Just been quoted £2000 for engine fire extinguisher….sound about right?

DavidJ

DavidJ

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My 20 year old original FM 200 engine fire extinguisher has never been tested but still show green on the dial but I want to replace it.
The boat is a Sealine S37 and the replacement is like for like except the new friendly gas.
Does £2000 incl installation sound right?
it’s a
Sea Fire NFD-250M cilindro Novec manual/automático 7.1 m3 sala protección.
 
I have just been quoted to overhaul my FM200 - it entails removing from the boat, removing the gas, pressure testing the vessel, refill, new valve, control cable etc. Approx. 1500 euros (cylinder is 17kg) Chap said it was about half the cost of installing a brand new one, which he considered pointless.
 
DavidJ said:
My 20 year old original FM 200 engine fire extinguisher has never been tested but still show green on the dial but I want to replace it.
The boat is a Sealine S37 and the replacement is like for like except the new friendly gas.
Does £2000 incl installation sound right?
it’s a
Sea Fire NFD-250M cilindro Novec manual/automático 7.1 m3 sala protección.
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I paid €1400 to replace ours four years ago.
 
markc said:
I have just been quoted to overhaul my FM200 - it entails removing from the boat, removing the gas, pressure testing the vessel, refill, new valve, control cable etc. Approx. 1500 euros (cylinder is 17kg) Chap said it was about half the cost of installing a brand new one, which he considered pointless.
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That’s interesting because (I quote from the communication) they say they can’t test mine.

. In your case, as it is DOT regulations, we cannot do it here in Spain because it is American regulations and we only have valves with CE regulations.

Not sure what all the DOT stuff is. They are Sea-Fire agents so were 20 year old Sealine extinguishers American or something?. Sounds like a bunch of flannel, but who am I to question.
 
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DavidJ said:
That’s interesting because (I quote from the communication) they say they can’t test mine.

. In your case, as it is DOT regulations, we cannot do it here in Spain because it is American regulations and we only have valves with CE regulations.

Not sure what all the DOT stuff is. They are Sea-Fire agents so were 20 year old Sealine extinguishers American or something. sounds like a bunch of flannel but who am I.
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My experience in France is that us Brits are fair game when it comes to extinguishers. I went to 3 places that tried to pull my pants down until I spoke to someone recommended by fellow forumite @mcanderson and they are looking after me now. I suspect Spain may be the same.
 
markc said:
I have just been quoted to overhaul my FM200 - it entails removing from the boat, removing the gas, pressure testing the vessel, refill, new valve, control cable etc. Approx. 1500 euros (cylinder is 17kg) Chap said it was about half the cost of installing a brand new one, which he considered pointless.
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Who is that please, when i tried this they refused & said they couldn't do the pressure test & would only do a topup (that was Dante). Probably wanted to sell me a new one. Brought it home & Seafire in Portsmouth did it all for about £400 in 2017. Interestingly the pressure test was subbed out to Ocean Safety.
 
When in the SoF I went through a similar pantomime.Various quotes ( without looking at the boat ) circa €2K .
In the end I went with these bought the 6 Kg for 10 m2 real vol .I did some measurements + rudimentary calcs from on line sites .
The 4 kg was marginal .
https://www.fireblitz.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2021/06/FIREHAWK-FBA-G4-6-Data-Sheet-2021.pdf

Iirc under either £500 or £400 .Fitted it my self . 2019 .
Just passed an insurance survey FWIW .

But I have separate air intake vent shut offs , engine kill switches independent of the keys , fuel cock remote closers etc etc .
So only need the inert gas which this is .
 
Sheesh……I must be behind the times because my memories of fitting a FM200 extinguisher to replace the old Halon extinguisher was that it was hundereds as opposed to thousands and not too many at that! The prices mentioned here sound extortionate!
 
Greg2 said:
Sheesh……I must be behind the times because my memories of fitting a FM200 extinguisher to replace the old Halon extinguisher was that it was hundereds as opposed to thousands and not too many at that! The prices mentioned here sound extortionate!
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Two ways of pricing .
Trad = Tot up the cost of materials, floor space overheads , vehicle , plant + equipment, staff , pensions , H+L then add your margin etc .

Or the other way demand the price keep pushing it skywards and at the point folks stop paying ie demand drops , just drop it back to where the demand is .So in the SoF €2K is the going rate they can get away with for a single cylinder inert gas tank for a 12-15 M boat .

Despite brand new replacements sourced in uk for a few hundred quid as you say which come with a 5 yr guarantee.
 
I have recently been quoted over £700 for pressure test and re-fill of a Seafire extinguisher against just over £1,000 for a new one……….. there are cheaper extinguishers but they probably are disposable at the end of their quoted life span ?
 
DavidJ said:
Thanks Philip
My insurance company ( and probably others) wants the extinguisher to be operated from the helm as well. Does this rule the Fireblitz out
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Mine has a glass vial that shatters when 80C is reached triggering the thing. If your insurance is insistant it would be extremely easy to remotely trigger one by pulling some cable that shatters the vial manually. Is it elegant? You probably have to pull some cable to shut engine vents and so on the principal of KISS it doesnt get any more elegant AFAIC. I mean you could do it electronically with a solenoid I suppose but for 2000 notes?! Even 1400 notes?! Do you know much that would eat into my beer budget. Them boys above must be vegans
 
Presently HFC227EA (the base component of FM200) is one of the HFC class of fluorinated gases being phased down as part of the F Gas Directive issued in 2014.

But it is important to note that unlike Halon (and similarly R22 and R12 before it) HFC227EA is not being banned from active use, but with a F Gas GWP rating of 3220 it is banned from new applications. It remains perfectly legal to continue to use this in a working system.

The important thing to understand and check is that the cylinder weight has not reduced. With any amount of liquid product (can't use the word refrigerant in this context !) remains in the cylinder then the gauge pressure will sit in the green.

So if it is clean, and of the correct weight plus the gauge sits in the green simply log that these checks have been carried out by a competent person, and this should satisfy the Insurance company. Simply replacing this with an inordinately priced replacement is not as necessary as some would have you believe.

Indeed the fridge on my new to me boat is still working perfectly well, and indeed perfectly legally upon R12, and until is stops working I am not changing the thing.
 
Just out of interest a couple of tech / admin issues to get a tick in that box to satisfy officialdom ie your inc Co in the event of a fire claim .
You can get bet your bottom dollar that the extinguishers history- validity etc , the assessor will take a bee line to in the event of a huge potential fire payout .

Some one walk me through the logistics of getting a “ service “ .Presumably the engineer turns up with a temp replacement and fits that while yours is taken away ? ie the boats not left without a fully functioning ER extinguisher system ?

Secondly you have a file ( off the boat ) with the paperwork supporting said extinguishers maintenance, be it manufacturers timely services or replacement of out of date kit .

Thirdly where applicable in a older boat not in production theses day , a recent insurance survey……which obviously has a chapter on this stuff .

@ Superheat6K .
The weight thing is quite interesting I can see the logic .I thought they might empty it into a suitable receptor , capture the gas .
Then re pressure test the bottle , after a physical inspection internally .Looking for duff welds ,seams and poss any corrosion externally inc .Once deemed ok refill it replace the valve / wax bulb thing * and away you go = passed recertification etc .

They do that with dive bottles in the SoF , you have to have like a MOT pressure test thingy every two years after a certain age .

* I mean does that wax bulb degrade with time = gen Q ?

I know or understand with life rafts services they just unpack it replace the water + grub , weigh the bottle like you say and repack it’.
Mine expired a 8 P and it was gonna cost about the same as buying a newer albeit smaller 4 P .So I just replaced it with a newer rather then have it “serviced “

Same with the ER gas bottle replaced it with a brand newie Fireblitz in the link I gave ^^^
So @ 500 or what ever quid and a 5 y life between “services “ it’s £100 quid pa = small beer in moboat maintenance.
And the paper work to email over to the ins assessor which I know will be coming down the tracks in the event of a fire claim .

Just trying to work out what you get with a SoF €2 K “;service “:? Or Sp €1600 “service “
 
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