Let down ny the so called RYA

[Tomahawk]

To tackle the OP's complaint,............
I suspect the RYA has decide to keep silent on various "difficult" issues for PR reasons. We are in an age where Politics has been driven by unproven science and hysterical reportage. The RYA are scared of appearing to not be be inclusive and green etc etc. It's far too easy for the liberal media to target supposedly whealthy yacht owners.

On reflection.. I think you are probably quite correct.
Which is why I consider they are not fit for purpose.
One only needs to look at how they failed to refute the imaginary evidence presented by a couple of self interested scuba divers to see how they are failing the people they purport to represent.

 

[capnsensible]

Have you had any response since contacting them to express your concerns?

 

[anoccasionalyachtsman]

It was expected that student were responsible enough to take care of their own stuff......

Sometimes, just sometimes, there are outside influences. And less of the student please, I are a graduate.

ps. I'm not sure that they always had central YM Instructor records. I wanted to shop someone who I didn't believe could possibly be a YM Instructor back in the 90's, and there was just an embarrassed silence from them.

 

[HissyFit]

A tautology for starters ... quango = quasi autonomous national government organisation

quasi independent = quasi autonomous

And inaccurate too since the RYA is not funded by government nor are its senior executives appointed by government (the two defining features of a quango)

Quasi-Autonomous Non-Governmental Organisation, if you please.

 

[Poignard]

[...]

ps. I'm not sure that they always had central YM Instructor records. I wanted to shop someone who I didn't believe could possibly be a YM Instructor back in the 90's, and there was just an embarrassed silence from them.

That's a very good point. Not only does the lack of a central register prevent someone who has lost his certificate proving his qualifications, it does not prevent someone who never had a qualification falsely claiming he had.

How many of us, on signing up for a course of instuction that would not lead to the issue of an RYA certificate, would demand to see the certificate the instructor claimed to have? It would never occur to me to do so.

 

[Mark-1]

That's a very good point. Not only does the lack of a central register prevent someone who has lost his certificate proving his qualifications, it does not prevent someone who never had a qualification falsely claiming he had.

How many of us, on signing up for a course of instuction that would not lead to the issue of an RYA certificate, would demand to see the certificate the instructor claimed to have? It would never occur to me to do so.

Surely they have a record of people issued with commercial/professional/instructor certificates?

 

[Poignard]

Surely they have a record of people issued with commercial/professional/instructor certificates?

Post #83 suggests it is not complete.

 

[anoccasionalyachtsman]

Surely they have a record of people issued with commercial/professional/instructor certificates?

Two possibilities in the case I mentioned. One is that they didn't, the other is that they didn't have an interest in exposing fraud/protecting their brand.

 

[capnsensible]

Surely they have a record of people issued with commercial/professional/instructor certificates?

Of course they do.

 

[capnsensible]

Two possibilities in the case I mentioned. One is that they didn't, the other is that they didn't have an interest in exposing fraud/protecting their brand.

That's not a brand issue. As I said in previous posts these exams are on behalf of the Maritime Coarguard Agency and the Department of Transport. Records are kept. Reminders are sent for routine requalificatio, yadda yadda.

But if you lost you day skipper theory certificate from 1998 or whatever, that's your fault.

 

[Bru]

Quasi-Autonomous Non-Governmental Organisation, if you please.

I *thought* that was what i wrote! Must be getting old!!! :/

 

[Poignard]

[...]

But if you lost you day skipper theory certificate from 1998 or whatever, that's your fault.

That's a bit harsh. If my house suddenly caught fire there would be many things to think about saving that were more important than RYA certificates.

 

[anoccasionalyachtsman]

That's not a brand issue. As I said in previous posts these exams are on behalf of the Maritime Coarguard Agency and the Department of Transport. Records are kept. Reminders are sent for routine requalificatio, yadda yadda.

But if you lost you day skipper theory certificate from 1998 or whatever, that's your fault.

I hope it's changed since my experience, but in this case they showed no interest in dealing with someone who was working for an an RYA approved school and was presumably able to hand out certificates for the lesser qualifications and almost certainly without an instructor qualification. I won't go any further than that because it might identify the school that still exists - without him. If they had records back then it was unforgiveable not to, and I should probably have taken it further. My recollection is that I was told that there were no records.

And my PB Level 2 from 2005 disappeared with some of my more important docs in a house move. Not exactly my fault.

 

[JumbleDuck]

There is still nothing in there that suggests they will get involved in commercial planning issues.

They gave warm support to various marina proposals in the late 80s, remarkably soon after receiving substantial financial support from Marina Developments Ltd. As I recall, they also warm supported the marina at Craobh, despite strong opposition from the west coast sailing community.

 

[ctva]

Just to clarify the position on certificates. All commercially endorsable certificates from PB2 up and in the YM scheme are centrally registered and recorded. The PB side, in which I am an Advanced Examiner and Trainer, has photo id certificates to help prevent forgery. All Instructor qualifications are recorded centrally and have to be revalidated every 5 years. As to the Trainers (dinghy, powerboat, YM), we have to be re-examined every 5 years by the heid bummer in the given discipline to keep current. All recorded. Oh, and all trainer positions are just annual appointments from the RYA after completing the training.

RYA quals, can only be trained and issued at recognised training centers which are inspected annually by Trainers appointed as Inspectors.

As to all the other pleasure certificates, they are recorded at the club, center or organisation that issues them. Always has been the case.

Like any large association, it has it's good and bad points but the RYA is without question, the most copied and respected training organisation around.

 

[capnsensible]

I hope it's changed since my experience, but in this case they showed no interest in dealing with someone who was working for an an RYA approved school and was presumably able to hand out certificates for the lesser qualifications and almost certainly without an instructor qualification. I won't go any further than that because it might identify the school that still exists - without him. If they had records back then it was unforgiveable not to, and I should probably have taken it further. My recollection is that I was told that there were no records.

And my PB Level 2 from 2005 disappeared with some of my more important docs in a house move. Not exactly my fault.

Recognised Training Centres are extremely well regulated, something that people seem reluctant to acknowledge.

To hire someone to teach at your school, they must produce the required documents. Hardly unique in any profession. The school has the responsibility to check this and are themselves inspected every year to ensure compliance with that and a whole host of other rules and regulations.

If you remain concerned then you could, without prejudice, contact the head of RYA cruising. Richard Falk.

 

[capnsensible]

That's a bit harsh. If my house suddenly caught fire there would be many things to think about saving that were more important than RYA certificates.

Of course, but no doubt some on here would blame the RYA for the house catching fire in the first place!

 

[Mark-1]

That's a bit harsh. If my house suddenly caught fire there would be many things to think about saving that were more important than RYA certificates.

I suspect that's the clue. The meaningful qualifications like ICCs or Instructor Quals they have a record of. The Day Skippers/Yachtmasters/Comp Crew etc they don't record. On reflection that seems reasonable. (Although a bit silly commercially - you'd think they'd maintain some kind of pretence to justify the time and money people invest, just to encourage people to buy courses.)

 

[Mark-1]

Of course, but no doubt some on here would blame the RYA for the house catching fire in the first place!

I'd blame poor gas management.

 

[Poignard]

Of course, but no doubt some on here would blame the RYA for the house catching fire in the first place!

And the RNLI for not putting the fire out!