NorthUp
Active member
A practical test of laser flares-
http://www.facebook.com/video/video.php?v=200589526635502&oid=31395967167&comments
http://www.facebook.com/video/video.php?v=200589526635502&oid=31395967167&comments
Laser Flares
- Thread starter NorthUp
- Start date
Searush
New member
Hhhmm, pretty much as most of us agreed last time this was discussed. Interesting comment from the kayaker that he had seen a personal flare on someone's lifejacket accidentally ignite. Not something I had heard of before. Nor something that would add much to one's safety either!
Twister_Ken
Well-known member
No surprises there, then.
What the report failed to mention is that all lifeboat crew carry a combined day/night pyrotechnic on them when on service.
What the report failed to mention is that all lifeboat crew carry a combined day/night pyrotechnic on them when on service.
DaveS
Well-known member
Interesting that the lifeboat crew letting off the hand held flare seemed happy to do so without wearing gloves - let alone welding gauntlets as occasionally advised on here.
Searush
New member
He will have the confidence of having done it & seen it several times before I suspect. Did you notice the body of the flare was glowing red hot like a Starwars light sabre!
I carry a cheap pair of chrome leather gardening gloves for anchor chain handling etc & would probably use those if I ever needed to fire a flare.
Twister_Ken
Well-known member
Look again. I think he was wearing a glove.
I was at a flare demo run by RNLI a few years back, and we were given a glove to wear on the 'holding' hand, but not on the 'firing' hand which needs to be able to grasp a thin trigger string on some models of flares.
Yes, the tube does become red hot. We dumped them into a water bucket when they were finished, but the advice was to drop them over the side when at sea.
Having fired both handhelds and parachutes, it would have to be a hell of a laser to achieve anything like the visibility, range and brightness of a pyro.
Incidentally - don't stand down wind of an orange smoke!
I was at a flare demo run by RNLI a few years back, and we were given a glove to wear on the 'holding' hand, but not on the 'firing' hand which needs to be able to grasp a thin trigger string on some models of flares.
Yes, the tube does become red hot. We dumped them into a water bucket when they were finished, but the advice was to drop them over the side when at sea.
Having fired both handhelds and parachutes, it would have to be a hell of a laser to achieve anything like the visibility, range and brightness of a pyro.
Incidentally - don't stand down wind of an orange smoke!
Last edited:
Cymrogwyllt
Well-known member
Stupid not to have the flares on the person. The most common reason for needing them is separation from the kayak. I used to carry a parachute and at least one smoke in the back pocket of the buoyancy aid, even when surfing.
rob2
Active member
Although interesting that a practical test has at last been publicised, as usual the statements given as reason for the test were not discussed. A recent comment from the MCA (IIRC) in PBO said that flares cannot ignite unless the firing mechanism is deployed, so how did the flare go off in a lifejacket? It struck me that perhaps the cap had been removed for faster deployment, or maybe it was a "personal" flare already loaded into the trigger mechanism. Either way, something must have snagged the firing device. Never mind pulling the string, with gloves I couldn't pull the protective cap off to access the trigger!
It's a great shame that the laser "flare" proved so inefective, but no surprise really as the nature of laser radiation is the opposite of that required of a flare - omnidirectional.
Rob.
It's a great shame that the laser "flare" proved so inefective, but no surprise really as the nature of laser radiation is the opposite of that required of a flare - omnidirectional.
Rob.
SPR
New member
Greatland rescue laser flares
Hi All,
As stated before on previous posts, I am the UK importer of the Rescue laser Flares, I don't know if the GREATLAND Rescue Laser Flare was tested, or if it was just the rotating laser.
(nb. Greatland has patents on rotating lasers in USA, but did not develop it since they had issues with range, and the stationary version was manufacture instead.
GREATLAND Rescue Lasers have proven range of 20 +miles, If use in accordance to the instructions. and use in the US Military , US Coastguard and Border Agency.
(The last 3 miles a LED Strobe or Button Light is recommended, side this is easier to see at these ranges)
These are not meant as primary means of alert but are designed to guide a rescuer to your position after activating for help by others means _ VHF , PLB or Mobile.
Like all Safety Equipment you need to learn how to use the product and read the instruction, this means when you need it, it should be second nature. You don't pick up a VHF and start using it without practice, or doing VHF course.
A few Tests on our Products:
http://www.sprmarine.co.uk/pdf/Baltic_Sea_Test_March_8 _2010.pdf Test Report
http://www.equipped.org/rescuelaser.htm
A user guide:
http://www.sprmarine.co.uk/pdf/Rescue_Light_Handout.pdf
If you want Powerpoint presentation mailed to you email me info<@>rescue-flares.co.uk
Recommendations
Quotes
"This Signal Laser is perhaps one of the best night signals invented."
- US Navy Aviation Survival Gear Field Test Report
"Bottom line is that the Rescue Laser is worth adding to your survival gear and the red Rescue Laser Light is standard equipment in my Doug Ritter Ultimate Aviator Survival Paks. It's small and light enough to fit on a key chain. In terms of distress signaling priorities, after a 406 MHz PLB and a signal mirror, it's next on the list. While the red Rescue Lasers are certainly adequate, the Green Rescue Laser Flare is definitely an even better choice. The Green Rescue Laser Flare is what I carry and is what's in my personal aviation survival kit. In my opinion, the Green Rescue Laser Flare is well worth the considerable extra cost if you can swing it, but if not, the red will do just fine."
- Product Review by Doug Ritter
"During our recent Search and Rescue Exercise, we used the lasers during cadet training and mission pilot survival training. These lasers are clearly an extrememly helpful suvival tool and their utility was much appreciated during the training exercise... Cadets were on the ground in locations unknown to the mission pilots and used the lasers to signal the search planes. Mission pilots were easily able to see the lasers, and all were greatly impressed by how well the lasers worked."
- John Lynn, 1LT, Civil Air Patrol, Commander, 17th Composite Squadron
"On January 28, 2003 at 7:45 PM I tested your Laser Flare at the Dillingham Airport. We flew a Cessna 180 and had the laser scan us from among the lights at the airport. The laser was visible at 8 miles and 1,200 feet. I believe it would have been visible further but we had to turn back due to snow."
- Ward Jones, Injury Prevention Specialist, Bristol Bay Area Health Corporation
"We've been watching this product develop for several years, and now that we've tested it, we're impressed... A worthy addition to pyrotechnic kits and personal survival gear, this simple but ingenius tool is moving toward a place at center stage in the search-and-rescue world."
- Practical-sailor.com
"I believe this laser will revolutionize the way search and rescue is conducted in maritime environments and on land. As a retired police officer, I believe the product is excellent for certain tactical operations and for those arenas where signaling is required."
- Paul M. Burke, BOD National Association of Search and Rescue (Read Full Text)
"The Laser Light is the best emergency signaling device that is not a radio. On two occasions I have been in situations where a directional light signal would have made the difference between a night out in unfriendly country or being back in the company of friends and a warm fire. We all know life itself often hangs on such fine points. Now that one of these is available, I go nowhere without one. One is in the car, one in the backpack, the fishing vest, and the ski gloves."
- Alaskan Pilot, Pat Thurston ATP, AAM, BBA, BSA
"Sitting dead in the water 18 miles out of Seward (Alaska) in foggy late evening conditions. I used my laser light to signal an approaching boat. After waving the laser light twice the boat immediately turned and headed straight for us. The intensity of the laser caught the eye of the party on the other boat. Instead of having to spend the night out on the ocean we got a 3-hour tow back to the harbor. Thank you Greatland Laser!"
- Erik Kenning, Anchorage, Alaska
"As a Search and Rescue Coordinator for over 19 years I have seen gizmo’s come and go. When I first heard of the Laser Flare I thought it would be another piece of equipment that wouldn’t be of much use for Search and Rescue. On May 16th 2009 I personally used the Green Rescue Laser Flare in both daylight and dark of night settings. I was very impressed in what I saw and look forward to trying it in fog and raining conditions. It was easy to use and the light signal that is created would easily be seen by rescuers at a great distance. We plan to continue to test the Rescue Laser in other environments, and if it operates in other conditions as demonstrated, it will be a great tool for both Rescuers and Victims alike."
- Gene Seiber, Search & Rescue Coordinator
Success Stories
Calgary Police Service Rescue
On Saturday, August 02, 2003, at 23:34hrs Sgt. Mike ter Kuile, Tactical Flight Officer, and Chief Pilot Brendan McCormick for Calgary Police Air Services Unit, were requested to assist the RCMP and the Calgary Fire Department in a search for 4 rafters that were overdue by approximately 4 hours. Upon arrival at the scene it was noted that 2 police units and 3 trucks from the Fire Department had been searching for the victims along with members of their families.
An initial search was started in the area using the Wescam 16DS FLIR on the MD-520N. At approximately 0030hrs, the victims were located by the flight crew approximately 5NM from the search area on a sandbar. After landing nearby, the victims were checked by the Flight Officer for injuries and it was discovered that 2 of the 4 had lost their footwear when a raft was punctured. All were cold and wet and suffering from mild hypothermia. There were 3 females and 1 male with ages ranging from 17 to 23.
They had attempted to contact family members and the police via cell phone however their only phone had gotten wet and was not functional. Due to the remote location of the victims, their lack of footwear and clothing and the advanced time of day, it was decided to transport the rafters by air. Two of the four victims were loaded into HAWC 1 and transported to an LZ set up by Calgary Fire Department personnel. The remaining 2 rafters were left with a Rescue Laser Flare to assist the flight crew with relocating them for the 2nd trip. This was the 1st opportunity for the Unit to test the rescue laser and it proved to be extremely visible from at least 3 NM away from the helicopter. The victims were located in a shallow river valley and were surrounded by trees that added to their poor visibility.
One of the primary benefits that resulted from the use of the Rescue Laser was the reassurance it provided to the other two victims that the Flight Crew would have no difficulty finding them again thanks to the effectiveness of the laser as both a position marker and signaling device. Although not a critical rescue it was a good opportunity for the crew members to utilize their respective skills and equipment and to gain insight into the many life-saving applications afforded by the use of the Rescue Lasers.
The Mississippi River Challenge for Rett Syndrome and Leukodystrophy
Thank you for sending us two of your Rescue Laser Flare Magnums for The Mississippi River Challenge for Rett Syndrome and Leukodystrophy. We were successful in shattering the world record over 5 days, setting a new time of 18 days, 4 hours and 51 minutes! We averaged 129 miles a day during the worst May on record for tornados! It was awesome to be able to locate our support team, even at distances up to 6 miles away. Your Laser Flare worked wonderfully, and really contributed to our ability to keep a world record pace. Thank you from all of us, and from all those we were doing this for.
- Clark Eid
Bureau of Immigration and Customs Enforcement, Office of Air and Marine Interdiction
Surveillance Branch - West
P.O. Box 18900
Corpus Cristi, TX 78480-8900
Margaret Kearny
GSM Concorde AeroSales
2046 Madison St.
Hollywood, FL 33020
Dear Margaret,
The Laser Flare was tested in a variety of environments such as daylight, darkness, rain, and fog. Visibility from an airborne aircraft ranged from 15 miles at night, 8 miles in rain, 1.5 miles in fog and 1.5 mile daytime. This flare would be of tremendous value in a SAR situation for survivors on the ground or in a raft and would be easily stored in existing survival equipment aboard the aircraft.
I greatly appreciate allowing me the opportunity to test your unit and please find it enclosed. I would anticipate that I will be able to acquire enough units to place in all our aircraft and SAR kits.
Thanks again for your time and cooperation.
Sincerely,
Gary "Suds" Sudhoff, Pilot, I.C.E.
Hi All,
As stated before on previous posts, I am the UK importer of the Rescue laser Flares, I don't know if the GREATLAND Rescue Laser Flare was tested, or if it was just the rotating laser.
(nb. Greatland has patents on rotating lasers in USA, but did not develop it since they had issues with range, and the stationary version was manufacture instead.
GREATLAND Rescue Lasers have proven range of 20 +miles, If use in accordance to the instructions. and use in the US Military , US Coastguard and Border Agency.
(The last 3 miles a LED Strobe or Button Light is recommended, side this is easier to see at these ranges)
These are not meant as primary means of alert but are designed to guide a rescuer to your position after activating for help by others means _ VHF , PLB or Mobile.
Like all Safety Equipment you need to learn how to use the product and read the instruction, this means when you need it, it should be second nature. You don't pick up a VHF and start using it without practice, or doing VHF course.
A few Tests on our Products:
http://www.sprmarine.co.uk/pdf/Baltic_Sea_Test_March_8 _2010.pdf Test Report
http://www.equipped.org/rescuelaser.htm
A user guide:
http://www.sprmarine.co.uk/pdf/Rescue_Light_Handout.pdf
If you want Powerpoint presentation mailed to you email me info<@>rescue-flares.co.uk
Recommendations
Quotes
"This Signal Laser is perhaps one of the best night signals invented."
- US Navy Aviation Survival Gear Field Test Report
"Bottom line is that the Rescue Laser is worth adding to your survival gear and the red Rescue Laser Light is standard equipment in my Doug Ritter Ultimate Aviator Survival Paks. It's small and light enough to fit on a key chain. In terms of distress signaling priorities, after a 406 MHz PLB and a signal mirror, it's next on the list. While the red Rescue Lasers are certainly adequate, the Green Rescue Laser Flare is definitely an even better choice. The Green Rescue Laser Flare is what I carry and is what's in my personal aviation survival kit. In my opinion, the Green Rescue Laser Flare is well worth the considerable extra cost if you can swing it, but if not, the red will do just fine."
- Product Review by Doug Ritter
"During our recent Search and Rescue Exercise, we used the lasers during cadet training and mission pilot survival training. These lasers are clearly an extrememly helpful suvival tool and their utility was much appreciated during the training exercise... Cadets were on the ground in locations unknown to the mission pilots and used the lasers to signal the search planes. Mission pilots were easily able to see the lasers, and all were greatly impressed by how well the lasers worked."
- John Lynn, 1LT, Civil Air Patrol, Commander, 17th Composite Squadron
"On January 28, 2003 at 7:45 PM I tested your Laser Flare at the Dillingham Airport. We flew a Cessna 180 and had the laser scan us from among the lights at the airport. The laser was visible at 8 miles and 1,200 feet. I believe it would have been visible further but we had to turn back due to snow."
- Ward Jones, Injury Prevention Specialist, Bristol Bay Area Health Corporation
"We've been watching this product develop for several years, and now that we've tested it, we're impressed... A worthy addition to pyrotechnic kits and personal survival gear, this simple but ingenius tool is moving toward a place at center stage in the search-and-rescue world."
- Practical-sailor.com
"I believe this laser will revolutionize the way search and rescue is conducted in maritime environments and on land. As a retired police officer, I believe the product is excellent for certain tactical operations and for those arenas where signaling is required."
- Paul M. Burke, BOD National Association of Search and Rescue (Read Full Text)
"The Laser Light is the best emergency signaling device that is not a radio. On two occasions I have been in situations where a directional light signal would have made the difference between a night out in unfriendly country or being back in the company of friends and a warm fire. We all know life itself often hangs on such fine points. Now that one of these is available, I go nowhere without one. One is in the car, one in the backpack, the fishing vest, and the ski gloves."
- Alaskan Pilot, Pat Thurston ATP, AAM, BBA, BSA
"Sitting dead in the water 18 miles out of Seward (Alaska) in foggy late evening conditions. I used my laser light to signal an approaching boat. After waving the laser light twice the boat immediately turned and headed straight for us. The intensity of the laser caught the eye of the party on the other boat. Instead of having to spend the night out on the ocean we got a 3-hour tow back to the harbor. Thank you Greatland Laser!"
- Erik Kenning, Anchorage, Alaska
"As a Search and Rescue Coordinator for over 19 years I have seen gizmo’s come and go. When I first heard of the Laser Flare I thought it would be another piece of equipment that wouldn’t be of much use for Search and Rescue. On May 16th 2009 I personally used the Green Rescue Laser Flare in both daylight and dark of night settings. I was very impressed in what I saw and look forward to trying it in fog and raining conditions. It was easy to use and the light signal that is created would easily be seen by rescuers at a great distance. We plan to continue to test the Rescue Laser in other environments, and if it operates in other conditions as demonstrated, it will be a great tool for both Rescuers and Victims alike."
- Gene Seiber, Search & Rescue Coordinator
Success Stories
Calgary Police Service Rescue
On Saturday, August 02, 2003, at 23:34hrs Sgt. Mike ter Kuile, Tactical Flight Officer, and Chief Pilot Brendan McCormick for Calgary Police Air Services Unit, were requested to assist the RCMP and the Calgary Fire Department in a search for 4 rafters that were overdue by approximately 4 hours. Upon arrival at the scene it was noted that 2 police units and 3 trucks from the Fire Department had been searching for the victims along with members of their families.
An initial search was started in the area using the Wescam 16DS FLIR on the MD-520N. At approximately 0030hrs, the victims were located by the flight crew approximately 5NM from the search area on a sandbar. After landing nearby, the victims were checked by the Flight Officer for injuries and it was discovered that 2 of the 4 had lost their footwear when a raft was punctured. All were cold and wet and suffering from mild hypothermia. There were 3 females and 1 male with ages ranging from 17 to 23.
They had attempted to contact family members and the police via cell phone however their only phone had gotten wet and was not functional. Due to the remote location of the victims, their lack of footwear and clothing and the advanced time of day, it was decided to transport the rafters by air. Two of the four victims were loaded into HAWC 1 and transported to an LZ set up by Calgary Fire Department personnel. The remaining 2 rafters were left with a Rescue Laser Flare to assist the flight crew with relocating them for the 2nd trip. This was the 1st opportunity for the Unit to test the rescue laser and it proved to be extremely visible from at least 3 NM away from the helicopter. The victims were located in a shallow river valley and were surrounded by trees that added to their poor visibility.
One of the primary benefits that resulted from the use of the Rescue Laser was the reassurance it provided to the other two victims that the Flight Crew would have no difficulty finding them again thanks to the effectiveness of the laser as both a position marker and signaling device. Although not a critical rescue it was a good opportunity for the crew members to utilize their respective skills and equipment and to gain insight into the many life-saving applications afforded by the use of the Rescue Lasers.
The Mississippi River Challenge for Rett Syndrome and Leukodystrophy
Thank you for sending us two of your Rescue Laser Flare Magnums for The Mississippi River Challenge for Rett Syndrome and Leukodystrophy. We were successful in shattering the world record over 5 days, setting a new time of 18 days, 4 hours and 51 minutes! We averaged 129 miles a day during the worst May on record for tornados! It was awesome to be able to locate our support team, even at distances up to 6 miles away. Your Laser Flare worked wonderfully, and really contributed to our ability to keep a world record pace. Thank you from all of us, and from all those we were doing this for.
- Clark Eid
Bureau of Immigration and Customs Enforcement, Office of Air and Marine Interdiction
Surveillance Branch - West
P.O. Box 18900
Corpus Cristi, TX 78480-8900
Margaret Kearny
GSM Concorde AeroSales
2046 Madison St.
Hollywood, FL 33020
Dear Margaret,
The Laser Flare was tested in a variety of environments such as daylight, darkness, rain, and fog. Visibility from an airborne aircraft ranged from 15 miles at night, 8 miles in rain, 1.5 miles in fog and 1.5 mile daytime. This flare would be of tremendous value in a SAR situation for survivors on the ground or in a raft and would be easily stored in existing survival equipment aboard the aircraft.
I greatly appreciate allowing me the opportunity to test your unit and please find it enclosed. I would anticipate that I will be able to acquire enough units to place in all our aircraft and SAR kits.
Thanks again for your time and cooperation.
Sincerely,
Gary "Suds" Sudhoff, Pilot, I.C.E.
maxi77
Active member
All this appreciation is very good but where are the internationally agreed standards, covering both safety and deployment which will actually make these devices worthwhile.
A pretty flashing light is just that until it becomes an properly recognised distress signal which none of these so called laser flares are.
A pretty flashing light is just that until it becomes an properly recognised distress signal which none of these so called laser flares are.
Searush
New member
SPR,
Thanks for letting us know your commercial interest in these products.
Thanks for letting us know your commercial interest in these products.
jwilson
Well-known member
I've fired lots of flares, handheld and rocket, without wearing gloves- most on Nov 5th (we were the local lifeboat station) but some in earnest once (the two trawlers in sight ignored them).
