Let down ny the so called RYA

[dunedin]

The RYA is a limited company. It only has about £21 million income, and more than half of that comes from subscriptions and Government grants. To run this business, they spend about £6 million in staff costs, including two directors , the higher paid of which was given around £200K in 2019-20. There's a defined benefit pension scheme (the type most companies can no longer afford) which is about £0.5 million in deficit. There's also a defined contribution pension scheme. It's not an especially inspiring company.

Almost all sailing clubs (and other sporting clubs) are now run as limited companies - I think to avoid the committee members being sued personally in this litigious day and age.

 

[Bru]

A couple of points of clarification but in advance let me say that I'm no fan of the RYA* ...

The RYA is *not* a Private Members Club because there are no restrictions on who can become a member (a PMC by definition has qualification criteria for membership and/or some form of approval or election of new members)

And as i repeatedly find myself pointing out on these 'ere forums, with the exception of Trusts, all charities are also Limited Companies. Usually Limited by Guarantee ie each member is liable for a proportion of the liabilities with conventionally that liability being limited to £1

Being a limited company does not imply or infer that the charitable body is a commercial entity

* I have my reasons - mainly the attempts by the RYA to claim supremacy in matters relating to inland waterways despite the presence of existing representative bodies of long standing eg the Inland Waterways Association

 

[capnsensible]

Oh, you mean a club.

Still no.

 

[Tomahawk]

So, your complaint is that they do not do what you (a non member ) want them to do even though it is not in their remit. These are by your own admission personal interests (which you have not declared here) not necessarily the interests of members of the RYA in general.

This is a planning issue and there is more than enough opportunity for you to express your opinions direct to the planners. Equally the planners are required by law to consider environmental issues along with those of the local community so not surprising the other bodies you mention are active at this stage. I expect local sailing interests such as clubs and other providers of boating services also have a legitimate interest and will be contributing - although their views may well not be the same as yours!

Methinks you complain too much about something you have a personal beef about.

No I am complaining about how the RYA is not doing a good job on behalf of those it purports to represent. This link is from their web site:-

Representation

Note how it says.... How we represent recreational boaters' interests

If they are representing boat owners interests, they need to be representing boat owners at all stages of all processes. That includes representing boaters at consultation stage of Local Plans because it is at plan making stage that everything is effectively decided.

 

[capnsensible]

?????
Just love these jobs where the firm has no competitors at all.

[/QUOTE]
Good for you! But the RYA has a serious competitor, International Yacht Training.

 

[pvb]

A couple of points of clarification but in advance let me say that I'm no fan of the RYA* ...

The RYA is *not* a Private Members Club because there are no restrictions on who can become a member (a PMC by definition has qualification criteria for membership and/or some form of approval or election of new members)

And as i repeatedly find myself pointing out on these 'ere forums, with the exception of Trusts, all charities are also Limited Companies. Usually Limited by Guarantee ie each member is liable for a proportion of the liabilities with conventionally that liability being limited to £1

Being a limited company does not imply or infer that the charitable body is a commercial entity

* I have my reasons - mainly the attempts by the RYA to claim supremacy in matters relating to inland waterways despite the presence of existing representative bodies of long standing eg the Inland Waterways Association

The RYA is not a charity.

 

[Bru]

The RYA is not a charity.

you are correct sir, my apple ogies

(it is a Membership Association)

Never the less, my point about being a Limited Company not inferring a commercial motivation stands

 

[Kurrawong_Kid]

In effect it is a quasi independent quango.

 

[Tranona]

So far so good.

Examiners and approved schools etc are regularly monitored by the RYA and have to account for the certificates they issue.
[/QUOTE]

But it's beyond the RYA to keep any record of certificate issued in their name?
[/QUOTE]
Always surprised me that they did not seem to, although from what has been posted earlier they have since 2011. I suppose they were relying previously on the requirement by examiners/providing organisations to keep the required records.

 

[Tranona]

No I am complaining about how the RYA is not doing a good job on behalf of those it purports to represent. This link is from their web site:-

Representation

Note how it says.... How we represent recreational boaters' interests

If they are representing boat owners interests, they need to be representing boat owners at all stages of all processes. That includes representing boaters at consultation stage of Local Plans because it is at plan making stage that everything is effectively decided.

There is still nothing in there that suggests they will get involved in commercial planning issues. What sort of stance do you want them to take? It could well be that an affiliated club would be disadvantaged by this proposal. Do they oppose it when you seem to think they should be supporting it?

Why do you think it is not doing a "good job"? What job is it supposed to do? Agree with you - I assume you are in favour, or the boaters who may be adversely affected by the development?

This is a commercial planning application and the process provides for all parties specifically affected by it to have their say. I fail to see what role the RYA would have in this process when the vast majority of members (and boaters in general) have no direct interest.

I can see a role for their planning experts in assisting clubs who are directly affected by the planning applications of others as when the Harbour Commissioners in Poole put forward proposals to develop the port facilities to include a marina that would directly affect our club and marina. However I fail to see why they should get involved in a commercial application.

 

[Graham376]

The RYA remains constituted as a membership association, with a Council of elected volunteers as its supreme policy-making body.

Which means anyone who doesn't like the way it's run can join, stand for election and then try to introduce some changes. That would be too much trouble though.

 

[Tomahawk]

Before

There is still nothing in there that suggests they will get involved in commercial planning issues. What sort of stance do you want them to take? It could well be that an affiliated club would be disadvantaged by this proposal. Do they oppose it when you seem to think they should be supporting it?

Why do you think it is not doing a "good job"? What job is it supposed to do? Agree with you - I assume you are in favour, or the boaters who may be adversely affected by the development?

This is a commercial planning application and the process provides for all parties specifically affected by it to have their say. I fail to see what role the RYA would have in this process when the vast majority of members (and boaters in general) have no direct interest.

I can see a role for their planning experts in assisting clubs who are directly affected by the planning applications of others as when the Harbour Commissioners in Poole put forward proposals to develop the port facilities to include a marina that would directly affect our club and marina. However I fail to see why they should get involved in a commercial application.

As per my OP, there used to be a policy in the adopted Local Plan that positively supported development of boating facilities. That policy has been removed in the new emerging plan.

The RYA as the self appointed body that claims to represent boating interests stayed silent during the public consultation stage back in 2015. I consider they should have behaved like the RSPB and CPRE and made comments to object to the removal of the positive protction in favour of the interests they claim to represent.

I do note, however that they are advertising for a "diversity" whatnot. If one thinks of it, an own goal by the goalie. Consider the effect of a 20% increase in the number of people who take up boating as a pastime as all the ethnic monorities adopt boating. But no more boating facilities to provide for the extra demand. There would probably be a hike in the price of all boating costs as supply cannot increase to match demand.

You may yet find you are unable to afford your boat. Now that would not be a good thing.

 

[oldgit]

What do you mean by "lots of development"?
And how does one sail a yacht with a mast on the Thames?

Not being awkward you understand... but I can't follow your thinking .

A Yot on the Thames..

 

[Tomahawk]

Can you shoot London Bridge in one?

But very nice

 

[capnsensible]

Examiners and approved schools etc are regularly monitored by the RYA and have to account for the certificates they issue.

But it's beyond the RYA to keep any record of certificate issued in their name?
[/QUOTE]
Always surprised me that they did not seem to, although from what has been posted earlier they have since 2011. I suppose they were relying previously on the requirement by examiners/providing organisations to keep the required records.
[/QUOTE]
A record was always kept of examined certicates such as Yachtmaster Offshore.

Competent crew, Day Skipper practical and the theory courses weren't. It was expected that student were responsible enough to take care of their own stuff......

 

[Tomahawk]

A record was always kept of examined certicates such as Yachtmaster Offshore.

Competent crew, Day Skipper practical and the theory courses weren't. It was expected that student were responsible enough to take care of their own stuff......
[/QUOTE]

All well and good in theory.

 

[zoidberg]

But it's beyond the RYA to keep any record of certificate issued in their name?

Always surprised me that they did not seem to, although from what has been posted earlier they have since 2011. I suppose they were relying previously on the requirement by examiners/providing organisations to keep the required records.
[/QUOTE]
A record was always kept of examined certicates such as Yachtmaster Offshore.

Competent crew, Day Skipper practical and the theory courses weren't. It was expected that student were responsible enough to take care of their own stuff......
[/QUOTE]

I have lots of spares - blank ones.

Who wants one?

 

[Tomahawk]

Please sir ..
Please Sir

 

[savageseadog]

To tackle the OP's complaint,............
I suspect the RYA has decide to keep silent on various "difficult" issues for PR reasons. We are in an age where Politics has been driven by unproven science and hysterical reportage. The RYA are scared of appearing to not be be inclusive and green etc etc. It's far too easy for the liberal media to target supposedly whealthy yacht owners.

 

[Bru]

In effect it is a quasi independent quango.

A tautology for starters ... quango = quasi autonomous national government organisation

quasi independent = quasi autonomous

And inaccurate too since the RYA is not funded by government nor are its senior executives appointed by government (the two defining features of a quango)