Jackstay Replacement - Webbing or Wire?

Goldie

Goldie

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My jackstays are ready for replacement but should I go for wire or webbing?

My thoughts are that webbing is more prone to UV degradation (especially the stitching) which is probably my main concern, but is also prone to flapping in a breeze and keeping me awake (previous experience). Wire (which will be uncoated) will last longer although more expensive initially, but will roll under foot and is probably less kind to a teak deck.

Any other thoughts on the pros and cons please?

Thank you.
 
My webbing is tight and doesn't flap. I have SS rings on which to clip and that means they slide along easily. Take them off in the winter when I don't do much and they have lasted for six years so far. Stitching looks fine.
I have experienced wire on other boats and the rolling under foot is very disconcerting.
 
I would use wire as it is far less likely to suffer degradation in the normal wear and tear of a yacht. I know folks say it rolls underfoot but I have never found that even at extreme angles of heal. I have deliberately stood on my wire to try and roll off but some part of my boot was always in touch with the deck and gripping as normal.
 
From what I understand of the limited published test info, no-one can reliably predict the RESIDUAL strength in webbing and its stitching, after it has been exposed to a season's UV, salt crystals, dirt and being trodden on. What is clear is that it degrades.

Is it 50% of new spec? More? Less....? For most, it is simply wishful thinking that it will still prove adequate in event of it having to do the job it was installed for.

Then, how many here don't replace their webbing with new after each season....? Probably just about everyone?

So, how long do you leave it before you're shamed into fitting new? 4 years....5 years..... longer?
 
We use webbing but acknowledge the issue Zoidberg mentions. We only instal our webbing for offshore passages and take the jackstays off and store otherwise (most people fit and forget).

Jackstays are easy to fit, so taking them off when they are unnecessary seems sensible. We don't leave our harnesses nor tethers out in the sun, they come out when we are offshore. We don't leave our storm jib sheets out nor our spinnaker sheets unless we will need them - so why leave the jackstays out.

But - it depends where and how you sail.

If we were doing a circumnavigation - we would need to have scheduled retirement, of both tethers and jackstays.

The stitching of the end loops can be made in dyneema, which is more UV resistant.

We do not suffer from the webbing flapping - but it is installed taut and with a twist.

I find wire disconcerting - but if I did not need to stand on it (so if it was down the edge of the cabin roof, somewhere no-one would stand) - I would use wire - but still use webbing where it will be underfoot.

Jonathan
 
MoodySabre said:
My webbing is tight and doesn't flap. I have SS rings on which to clip and that means they slide along easily. Take them off in the winter when I don't do much and they have lasted for six years so far. Stitching looks fine.
I have experienced wire on other boats and the rolling under foot is very disconcerting.
Click to expand...

Polyester webbing will lose about 35% strength the first year and less in the following years. After 6 years it is probably about 1/3 strength. So no, it is not fine, no matter what the stitching looks like. With full-time exposure, 1-years is the practical limit for polyester jackstays. Rope does better because it is thicker.

The only way fiber jacklines hold up is if they are at least 2x strength to start with.

BTW, the nylon tether is damaged about twice as fast by UV, but fortunately, they do not see as much sun.
 
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Interesting stuff. Both has their strengths.
The jackstays I make in the sailloft are with 2,5tonne webbing and with uv covers over the stitching so they are protected but I do tell customer's to bring them back each season for a check over. Chafe is one of my biggest concerns.

Wire is more boom proof but it does have it's issues under foot depending on your boat
 
Steve The Seagull said:
Interesting stuff. Both has their strengths.
The jackstays I make in the sailloft are with 2,5tonne webbing and with uv covers over the stitching so they are protected but I do tell customer's to bring them back each season for a check over. Chafe is one of my biggest concerns.

Wire is more boom proof but it does have it's issues under foot depending on your boat
Click to expand...

Just out of interest

How many bring them back for a check?

Jonathan
 
Why not use dyneema?

Stronger than wire, less sensitive to UV damage than webbing and stitching, good resistance to abrasion, easily to splice, doesn't damage teak decks.

D12 SK78 6mm breaking strain 4750kg, say 50% for eye splice, so around 2.4 tons.

6mm SS wire, breaking strain 2235kg, with TCUKH copper ferrule splice 1.7 tons (assuming 80%)
 
Personally, have always preferred webbing. I really don't like that sprained ankle feeling from wires and line.

Never had a problem with it in a long time of living in places where the uv is somewhat higher than uk!
 
So far then, I think that’s a 50:50 split and one vote for Dyneema (hadn’t thought of that but will now, thanks). Still a few days before I make the call. Thanks for all the responses to date.

Goldie
 
I am always surprised someone hasnt come up with a better solution. The ideal solution seems to me webbing with a dynema or wire core in the middle. It would combined the best benfits of both systems. I suppose I should get out the Sailrite and sew two pieces of webbing together with a wire core stitching along the wire both sides in the middle and then again the outsides.
 
I found some tubular(as opposed to tape) webbing and fed wire jackstays through that, no rolling underfoot and reliable strength from the S/S wire, the webbing was cheap and had little strength itself nor UV restiance. I bought it from West Marine USA in a 'sale' bucket, no idea if still available or where.
 
We used to take satisfaction from the sound of thoughtless rafters coming back late in the evening and doing their best to injure themselves on our wire jackstays. I imagine that wire would cause damage to my current teak deck but might consider it if I changed to inboard lines.
 
Robin said:
I found some tubular(as opposed to tape) webbing and fed wire jackstays through that, no rolling underfoot and reliable strength from the S/S wire, the webbing was cheap and had little strength itself nor UV restiance. I bought it from West Marine USA in a 'sale' bucket, no idea if still available or where.
Click to expand...

Now that is a really good idea. 25 or 26mm tubular webbing is readily available from a lot of suppliers and is quite cheap. This example made in polyester is available in black or white, the former being stiffer and a bit more expensive. https://www.profabrics.co.uk/products/tubular-webbing-25mm?variant=5940866755
I suggest tying the webbing to the eyes at each end of the jackstays with a sewn on cord to keep it taut but allow removal so that the wire could be inspected. The onle issue is whether the eyes on your wire jackstays are small enough to pass through.
 
ip485 said:
I am always surprised someone hasnt come up with a better solution. The ideal solution seems to me webbing with a dynema or wire core in the middle. It would combined the best benfits of both systems. I suppose I should get out the Sailrite and sew two pieces of webbing together with a wire core stitching along the wire both sides in the middle and then again the outsides.
Click to expand...

APS in Annapolis MD has made them that way (Dyneema core) for at least a decade. Very nice and not a difficult DIY job. Go over strength with the Dyneema and they will last a good long time.

BTW, no strength is lost in an eye splice. In fact, many rope vendors report strength based on pull testing dogbones with 2 eyes. Loss in strength around the bend? Not actually, since that portion of line is carrying only 50% of the tension (two legs).
 
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