leaving diesels ticking over

[stubate]

bulls**t baffles brains

yawn yawn,
the good ole boys from texas used to have a saying "bull shit baffles brains" and mine is "dont try to bullshit a bullshitter"
and after spending my working life diagnosing, fixing and overhauling diesel engines, ranging from single cylinder donks to 16 cylinder turbo supercharged detroit diesels i can certainly say with some authority what is and isnt about diesels.
superficial comments with all my experience??
really
im surprised you havent signed off master mariner or Bsc or something similar
stu

 

[charles_reed]

Stu,

I'm afraid, as is likely in such a complex issue, you have only a part of the story.

Having stripped a number of diesels I can assure you that glazing occurs, especially in marine diesels and the only way to correct that is to rebore, new pistons, etc.
Which to put it mildly is a bore.

If you were to check the diesels fitted to generators and pumps (especially air compressors) you would find that they are fitted with "hot" thermostats, opening at >95C, and have high-pressure caps and therefore high-pressure cooling systems.
To argue from those to marine diesels is an act of faith which is probably misplaced.
Indirect marine diesels have thermostats opening at just over 90C, raw water cooled ones at <85C.
Road vehicles have thermostats opening at very similar temperatures.

I'd agree with your contention that the diesels to which you referred: provising they're warmed up thoroughly, will come to little harm with up to 50% of their time idling - beyond that, if you care to read the handbook, you'll find the manufacturers' recommend more frequent oil-changes (in the case of Cummins from 150 hrs to 50 hours).

So I'll rephrase my comment made in the previous post "Everyone knows that, with the exception of stationary diesels designed for long periods of idling, running a diesel at a fast tickover, unloaded, is the quickest way to reduce it to scrap."

;-) (Unless of course you live in the parallel universe of the oilfields).

 

[ccscott49]

Charles,
was your last remark/sentence really neccessary? I liked what you said previous to that, which did make sense, but then you had to make a snide comment like that, along with your previous statement about oilfiled workers destroying their employers equipment, I would have thought that was beneath you, but obviously not, I don't think I'll bother reading anything else you write.

 

[charles_reed]

Re: Plainspeak

Nothing against it, but one problem with e-mails is that people can easily mis-construe what you intended to say and take offence.

Face-to-face plainspeaking is just great (60% of the meaning being conveyed by body-language) - so you can call somebody of 66, whose father's name was left off his birth-certificate an "Old bastard" with a grin on your face and an arm on his shoulder nad he'll understand you're using an antipodean term of endearment...

 

[charles_reed]

Re:SEAESTA no Profile

Obviously an MI6 operative keeping a watching brief on this board for any el Quaeda messages being passed

 

[duncan]

so with a relatively large T diesel in a smallish boat you are effictively saying I have a choice of making a wake (otherwise I am not under any real load) or damaging my engine during the summer trip from berth to Poole Harbour entrance..............
Must be why so many travel at 9 -10knots churning up a wake when it would be so much mor efuel efficent to travel at 6.
Armed with this level of understanding I can see the raggies waving and smiling as the kettle leaves the stove for the 3rd time in 10 minutes - after all is said and done no one is going to want another boater to be causing damage to their engine.

 

[ccscott49]

If you say so.

 

[Bejasus]

C'mon Duncan, now you're being really silly and of course you should know better. Honestly..........

 

[ccscott49]

Stu,
I know one thing, it's rather obvious who has to work on and keep these beasts running and those who have studied them at length, I respectfully retire from this discussion I know I have learnt from it and will be wiser, but I also know when it's time to leave. I don't believe any further knowledge is to be gained from here especially after the last post from Duncan. Bye mate, see you on PM.
Colin.

 

[Bejasus]

Re: bulls**t baffles brains

Stu, in relation to Detroits, surely they would be the one engine you would NOT leave running on tickover?

 

[ccscott49]

Re: bulls**t baffles brains

That beggars the question, why?

 

[Bejasus]

Re: bulls**t baffles brains

Because they are 2 stroke diesels and as a result, when left ticking over for any sort of length of time, they get really sh*tt*ed up and they also suffer from low oil pressure at low revs. We have 16 x V-16s on here, 2 of which are turbo's. We usually run them at around 1100 rpm instead.

 

[Petercatterall]

My on and off shore oilfield experience was that on many occaisions the American loud mouth and hire and fire attitude was counter productive. Staff were always covering the arses of which you spoke!!

 

[ccscott49]

Re: bulls**t baffles brains

1100 is ticking over!! /forums/images/icons/smile.gif Well aware they're two strokes, worked on a few, but only V8's, tell me what is very unusual about the piston rings on these engines, the only engine I know of that has this feature, which tells us without a stripdown how much wear the engine is suffering?

 

[ccscott49]

I'm afraid the mercan attitude of hire and fire is still with us, but now it's the brits who do it!

 

[Bejasus]

I'm forever getting sh*t from my boss for not being more like it with my guys, but I just tell him that one arse at a time is enough for anyone to deal with...lol/forums/images/icons/cool.gif

 

[ccscott49]

I know the feeling well, but now they don't bother me anymore, they need the experience.

 

[Bergman]

Re: My 2 penneth

First I know very little about Diesel engines. never stripped one down, never intend to.

I am amazed at the level of vitriol of such an arcane matter.

The logic is so simple:

Depending upon opinion leaving a boat engine on tick-over for "extended" periods may or may not cause damage.

No suggestion that not leaving it on tick-over will cause damage.

Therefore unless absolutely forced do not leave on tick-over.

All agreed that no damage will be done

QED

End of debate

Merry Xmas and engine failure free New Year

 

[ccscott49]

Re: My 2 penneth

Sorrreeeee! You have your facts totally wrong, read some or all of the posts, then try again, no problem, just continue to do what you've always done, won't bother me one iota. Merry christmas to you and a very happy new year, safe sailing!

 

[Bergman]

Re:Wait a minit

Have I got this wrong I am easily confused.

Some people say leaving on tick-over causes "glazing" and "wrecks engine"

Other people say rubbish lots of engines left ticking over without damage.

I think that is the gist of the debate.

Can't find anyone who says being left on tick-over is positively beneficial and we ought to do it as a matter of course.

The logical progression would seem to me that not doing it cannot cause damage.

Is it your case that it will cause damage?

If not where am I wrong