volvopaul
Well-Known Member
Clive, I'm trying to get him to keep it on the coast, well just have to work on him!!
Kad 300 v D6 in targa 40
- Thread starter tamarind
- Start date
Andrew M
Well-Known Member
Hi Paul, yep, have been on here for a while but mainly on the Thames section, will have a make on those batteries soon, I've asked for Vartas.
Yes Clive will let you know, we are very nearly there now, deposit paid and seatrial done, last few bits to sort out.
Sorry, didn't mean to interrupt your thread.
Yes Clive will let you know, we are very nearly there now, deposit paid and seatrial done, last few bits to sort out.
Sorry, didn't mean to interrupt your thread.
Latestarter1
Well-Known Member
Alway strikes a nerve with Volvo people and not sure why...........As member of EUROMOT we regularly met at Deutz plant in Cologne with Volvo as well as the other members of European Engine Manufacturers Association. D6 was there for all to see in the development test cells. Never any doubt that the D6 was intended for anything other marine market as I pointed out, lack of heavy duty features, chain driven camshaft and no service oversize pistons make it unsuitable for any other application.
If anybody requires absolute proof of the above take a look at Volvo the shareholding in Deutz AG around 1999. Deutz were in in poor shape due to pension liabilites and Volvo took a substantial holding in their development partner as a safety net.
As to AVL NOBODY develops a new engine without expertise from either AVL or Ricardo.
Late 90's were difficult for Volvo Penta as Volvo had the for sale sign over the door. Volvo only started thinking about engine development again once they had aquired Mack Trucks via Renault Truck which gave them the critical volume. I was working with Volvo on a replacement for the old 16 liter engine until the aquisition of Mack, which gave Volvo the critical mass to do the costly development into what became D16.
[2068]
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I could be wrong, but I thought the Volvo Penta / Deutz AG tie-up was more to do with engines for construction equipment.
Latestarter1
Well-Known Member
'18th July 1998
Germany's Deutz AG and Sweden's Volvo AB have signed a letter of intent to expand their cooperation with diesel engines. As part of the agreement, Volvo will acquire a 10% minority share in Deutz. The engine agreement runs both ways with Deutz becoming Volvo's main supplier of small and medium-sized diesels for construction equipment, trucks, buses, marine and industrial use. Volvo will concentrate its activities on heavier duty engines, believed to be from 8 to 16 liters, which it will also supply to Deutz to expand it's engine range.
The two companies further said they will jointly cooperate on medium-sized diesel engines. The contract is expected to be finalized this fall. Volvo's 10% share comes out of the Deutsche Bank's 38% stake in Deutz.'
Source: Diesel Progress
In 2012 Volvo became largest single shareholder in Deutz.
See no reason why Volvo people are shy about this Deutz build fine engines.
erik_plus8
Well-Known Member
Yes, this is absolutely true, but as FlowerPower pointed out, the cooperation between Volvo and Deutz concerns only construction/commercial engines in different sizes. The users of the engines are Volvo Construction Equipment (in various machines), Volvo Penta (for gensets and off-road applications). Also Buses and Trucks use them.
And when article above states "...marine engines..." it is meant the engines that are built as marine gensets - not marine propulsion engines. There are no Deutz base engines in the VP marine leisure engine lineup for propulsion.
Nothing secret about that and nothing to be shy about!
So - there is nothing from Deutz in the current D4/D6 marine engine range - trust me.
I cannot answer if and in that case why there were D4/D6 engines in the plant at some point in time, maybe test cell capacity was needed during development and the Deutz connection was used...? This would then have been very late -90s or early 00s?
Last edited:
Latestarter1
Well-Known Member
Yes, this is absolutely true, but as FlowerPower pointed out, the cooperation between Volvo and Deutz concerns only construction/commercial engines in different sizes. The users of the engines are Volvo Construction Equipment (in various machines), Volvo Penta (for gensets and off-road applications). Also Buses and Trucks use them.
And when article above states "...marine engines..." it is meant the engines that are built as marine gensets - not marine propulsion engines. There are no Deutz base engines in the VP marine leisure engine lineup for propulsion.
Nothing secret about that and nothing to be shy about!
So - there is nothing from Deutz in the current D4/D6 marine engine range - trust me.
I cannot answer if and in that case why there were D4/D6 engines in the plant at some point in time, maybe test cell capacity was needed during development and the Deutz connection was used...? This would then have been very late -90s or early 00s?
Erik,
This can run an run and this is my last comment, Volvo had no mid range engine design resource in late 90's, Certainly cylinder head incorporates Volvo corporate design standard with the copper injector sleeves which they will learn to regret at Tier III, however overall layout was pure Deutz.
Prototype blocks also had the Deutz logo cast into them.
Deutz people I met with were furious that their combustion chamber design was handed over to Volvo, and the piston supplier started peddling it to all and sundry. If you were involved in D6 design you will certainly not forget that row..........
erik_plus8
Well-Known Member
OK, we just have to agree to disagree and this will also be my last post on the subject, I do agree there's no point in going on and on. The story is just not what I've been told by people who should know. But sure, this is some time ago and people change positions so things might have happened in another way. And no, I wasn't involved in D6 design.
Just as info: D4/D6 range is Tier III compliant since a year back, if you meant it isn't.
Just as info: D4/D6 range is Tier III compliant since a year back, if you meant it isn't.
Latestarter1
Well-Known Member
Erik,
Just to clarify my comment D4/6 status, yes agreed all ratings currently Tier II (EPA Certified) not just compliant, all certified rating dockets have been filed with EPA and can be viewed under Freedom of Information.
D6 400 rating is Tier III hardware ready with less retarded Tier II software. My understanding is that this hardware will form basis of all future D4/6 Tier III ratings. Bacause of extra retard required to meet Tier III VP will obviously hold off releasing engines with Tier III hardware/software until mandated by legislation due to hit on fuel economy.
volvopaul
Well-Known Member
Thought I’d reply to this now and bump it up the ratings, a very interesting read .
Not sure 100% if it’s true but after covid the foundry that casts the Deutz blocks went bankrupt, Volvo had to rescue it to keep supply , I hear there’s still a long wait ( 2 years ) for new and short D4/6 blocks , of course I do stand to be corrected.
Not sure 100% if it’s true but after covid the foundry that casts the Deutz blocks went bankrupt, Volvo had to rescue it to keep supply , I hear there’s still a long wait ( 2 years ) for new and short D4/6 blocks , of course I do stand to be corrected.
Portofino
Well-Known Member
Are there a lot of people waiting for D4/6 blocks ? How common are rebuilds like this ?
It would worry me having boat engines that are not lined in the conventional method . Thinking of the lost time , cost of boating equation .