Leaking cabin windows/port lights - how to rectify?

Robert Wilson

Robert Wilson

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Second Coast, Ross-shire, overlooking Gruinard Bay
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I'm at my wits end!
I've tried numerous times to seal with that "stop-leak" liquid and sikaflex and even resorted to sticking duct-tape all round the outside on the frame to the GRP.
Still they all weep and drip onto chart-table, galley, bunks etc.

Apart from totally replacing them, are there any ways the wise ones know?

Failing a repair, what would be the costs (roughly) of replacement?
There are six, of three different sizes.

Any recommendations as to suppliers?

Khamsin is circa 35 years old, and "well built"

Thanks in anticipation.
 
Robert Wilson said:
I'm at my wits end!
I've tried numerous times to seal with that "stop-leak" liquid and sikaflex and even resorted to sticking duct-tape all round the outside on the frame to the GRP.
Still they all weep and drip onto chart-table, galley, bunks etc.

Apart from totally replacing them, are there any ways the wise ones know?

Failing a repair, what would be the costs (roughly) of replacement?
There are six, of three different sizes.

Any recommendations as to suppliers?

Khamsin is circa 35 years old, and "well built"

Thanks in anticipation.
Click to expand...

If they leak between the frames and the GRP it is not a massive job to remove them and refit them with new sealant if the frames are sound. Butyl preferred or butyl tape.

Refurbishing the actual window units, if there are leaks between the glazing and the frames, may be a job for the professionals.
 
Robert Wilson said:
I'm at my wits end!
I've tried numerous times to seal with that "stop-leak" liquid and sikaflex and even resorted to sticking duct-tape all round the outside on the frame to the GRP.
Still they all weep and drip onto chart-table, galley, bunks etc.
Click to expand...

Been there, done that (including the duct tape), got the t-shirt. There is no alternative - you have to get 'em out and, when you've got that far, you might as well get them rebuilt.
 
Thank you one-and-all.

I think they leak between the glass and the frame. So it looks like they have to come out in any case.

Hmm, getting them out looks to be a sod-of-a-job - going on experience from a previous attempt. I gather they are glued-in in a way strong enough to withstand an atom bomb?

Any tips, suggestions?

TIA
 
Robert Wilson said:
Thank you one-and-all.

I think they leak between the glass and the frame. So it looks like they have to come out in any case.

Hmm, getting them out looks to be a sod-of-a-job - going on experience from a previous attempt. I gather they are glued-in in a way strong enough to withstand an atom bomb?

Any tips, suggestions?

TIA
Click to expand...

Use a very thing scraper that you can hit with a hammer. Tap it in between the frame and the GRP, then tap it round to cut the adhesive.
 
Before taking them off I would ensure that I am dealing with a real leak and not dripping condensation.

No, I am not trying to be facetious; I had that problem in the forecabin of my previous boat.
 
I reckon I can DIY most things. I removed and rebuilt my windows many times and reckoned they were done to professional standard, but still they leaked after a time. Eventually I bit the bullet and had them rebuilt by a specialist in Athens. Lo and behold, they advised that the glass was too small for the frames and had been since new. They supplied new glass and rebuilt all eight windows, in a process that involves priming glass and frame, applying sealant and baking everything in ab oven. They have been perfect ever since.

Assuming your frames are stuck in with Sikaflex or some similar strong sealant, they will come out using a process something like the one proposed by Paul in #6. The trick is to lift one edge, as the sealant at the tip of a tear will break quite easily, whereas trying to push the whole window out in one go is likely to be unsuccessful.
 
PaulRainbow said:
Use a very thing scraper that you can hit with a hammer. Tap it in between the frame and the GRP, then tap it round to cut the adhesive.
Click to expand...

That sounds difficult.
My frames seem to be "bolted" through from inside to outside with only a screw slot to inside frame. I tried (years ago) unscrewing them but could not shift the screw and didn't want to either "neck" the screw or ruin the slot.

Any tips for removing the frames (inner and outer)?
 
Am I correct in assuming that if/when the inner frame/flange is removed, then the sealing can be "broken" and the centre and outer will push-out (in the manner described above)?

When out, I assume the glass is embedded in the outer section of the assembly which then needs to be separated and re-bedded?

Then the whole lot replaced and well-and-truly embedded with butyl or whatever?
 
Robert Wilson said:
Am I correct in assuming that if/when the inner frame/flange is removed, then the sealing can be "broken" and the centre and outer will push-out (in the manner described above)?

When out, I assume the glass is embedded in the outer section of the assembly which then needs to be separated and re-bedded?

Then the whole lot replaced and well-and-truly embedded with butyl or whatever?
Click to expand...

Sounds like they are held in with inter screws. The slotted half is a machine screw, the other half is internally threaded and externally splined. You undue the screw and push the other half out. If they won't come undone you need to drill the screws out, which is truly a pain in the bum, plus the screws are expensive.

Once out, the frames usually split, but expect them to be tight and awkward. I just split some awkward ones by clamping them to a workmate, each half clamped to one of the workmate "jaws", then opened the workmate. Seals can be purchased from www.sealsdirect.co.uk
 
Robert Wilson said:
Thank you for that - although it doesn't sound a joy!!

Last time I tried the machine screws they wouldn't budge; would applying heat (hot air gun) be of benefit?

I'm not sure I follow your "splitting" technique but it may become clearer when (IF) I can remove the screws and then the inner plate/flange?
Click to expand...

Remove the screws. If they won't come undone drill them out. Drilling into a slot is a lot of fun, not, especially as the screws are stainless. If you can very carefully grind a flat spot in the middle and then dot punch them, it makes the job much easier.

Now you need to remove the assembly from the outside, the inside ones should come out easily. Get a really thin scraper with a flexible blade that you can tap with a hammer. Tap it in between the frame and the GRP, hold the handle as near to parallel with the frame as you can and tap it along to cut the sealant. If you have someone who can push against the inside to try and create a gap, great. If no, once you get a little way along you should be able to tap a little bit of wood or something in to open a small gap. Keep the gaps small and the taps light or you damage something or warp the frames.

Now you need to split the frames. I'm not sure of the exact frames in your boat, but the common ones split in half vertically or horizontally. At the joins there should be a screw or two holding a metal plate inside the frame, which keeps the two halves together. These may be covered in sealant, so dig them out and remove them. It's highly improbable that you will be able to just pull the two halves apart and prising with screwdrivers and the like will no doubt cause damage.

So, to the workmate. http://www.blackanddecker.co.uk/en-...-workbenches/params/1/24/newest/-/-/-/-/-/-/-

My first thought was to close the workmate, but the orange plastic pegs into the jaws and lay the window over them, so when you open the workmate the orange pegs come against the inside of the frames and force them apart. Unfortunately i didn't have the orange pegs on the van (mine are actually black). So i closed the workmate and laid the frame in the middle of it, with the join parallel to the workmate jaws. I clamped each half of the frame to the jaw it was laying on and slowly opened the workmate, separating the two halves of the frame.
 
PaulRainbow said:
Remove the screws. If they won't come undone drill them out. Drilling into a slot is a lot of fun, not, especially as the screws are stainless. If you can very carefully grind a flat spot in the middle and then dot punch them, it makes the job much easier.
Click to expand...

One way of reducing the agro is to make a shallow conical depression in the slot through the application of a centre-punch. Then, instead of a regular drill bit, use a centre-drill as commonly used on lathes. They are quite cheap and much stronger. One only needs to drill out the head and the rest can then be pushed out with a nail-punch.

images
 
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