longjohnsilver
Well-known member
What DEFRA says and thinks is not necessarily the law as it stands.
It's official we can now go sailing again!
- Thread starter Seven Spades
- Start date
Yealm
Well-known member
The Yealm Harbour Authority don’t say anything about not sleeping on your boat.
But if the RYA specifically ban it, we’re a bit snookered?
But if the RYA specifically ban it, we’re a bit snookered?
Seven Spades
Well-known member
The Defra Q&A link does not link to a government website but links to a spam sending site mailchimp
longjohnsilver
Well-known member
No, when have the RYA enjoyed legislative powers?
Yealm
Well-known member
I don’t think that’s the point..
If the premier boating organization interprets guidelines one way, then the judge could argue we should too !
Though I'm sure blind eyes will be turned
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DJE
Well-known member
New notice from QHM. LNTM NO 32/20 includes, "4. Government guidance continues to enforce that no-one is permitted to leave their home to stay at a second home overnight or for long periods of time. This includes remaining on your vessel for an overnight stay both alongside a berth or at anchor."
So if you want to anchor overnight go to Beaulieu or Chichester. But quick before they follow suit.
Edit:
So not only is he seeking to enforce "guidance" but he is deciding what it includes too.
So if you want to anchor overnight go to Beaulieu or Chichester. But quick before they follow suit.
Edit:
So not only is he seeking to enforce "guidance" but he is deciding what it includes too.
BabySharkDooDooDooDooDoo
Well-known member
Chi have already prohibited overnight use of their facilities and Beaulieu is still closed to all visiting craft.
However we are still left with the reliance on guidance rather than the regulations. However it is abundantly clear nobody want us to stay on board.
However we are still left with the reliance on guidance rather than the regulations. However it is abundantly clear nobody want us to stay on board.
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DJE
Well-known member
Was thinking of antifouling this weekend. Not so sure its worth it now.
BabySharkDooDooDooDooDoo
Well-known member
Unless you were thinking of not launching at all this year then I think it best to it do while the sun is shining.
Blue Sunray
Well-known member
Equally Southampton Council could issue guidance that brown shoes are not to be worn with a blue suit in the High Street, a wholly laudable aim as I'm sure all right thinking people will agree (and one with which any decent chap will comply) but no force in law.
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Iain C
Active member
It was specifically called out at the government briefing last night that the only place anyone can stay overnight is their primary residence. So as I live 160 miles from my boat that puts the kybosh on that one, and scuppers my plans (and any point) in antifouling.
We all must do our bit against the virus, and I have been complying with all the rules so far, but this current situation is poorly thought out and makes absoluetly zero sense at all. Here are some reasons why...and to be clear I have nothing against powerboating in some of these examples, I'm just calling out the stupidity of the rules...
-The government wants this to be the part of a "green" transport revolution, however it's fine with me to drive unlimited miles to the coast and go powerboating in a thousand horsepower RIB
-It has published new rules on "exercise and recreation", and again powerboating is allowed. Presumably car track days will follow?
-The government would rather I drive 160 miles back and forth to my boat, releasing CO2 into the air, putting myself at risk of an RTA, touching diesel pumps, using public lavatories on the way, coming into contact with forecourt staff and other members of the public, rather than simply lying down on the berth I'm already sat on and closing my eyes...on a boat I sharing with my partner and no-one else
-It would rather I got in my dinghy, solo, and motor across Portsmouth Harbour in the dark from my mooring, rather than simply staying put on my boat in about as perfect a self-isolation situation as you could have
-The rules allow me to singlehand my yacht, with no actual constraints over hours or distance sailed, with all the associated risks and potential rescue requirements that brings, but again I cannot just lie down on my bunk on my mooring or on a club pontoon and sleep
-The rules effectively say that I must drive home, regardless of how tired I am
Totally ridiculous...we've been moved towards more of a "common sense" approach rather than a blanket "stay at home" approach...yet when it comes down to it, it turns out we are not allowed to use common sense at all. A boat is NOT a home, I've never raced a house, a tent or our camper van as far as I can remember! The rules should be very simple. Either...
a) You may visit your boat to check it or perform simple essential maintenance such as pumping the bilge or starting the engine. Absolutely no boat movements are allowed. Boats can only be visited between 0700 and 1900 (or similar depending on daylight hours)
b) You may use your boat considerately and carefully with members of your household and practise social distancing with other people. Observe and obey local marinas' and ports' specific berthing and visiting arrangements during this time.
Simple as that...I am seriously thinking of dropping the RYA a line about this, as the current situation is an absolute joke.
We all must do our bit against the virus, and I have been complying with all the rules so far, but this current situation is poorly thought out and makes absoluetly zero sense at all. Here are some reasons why...and to be clear I have nothing against powerboating in some of these examples, I'm just calling out the stupidity of the rules...
-The government wants this to be the part of a "green" transport revolution, however it's fine with me to drive unlimited miles to the coast and go powerboating in a thousand horsepower RIB
-It has published new rules on "exercise and recreation", and again powerboating is allowed. Presumably car track days will follow?
-The government would rather I drive 160 miles back and forth to my boat, releasing CO2 into the air, putting myself at risk of an RTA, touching diesel pumps, using public lavatories on the way, coming into contact with forecourt staff and other members of the public, rather than simply lying down on the berth I'm already sat on and closing my eyes...on a boat I sharing with my partner and no-one else
-It would rather I got in my dinghy, solo, and motor across Portsmouth Harbour in the dark from my mooring, rather than simply staying put on my boat in about as perfect a self-isolation situation as you could have
-The rules allow me to singlehand my yacht, with no actual constraints over hours or distance sailed, with all the associated risks and potential rescue requirements that brings, but again I cannot just lie down on my bunk on my mooring or on a club pontoon and sleep
-The rules effectively say that I must drive home, regardless of how tired I am
Totally ridiculous...we've been moved towards more of a "common sense" approach rather than a blanket "stay at home" approach...yet when it comes down to it, it turns out we are not allowed to use common sense at all. A boat is NOT a home, I've never raced a house, a tent or our camper van as far as I can remember! The rules should be very simple. Either...
a) You may visit your boat to check it or perform simple essential maintenance such as pumping the bilge or starting the engine. Absolutely no boat movements are allowed. Boats can only be visited between 0700 and 1900 (or similar depending on daylight hours)
b) You may use your boat considerately and carefully with members of your household and practise social distancing with other people. Observe and obey local marinas' and ports' specific berthing and visiting arrangements during this time.
Simple as that...I am seriously thinking of dropping the RYA a line about this, as the current situation is an absolute joke.
matt1
Well-known member
Like you I'm willing to follow the guidance and rules and am not looking to "stretch" them, as plenty of others are. I strongly believe in a collective to beat the virus but agree there isn't a logic. Arguably tucked up for the night at anchor is significantly less risk than being at home where I may be tempted to nip out to Tesco in the evening if I have run out of wine. But I think the issue here is optics and frankly restricting movement (even though they haven't done so with cars). I suspect what they are really trying to avoid, and why the authorities are digging their heels in on this one, is people going to the W Country and holiday homes and the potential that has to spread the virus. I think the Govt know there will be a second peak and their mitigation of such will be impose regional lockdowns as required, rather than the draconian whole country lockdown we have seen. (London R=0.4 currently, S Hampshire 0.71 - for instance). If that is the case they will want to restrict people spending significant time in other regions of the UK from where they live. I suspect they are also trying to avoid civil unrest. Plenty of potential of that as townies head to Devon, Cornwall, Wales etc If I'm right then boats sailing good distances from their home ports would be in the same category. Of course, it may be helpful if they explained why as that may encourage people to be more accepting of the rules rather than becoming "rulesmiths" and pointing out all the inconsistencies!
BabySharkDooDooDooDooDoo
Well-known member
The current situation is infinitely preferable to your option (a) so I have no idea why anybody on a boating forum would offer that up.
It looks like the other half's club lift in day will be delayed again because of concerns about social distancing and that many of the members would be classed as 'vulnerable' but had it gone ahead we would have had a 180 mile trip each way to attend with a fair bit of that being single carriageway roads.
bdh198
Active member
To be honest, even if the police/harbour authority did, 1. notice you sitting quietly at anchor and 2. could be bothered to come over and tell you off, then even if they did deem you to have breached the Regulations they still need to issue the fine/charges/requisition lawfully. Which, judging by the latest review by the CPS is not looking likely...
CPS announces review findings for first 200 cases under coronavirus laws | The Crown Prosecution Service
Unbelievable.... every single case charged under the Coronavirus Act in March and April was either withdrawn at court at the first appearance, or was later returned to court for the conviction to be set aside. Offences under the Coronavirus Regulations, although with a slightly safe conviction rate, still leave a good chance of the police screwing it up!
CPS announces review findings for first 200 cases under coronavirus laws | The Crown Prosecution Service
Unbelievable.... every single case charged under the Coronavirus Act in March and April was either withdrawn at court at the first appearance, or was later returned to court for the conviction to be set aside. Offences under the Coronavirus Regulations, although with a slightly safe conviction rate, still leave a good chance of the police screwing it up!
JumbleDuck
Well-known member
Blurbleblurbleblurbleblurble oops. Misreading on my part.
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bdh198
Active member
According to your own source, 7 cases out of 187 were dropped in court and 5 set aside later, leaving 175 which the CPS deemed correctly charged. Where did you get "every single case" from?
A good place to start would be reading my post correctly and then the CPS statement in full!
My post... “every single case charged under the Coronavirus Act in March and April was either withdrawn at court at the first appearance, or was later returned to court for the conviction to be set aside“.
Here’s what the CPS say...
And you don’t need to just take my word for it:
All prosecutions under new Coronavirus Act unlawful, review finds
Coronavirus: Every person prosecuted under Coronavirus Act was wrongly charged
Every person prosecuted under Coronavirus Act was 'wrongly charged', CPS admits
JumbleDuck
Well-known member
My bad. You are quite right, of course. Sorry.
Babylon
Well-known member
As I went to bed last night I found myself reflecting on the whole situation.
I want to spend a few days sailing my plastic boat including sleeping aboard at night, but am feeling strongly dissuaded from doing so.
Nature one - Me nil
- A disease is killing a proportion of old people, sick people and unhealthy people. (Really?!?)
- Inland and inshore waters around the world are suddenly much cleaner and clearer.
- Terrestrial and avian animals and insects are enjoying a break from their usual chronic man-made stresses.
- Plant-based life is similarly benefitting from lower levels of airborne pollution etc.
- The primary contributor to the accelerated climate change of recent decades (a far more destructive threat to all life) is temporarily very slightly eased.
Nature one - Me nil
greeny
Well-known member
I'll bet you have interesting dreams after those thoughts.
I'm not feeling dissuaded at all.
I agree with your summation of the state of life around the planet but me sailing my boat will make zilch difference to any of that.
Babylon
Well-known member
Fortunately, after those thoughts but before actual sleep, I have my current bedside book to continue reading... about a shepherd in the Lake District: book
Not banging a drum about the environment, just can do without the stress of being ticked off or turned away for sleeping aboard - whether or not its technically 'legal' or whatever.
Also, I've got a separate hobby which I do entirely from home and which has kept me absorbed and active throughout the crisis - which I'll just carry on with for the time being! ?
Not banging a drum about the environment, just can do without the stress of being ticked off or turned away for sleeping aboard - whether or not its technically 'legal' or whatever.
Also, I've got a separate hobby which I do entirely from home and which has kept me absorbed and active throughout the crisis - which I'll just carry on with for the time being! ?