I've got the flags

[BlueChip]

I\'ve got the flags

For many years I have been carrying around on board a set of signalling flags that have never seen the light of day. Seems like next week at the Fleet Review might be the ideal opportunity to give them an airing.
My question is - can I put them up in the marina and then motor along with them up (I don't imagine that there will be much chance of sailing on Tuesday) or can I only hoist them when we are anchored?

If I get it wrong will I be in trouble with the harbour patrol?

 

[landaftaf]

Re: I\'ve got the flags

as no one else seems to wanna take the plunge.........

the r. n. have their protocols about dessing ship, and the m.n. have a sort of a protocol, but I am not aware of any for boats.
IMHO it is perfectly acceptable to steam dressed overall on any sort of small boat at any time - on the assumption it doesnt effect safe navigation (and doesnt spell out anything objectionable in any language)
it seems to me to be especially appropriate on a day of official celebration - as traf 200 is ......
it is certainly done by boats when in a procession for many varied occasions (and I imagine there would be an impromptu procession on the day, or it will surely seem to be with all the yachts/mobos exiting pompey on the day)

on the official note, m.n. ships usually dress overall when alongside on special occasions, and when underway on their christening day, and entering/leaving port on their maiden and final voyage.
for practical reasons (like radars, guys and other rigging getting fouled, and problems with anticipated increased apparent wind,) the flags are normally taken down before getting underway - but there is nothing written down dictating this should be so, indeed many dont.
I wont go into navy regs - some are on google ......... but they are not relevant here

so - in answer I would feel comfortable proceeding to the anchorage dressed overall and bollox to anyone who has the temerity to grump about it

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[VicS]

Re: I\'ve got the flags

You are aware of course that there is a "correct" sequence for the flags. You'll find it in the RYA booklet on Flag Etiquette and also in the last edition of PBO. Designed to avoid spelling out any thing unintended. You wouldn't what Kim to come zooming along on one of the patrol boats and rearrange them to spell "Oh really" or "no thanks" would you.

 

[landaftaf]

Re: I\'ve got the flags

I think you will find several suggestions for flag arrangements on the web ...... maybe even here /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

 

[nonchalant]

Re: I\'ve got the flags

The (RN) guidance to boats participating in the IFR states: "It is appropriate to dress overall whilst at anchor or alongside between 0800 and sunset/2100 (whichever comes first). However, when underway, dressing lines must be lowered."

 

[landaftaf]

Re: I\'ve got the flags

well there we are then ........ simple

tnx

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[Talbot]

Full Dress Ship Explanation

For your info
(Text taken from Macmillan Reeds – Yachtsman’s Handbook for sail and power,
DRESSING SHIP

Ships can be dressed in two ways: overall -the more usual, only in harbour; or with masthead flags - normally only when under way in or near a harbour, but may be used as an alternative to dressing overall in vessels not fitted with dressing lines. Dressing lines are the dedicated lines on which the flags are hoisted; normally a yacht will use her halyards in harbour.

Dressing overall is done by flying the flags of the International Code (only) from stem to masthead, from masthead to masthead if there is more than one mast, and down to the stern. The triangular flags and pendants should be spaced out between the rectangular flags. The recommended order of flags, from forward, is:
E, Q, p3, G, p8, Z, p4, W, p6, P, p1, 1Code, T, Y ,B, X, 1st Sub, H, 3rd Sub, D, F, 2nd Sub, U, A, O, M, R, p2, J, p0, N, p9, K, p7, V, p5, L, C, S.
Note: p0 to p9 are the numeral pendants. The size of flags should be appropriate to the size of the yacht.

The Ensign should be worn at its normal position, and there should be a flag (normally another similar Ensign) at each masthead.

For British national festivals (see below) a British Ensign is worn at each masthead, and at the main masthead the Ensign and club burgee fly side by side. But if the owner is a flag officer he flies his flag at the masthead without an Ensign.

The principal occasions for dressing ship in this country are currently: Accession Day (6 Feb), Commonwealth Day (March), HM The Queen's Birthday (21 April), Coronation Day (2 June), HM The Queen's Official Birthday (June), HRH The Duke of Edinburgh's Birthday (10 June) and HM The Queen Mother's Birthday (4 August).

For foreign national festivals (at home or abroad), the Ensign of the country concerned is flown at the masthead alongside the burgee in single-masted yachts, at the mizzen masthead (in place of a British Ensign) in ketches and yawls, and at the fore masthead (in place of a British Ensign) in a schooner-rigged yacht. In the case of a flag officer, flying his flag (alone) at the masthead of a single-masthead yacht, the foreign Ensign should be flown at the starboard spreader.

When dressing ship for a local occasion (eg a regatta) the club burgee should be flown at the main masthead, and no Ensign. An Ensign should be worn at any other masthead. On all occasions of dressing ship it is important that the same design of Ensign is worn in different parts of the vessel.

Dressing with masthead flags is carried out by wearing Ensign(s) at the masthead(s), as described above, without dressing lines.

 

[landaftaf]

Re: Full Dress Ship Explanation

as on many posts there are often many answers - to my mind we are influenced very strongly by the copious yank input on the web about this subject ........ in fact our r.n. doesnt read from the same hymn book on this matter

please see an extract I think is more relevant to yachts and small boats ....... if you want I could probably find the r.n. way of doing it but to my knowledge most if not all the boats we are discussing wont hold a commission from the lords of the admiralty so it doesnt apply.

the final para is the most important part refering to excercising a choice and protocols for small boats .....

http://www.pya.org/dressing_ship.htm

however it seems the qhm(pompey) has apparenty declared his wishes so this is obviously the official stance .... though his influence doesnt stretch out over the whole of the solent

I maintain there is nothing preventing a boat from steaming dressed overall ....... and that would be my preference had I a boat attending this fleet review as an observer.

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[AuntyRinum]

Re: Full Dress Ship Explanation

With respect, there is an error in this.

Should read:

E, Q, p3, G, p8, Z, p4, W, p6, P, p1, I, Code, T, Y ,B, X, 1st Sub, H, 3rd Sub, D, F, 2nd Sub, U, A, O, M, R, p2, J, p0, N, p9, K, p7, V, p5, L, C, S.

Not:

E, Q, p3, G, p8, Z, p4, W, p6, P, p1, 1Code, T, Y ,B, X, 1st Sub, H, 3rd Sub, D, F, 2nd Sub, U, A, O, M, R, p2, J, p0, N, p9, K, p7, V, p5, L, C, S.

Spot the difference.

 

[Talbot]

Re: Full Dress Ship Explanation

If I have mislead anyone, sorry, I was just passing on something from somebody else.

 

[BlueChip]

Re: I\'ve got the flags

It's all too complicated
I don't think I will bother flying anything - it will probably rain anyway

 

[nonchalant]

Re: Full Dress Ship Explanation

Yes, I suspect the QHM guidance is because he's worried about lots of amateurs, comme moi, doing an imperfect job, with dressing lines dropping over the side, round props, and leading to a breaking of the ranks in front of HMQ....