Jetrib on Fairline Phantom 46

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whiteh

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Just got the boat and want to put a jetrib on it for watersports
Looking to spend ~£5k on secondhand one
It had one in the past so there are some fittings on the deck for a cradle and a Fairline fitted Benzoni passarelle
Anyone got any tips please on ......
What to buy?
What/where to get a suitable cradle to fit my mounts?
What is the dry weight capacity of the pasarelle (and bathing platform)
How badly it might affect boat performance

Was thinking of a Williams 285 as its shorter and lighter than an Avon 320
 
£5k might get you only a 2 stoke perhaps tatty Avon, not a williams. you must look at the maker's plate under the passerelle to get the weight capacity; no-one on here can tell you the answer because there are different models of passerelle

The bathing platform will easily handle the weight of a jet rib

The chocks (that's what you mean by "cradle"?) need to be custom made. Eg get a local s/s firm to make the strip bases in 50x3 s/s strip, with c/sunk screw holes to attach the teak and s/s pegs/posts to locate in the deck sockets, then buy some 50x 180 x600 teak blocks (from eg kj howells) to cut the actual chocks and screw these onto the s/s strip bases
 
Thanks.
Perhaps have to stretch the budget!!
I'm surprised the chocks need custom making and arent available from a 3rd party or the manufacturer to suit the boat hull profile
 
Stock model benzenzoni is 150kg on p46, I fitted a 310 avon with 20hp 4 stroke console etc, it just lifts it, but once water entered the hull and the couple of gallons made the relief valve blow in the pump, so make sure your jetrib is under the builders rated weight.
 
whiteh said:
Just got the boat and want to put a jetrib on it for watersports
Looking to spend ~£5k on secondhand one
It had one in the past so there are some fittings on the deck for a cradle and a Fairline fitted Benzoni passarelle
Anyone got any tips please on ......
What to buy?
What/where to get a suitable cradle to fit my mounts?
What is the dry weight capacity of the pasarelle (and bathing platform)
How badly it might affect boat performance

Was thinking of a Williams 285 as its shorter and lighter than an Avon 320
Click to expand...

crazy 4557 had some blocks made for his rib on his phantom 46 - pm him I'm not sure where he got them.
 
whiteh said:
Thanks.
Perhaps have to stretch the budget!!
I'm surprised the chocks need custom making and arent available from a 3rd party or the manufacturer to suit the boat hull profile
Click to expand...

They're custom because differences in deck layout etc mean that different mother ships want the chocks at different fore-aft positions on the RIB's hull, hence different motherships need different V angles even for the SAME rib. Then there are different requirements on width of the chocks, height of the chocks...
 
volvopaul said:
Stock model benzenzoni is 150kg on p46, I fitted a 310 avon with 20hp 4 stroke console etc, it just lifts it, but once water entered the hull and the couple of gallons made the relief valve blow in the pump, so make sure your jetrib is under the builders rated weight.
Click to expand...

150kg wont lift a jetrib or jetski. Not even close. Need 300kg
 
volvopaul said:
Stock model benzenzoni is 150kg on p46, I fitted a 310 avon with 20hp 4 stroke console etc, it just lifts it, but once water entered the hull and the couple of gallons made the relief valve blow in the pump, so make sure your jetrib is under the builders rated weight.
Click to expand...

If thats the case, then even the smallest jetrib will be far too heavy for that pasarelle. For example the Williams 285 weighs 300kg+ when its got some fuel in it. If the OP is correct and the P46 had a jetrib on it in the past, then maybe it has an upgraded pasarelle but its imperative that he checks it's capacity
 
Monique said:
Stick to Williams... Avon jet ribs are not very reliable says my mate!
Click to expand...

Both use exactly the same engine and jet unit, namely the weber 2 cylinder 4 valve turbo engine. I had one - good luck to you if you choose to buy one. I got rid of it at 3.5 hours and I was the second owner of it

Except, older Avons from the era before Williams even existed used the now defunct Yamaha 2 stroke 83hp engine. If you are making a comparison between a 2 stroke Avon and a 4 stroke Williams you are not making any kind of fair comparison
 
I think if you do a search on this forum for JetRib you will find what we all feel about them.

Fantastic fun - if you can get the ?uggers to work.
IMO all makes are the same - inheritantly unreliable.

We had one of the old 2 stroke Avons - always tinkering with it.

If you get one, you will always have scratches on your knuckles - everything is too difficult to get at.

On the water, they are great when going fast - in fact fantastic when going fast - but hopeless when manouvering. Best technique is to crash into pontoons etc. There is a gear/drive lever which selects forwards and backwards and the more recent 4 strokes have a neutral position but IMO its quicker to switch the ?loody thing off as you land.

IMHO - get a good Rib - we chose a Walker Bay 340 with a 40 HP Yam but the Walker Bay 310 with (say) a 20HP outboard should be light enough.
You will also might get a new Walker Bay Rib in your budget as well.
 
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Yup Hurricane talks much sense (and experience). Just to show you what he's talking about, here is the WB Genesis 340 RIB with Yam 40 efi. Both Hurricane and I have had exactly this set up and found it works well. It is still 220 kg though, which is much lighter than a jet rib but you need to check your lift capacity and if you are limited by that try the smaller WB and 20hp motor

Metre for metre walker bay is the lightest nice RIB

LoResIMG_3646.jpg

IMG_2363.jpg
 
Thing is I'm planning to get a v. v. light 2nd dinghy (possibly not even bother with an engine for it) to actually get me short distances ashore and easily drag up a beach. What I want a jetrib for is skiing behind, towing water toys and (assuming its reliable enough) scooting to adjactent ports from where I'm staying. Am I aiming at a bad combination? Would one outboard RIB be a better plan even if still v. heavy to drag up a beach?
 
whiteh said:
Thing is I'm planning to get a v. v. light 2nd dinghy (possibly not even bother with an engine for it) to actually get me short distances ashore and easily drag up a beach. What I want a jetrib for is skiing behind, towing water toys and (assuming its reliable enough) scooting to adjactent ports from where I'm staying. Am I aiming at a bad combination? Would one outboard RIB be a better plan even if still v. heavy to drag up a beach?
Click to expand...

Depends on how many people you've got to drag your tender up the beach. I know my SWMBO and I struggled with a 3.10m Novurania RIB and 15hp o/b on our own and you're going to need a lot more than 15hp to drag a skier. I think your idea to have a deflated lightweight inflatable just for beach trips is a good idea although I'd be tempted to get a 2hp o/b as well as rowing against a tide is no fun whatsoever
 
whiteh said:
Thing is I'm planning to get a v. v. light 2nd dinghy (possibly not even bother with an engine for it) to actually get me short distances ashore and easily drag up a beach. What I want a jetrib for is skiing behind, towing water toys and (assuming its reliable enough) scooting to adjactent ports from where I'm staying. Am I aiming at a bad combination? Would one outboard RIB be a better plan even if still v. heavy to drag up a beach?
Click to expand...

Your thoughts are probably correct.
IMO, there just isnt a complete solution.
We all want what you are asking for.
Anything that you can ski behind is going to be too heavy to drag up the beach or lift onto your bathing platform.
Likewise, anything light enough to drag up a beach isnt going to be any use water skiing.

However, with a JetRib you HAVE to consider the reliability as well.
They are always going wrong and very difficult to fix.
Another point - they also have the reputation for being "the Hoover of the sea" - sucking up anything and everything in their path - thus knackering the impeller etc.
We also broke the little water inlet grilles on the bottom when we left ours tied to a quay in the Isles of Scilly. As the tide went out, the Jet Rib settled on a stony bottom which broke the water inlet grilles. It wasnt long before large stones got sucked up into the jet.

For us the Walker Bay with a big outboard forms a really good compramise.
In the Med the tide is so slight you can forget about it so you only have to drag the boat a short way up the beach for it to be safe - and when you get back to it the distance to the water hasnt changed much.
The Walker Bay is just about dragable.
Until recently, our Walker Bay / 40 Hp wouldnt pull me (a fat git) out of the water onto water skis but last week, I changed the prop to a shorter pitch (with advice from guys on this forum).
And it made a big difference - fat gits can now ski behind our WB.

In summary, the Walker Bay / ourboadr combination is a good "Jack of All Trades"

I definately wouldnt go back to a Jet Rib..................But - Hey - Jet Ribs are fun!!!
 
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The reliability is a major issue for me for sure, especially if I go to adjacent ports in it.....paddling back 2+ miles ain't an option!!
What exactly goes wrong with the engine unit?
Are they hard to start or do they just conk out?
Do the ~4yr old 2 stroke Avons and Williams all use the exact same power unit?
I am surprised to hear that they are all bad and chronically unreliable, especially if regularly used and serviced. I've used jetski's a fair amount with similar type power units and never had a problem once (not wanting to tempt fate!!). Also being from premium brands I can't imagine they both made something inherently flawed and still continue producing, albeit with different power units.
Would I be better off in terms of reliability paying up and getting a 4 stroke 285 and if so any idea when these came out?
Im never gonna beach it (at least not intentionally!!), so jet damage isnt a major worry to me.
If I go the outboard boat route, is there anything that is going to sit somewhere in the middle of a 2.85m, up to 100hp, jetrib on the one hand and a 3.1m normal rib that seems to take max 20hp o/b or so? That is a big gap performance wise and going to stop me skiing.
3.4m and 40hp is gonna be too big for a 46 platform. I was already leaning toward the Wiliams over the Avon just to save a few inches and allow the crew to step on and off without having to hurdle the dinghy!!
 
whiteh said:
Thing is I'm planning to get a v. v. light 2nd dinghy (possibly not even bother with an engine for it) to actually get me short distances ashore and easily drag up a beach. What I want a jetrib for is skiing behind, towing water toys and (assuming its reliable enough) scooting to adjactent ports from where I'm staying. Am I aiming at a bad combination? Would one outboard RIB be a better plan even if still v. heavy to drag up a beach?
Click to expand...

I did exactly this, also on the back of a 46 footer. I had a 2 stroke avon jet rib on the chocks, and a round tail tender stored deflated on board. At the start of each trip I blew up the round tail, and stored it upside down on top of the jet rib held by the passarelle and a webbing strap. I launched and retrieved it easily by hand, as it only weighed about 15 kgs. I also kept a 2hp outboard on board, but usually just rowed it for short distances. This arrangement didn't look pretty, but it worked.

However, after a (short) while, like most other jet rib owners I got sick of the noise, smoke and unreliability, and the myriad of other well reported problems with jet ribs, and also with the hassle and appearance of the round tail stored on top, so I chopped them both in and bought a 3.1m RIB and stuck an oversize outboard on it. This had enough power for skiing and wakeboarding, but could be dragged up the beach with two of us. I'd say this was a better compromise for us than having two tenders, but that doesn't mean it will be for you.

If you go the conventional RIB route, look at the J Craft 2.9m. I've mentioned this several times on here, but only because it seems on paper to be the most viable alternative to a jet rib. I've no idea on build quality etc, so i'm flagging it, rather than reccomending it.

As regards outboards, weight for weight, and even power for power, 2 strokes are better for watersports than 4 strokes, so if I was buying this type of RIB, i'd look for a barely used 30hp 2 stroke, the lightest of which only weigh 50kgs (Mercury/Mariner/Tohatsu from memory)
 
whiteh said:
The reliability is a major issue for me for sure, especially if I go to adjacent ports in it.....paddling back 2+ miles ain't an option!!
What exactly goes wrong with the engine unit?
Are they hard to start or do they just conk out?
Do the ~4yr old 2 stroke Avons and Williams all use the exact same power unit?
I am surprised to hear that they are all bad and chronically unreliable, especially if regularly used and serviced. I've used jetski's a fair amount with similar type power units and never had a problem once (not wanting to tempt fate!!). Also being from premium brands I can't imagine they both made something inherently flawed and still continue producing, albeit with different power units.
Would I be better off in terms of reliability paying up and getting a 4 stroke 285 and if so any idea when these came out?
Im never gonna beach it (at least not intentionally!!), so jet damage isnt a major worry to me.
If I go the outboard boat route, is there anything that is going to sit somewhere in the middle of a 2.85m, up to 100hp, jetrib on the one hand and a 3.1m normal rib that seems to take max 20hp o/b or so? That is a big gap performance wise and going to stop me skiing.
3.4m and 40hp is gonna be too big for a 46 platform. I was already leaning toward the Wiliams over the Avon just to save a few inches and allow the crew to step on and off without having to hurdle the dinghy!!
Click to expand...

Reliability - Gosh - Where do we start.

I only speak for the Avon 2 stroke - cant remember the model no - the one with the handle bars.
It's fundimentally a Yamahar Waverunner built into a Rib by Avon
The steering can be troublesome - cable driven so stiff if you dont look after it.
Virtually all the Avon 2 stroke's have a problem with the shift lever - this operates a "bucket" which "swings" over the jet to force the water forwards - thus making the Rib go backwards - this shift lever gets stuck (usually in reverse) - mine would sometimes free if I waggled the steering a bit but most people find it freed when you stopped the engine.
Starting is a pig - I fitted a priming bulb which helped a lot.
Battery needs to be good or it just wont start
Mine (and I believe its an inherrant fault) had a problem with the oil feed - this type of 2 stroke engine has a separate oil tank which mixes the oil and fuel before its fed to the carb. I believe that this oil feed can easily block thus starving the engine of oil - thats what happened to mine - previous owner didnt notice so ruined the cylinders. This problem manifests itself as - engine starts and runs but cuts out after a few minutes. Mine required reboring to fix the problem.
I'm sure there were other problems - but thats just for starters.
The day we came to sell the Rib, the blower failed and I had to fit a new one.

But the most important thing is that all the kit is too tightly fitted so everything you do you end up scraping your knuckles.

Shame, because as I say - its a fantastic thing to drive and play with - when it works.

As I say above, even my solution in the Walker Bay isn't perfect. To get a light boat, the WB is made of ABS plastic and so is very flimsy. I've often tried to race a Jet Rib - and there's no comparason - the Jet Rib wins every time. The key thing though is that my WB starts every time - at our marina we even use the WB to "jump start" the Jet Ribs!!!

I've just done an oil service on my WB - and it was a doddle.

Sorry - it isnt an easy choice - nothing is perfect.
 
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