging a fibreglass model with resin in a fibreglass mat, it does not remove all the resin - which is in a fluid state, like water. Albeit a thicker fluid
I would have said that one is removing some air ( but not all) & that does not leave a hermetically sealed product
Or does it?

you put resin and air in bag. vacuum sucks out air.

you put liferaft and air in bag. vacuum sucks out air. if one was daft enough to put liferaft and water and air in bag, vacuum would suck out the air leaving water and raft in bag.

I dont see where your argument is going with this. a vacuum bag removes most of the air and helps squash the raft small to fit in valise or canister. then it keeps water OUT from the contents.
If you want your raft inflated with breathing air and not in a bag then crack on, I think the rest of us want it inflated with the specified Co2 then sealed in a v bag. I doubt there is a major conspiracy going on here, things are done this way because its for the best!

 

[Aquarella]

Had my plastimo life raft serviced last year in Athens. Problem is the life raft they sent back is not mine! Mine had the boat name painted on it, this one is badly scratched, scraped and dirty, no sign of the boat name and God knows what's in it or how old it is. I complained but they insisted it was the right one. Nothing much to do but hope I never need it.

 

[contessaman]

Had my plastimo life raft serviced last year in Athens. Problem is the life raft they sent back is not mine! Mine had the boat name painted on it, this one is badly scratched, scraped and dirty, no sign of the boat name and God knows what's in it or how old it is. I complained but they insisted it was the right one. Nothing much to do but hope I never need it.

they probably charged somebody 50 quid to scrap the one they gave you, then sold them a 'good' used one - yours!