Italy for next winter 2020

[Truro Ex Pat]

I am looking to relocate from S of F to Italy next winter and was wondering if anyone has any suggestions? I started looking at airports 1st and prefer bigger Cities or Towns but then thought someone might have done same in the past.
Prefer also to be at least a coupe of hundred miles south to see some different parts of Italy before winterising.

 

[MapisM]

Moving 200Nm South from SoF goes a long way.
It means reaching either N of Sardinia or Rome area, along mainland IT.

And even if I love Sardinia enough to call it home by now, if you never explored the Ligurian and N Thyrrenian sea, in your boots I'd rather head there first.
In fact, not only it's along the route (sort of) before going further S, but some spots are well worth seeing also in that area.
Which is pretty large, btw: anywhere from Loano, where Portofino of this parish recently moved, to the Eastern side of Liguria (Portofino, Cinque Terre).
And then south along the coast, towards Elba and the rest of the Tuscan Islands.
The list is long, and it's difficult to go wrong, anywhere.

Anyhow, should you decide do point directly towards Sardinia, just ask for any further details!

 

[Deleted User YDKXO]

This is going to sound like I'm slagging off Italy which I'm not meaning to because I really like the country. The problem is that the west coastline of Italy isnt that interesting in boating terms until you get to near Naples. La Spezia is quite interesting in terms of being within easy cruising distance of the Cinque Terre and Portofino but then its about 1hr from Pisa airport. South of La Spezia its quite straight and boring until you get to near Santo Stefano where there are various islands including Elba within cruising range. The problem there is that there are no international airports in the vicinity. And then its on to the Amalfi coast and Naples before it gets interesting again. There's always Sardinia. There are various marinas on the Costa Smerelda near Olbia airport and in the south there are 3 or 4 marinas within easy distance of Cagliari airport

 

[DavidJ]

We wintered our boat in Ostia (Rome) a few years back. Very close to the airport (although the taxis take you the long way) and then there was a large very interesting livaboard winter community. Great Pompeii type Roman settlement in Ostia and cheap transportation to Rome to do the sights at your leisure.
We didn’t livaboard but regularly flew there.
Agree with Mike, the local coast is dull dull dull.
Ps It’s called Porto di Roma

 

[Portofino]

The coast gets interesting near Elba .
Many Italians just big holiday over at the big islands .

Bit bias but shows the area well.

Also as a country to base the Italians are warmer more friendly more helpful than the French by miles .

As Mapish M mentioned we are @ Loano and it’s difficult to find anything negative thus far .Still waiting for the catch !
locally there’s a couple of islands within easy day boat range and plenty of other nice day anchorages to just go out in high summer for a swim etc .Indeed Monaco is only 2 hrs away by boat .

Genoa is the nearest airport and a recent flight from Stansted ( Ryan air ) as I was in the U.K. was only £25 rtn .Hire car €18 for 2days , an easy 50 min drive .Nice would be 1-1/2 hr .
Day to day living is a hell a lot less too , Stella €5 here , France CdA €8 , Pizza single digit as opposed to double digit etc etc .
We will do some exploring similar to the vid next season.......looking fwd .

 

[BartW]

also for us the proximity of a airport is a important factor

we were one season in Salerno, (Naples - Amalfi region)
there are a few marina’s close to and in Naples, but we didn’t like them, nor did we like the huge and dirty city of Naples.
Naples marina’s are not at walking distance from the city center.

We were in old port of Salerno, at approx. 50min taxi drive from Naples airport.
The old port of Salerno (there are a few different concessions) is nothing special, but the city of Salerno made good for that, it’s a really nice city for visiting with restaurants at walking distance.
The boat was one month in Martina d’Arechi, which on paper looks good, but we didn’t like it, its in the middle of nowhere, at 5km from Salerno, and the local provisions are very limited

after one season we left the Amalfi coast because it is much to crowded and too busy in summer, and no decent quite anchorages,
But the region should be on every med boaters destination list !

Currently we are our second season in Cagliari south Sardegna, and really love the place,
Portus Karalis is right in the center of nice old town Cagliari,
Many shops and good restaurants right across the street,
All possible supply’s are available in Sardegan’s capital Cagliari

Distance to the airport:
10 min taxi ride
or
300m walk to Cagliari train station, and 6min ride to the airport’s train station.

Very affordable prices are a extra bonus. (for the mooring, aswell as the living down there)

 

[Truro Ex Pat]

Thanks guys for that, I once did Costa Del Sol and found the coast pretty boring as well, would it be better to miss out the north west part of Italy and go via Corsica and Sardinia and then on to Rome, was not thinking of the Islands for 2020 but would that be a better winter stop than say the Rome area?
Rome does appeal as it gives us options for the winter to look around that area but did not want to miss out on the north West coast if it was good?
Genoa looked good but its a long way away to go up to then come back down particularly if the area is not that interesting.

 

[Portofino]

What do you want from your boat ? Usage pattern ?
Once we know the prescription advice can be tailored.
retired ?
holidays Only ?
loadsa guests every time ?
multiple close family flying in part throughout a trip ?
big adventure trips ?
just chilling ?
short week ends ?
floating apartment ?mostly ?

 

[BartW]

would it be better to miss out the north west part of Italy and go via Corsica and Sardinia and then on to Rome, was not thinking of the Islands for 2020 but would that be a better winter stop than say the Rome area?
Rome does appeal as it gives us options for the winter to look around that area but did not want to miss out on the north West coast if it was good?
Genoa looked good but its a long way away to go up to then come back down particularly if the area is not that interesting.

can't give advice about the North, Genua region, never been there by boat,

it does make sense to travel along Portofino, cinque terre, la Spezia, Elba, and tuscan island (giglio giannutri,), Porto Ercole, ... towards Rome,
many interesting and nice spots along this track.
but tbh I didn't like the Rome region for staying,
For visiting Rome, you better take a flight and stay in the city, instead of the marina in Ostia, (it takes you one hour to go from Ostia to Rome center)
I've spend there 3 times a couple of months, but nothing attractive imho (2 times Ostia, 1 winter in Fiumicino in a yard)

for winter time, Corse and the north of Sardegna doesn't make sense either, imo.
its all very desolated,
I've been told that maddelena region is extremely quite in winter, and as it is mostly artificial, there is nothing interesting (except Olbia maybe)


if you want interesting places for winter in Italy, choice is Naples, Salerno, or Cagliari
don't know for the north

 

[MapisM]

Rome does appeal as it gives us options for the winter to look around that area but did not want to miss out on the north West coast if it was good?

Well, it is good, imho.
As I mentioned in my previous post, Eastern Liguria (Portofino, Cinque Terre, Porto Venere) is very nice, with several historical villages worth seeing.
And a bit further South, the Tuscan Archipelago is equally attractive, if not more.
I didn't consider flights convenience, though - and I can understand Deleted User objections, in this respect.
Maybe Viareggio/Pisa area is the best compromise, if you find flights convenient for you serving Pisa.
Btw, it's also an area where you can get just about any job/refitting you can dream of, from some of the best yards of this planet. At a price, obviously...
Ref. Rome, BartW is right, it's nothing to write home about from a boating standpoint, but as a base for visiting the inland area, I wouldn't rule it out.
The big islands (both Corsica and Sardinia), from a boating standpoint are quite simply in another league, but most of their coastlines and villages don't have much to offer in wintertime.
With the only exceptions of Olbia, Cagliari and Alghero in Sardinia, plus possibly Ajaccio and Bonifacio in Corsica.
But I'm nowhere near knowledgeable about the latter as I am of the first, so happy to stand corrected on that.

 

[Deleted User YDKXO]

was not thinking of the Islands for 2020 but would that be a better winter stop than say the Rome area?

The primary consideration for winter mooring is can you get there? Certainly when we were based near Olbia in Sardinia, at that time Easyjet stopped flying there in October and didnt resume until April so it was a non starter for a winter mooring for us. The south of Sardinia is more viable because there are year round flights to Cagliari. IMHO the secondary consideration is whether there is a competent and trustworthy yard nearby to carry out the inevitable winter maintenance. FWIW, when we were based in Carloforte in SW Sardinia we were directed to this yard and found them to be excellent Sacirn il cantiere nautico di eccellenza in Sardegna.

 

[Truro Ex Pat]

I don't do a lot of winter trips so don't want to make that a priority, sounds like the islands are the best bet, any tips on where to book in to leave for the winter, I ended up in Menton this year by accident as they had space and a bit of deal. Need somewhere from September on to leave for the winter and get flight back. Pisa does have links to Bristol which is closest option for me but sounds very limited on cruising.

 

[MapisM]

If you wish to follow my last suggestion (Pisa/Viareggio), you can try either "Marina di Viareggio" or "Porto di Pisa".
My personal preference would be for the first, but also the latter is good, and is as close to Pisa airport as you can get.

If you would like instead to give Sardinia a try, next Sunday I will fly to Cagliari and I'll be there for a while, so I can check directly with the marina anything you wish to know. In fact, I must admit that my compatriots aren't always outstanding, when it comes to following up emails...
For Olbia instead, it's "Marina di Olbia" that you should get in touch with.
Worth checking in advance flights availability, though.

 

[Truro Ex Pat]

Porto di Pisa only have 15.75 and we need 16.99x 4.8.
I can't find a website for M di Viareggio if you can ask in the marinas in Sardinia that would be great looking at arriving end of Aug or September early, the flights are only London based from what can see but that would be fine as I can leave it over winter. Also do you know if there are any on land storage as that gives peace of mind particularly if not visiting in winter.

 

[MapisM]

Porto di Pisa only have 15.75

Did they confirm you that they can't handle anything bigger, or did you just find that in their website?
I'm asking because I drove along that marina more than once, and I'm pretty sure to have seen some bigger boats, at least up to 20m or so.
If you already didn't, you might try emailing them with a specific request.
But I can also give them a call if you wish, getting rid of any possible language misunderstanding.

For Viareggio, I just googled for it because I never got in touch with them directly, and I found this link:
Porto Viareggio - Book a berth now | Marina Reservation
But actually, I was very surprised to see that they mention size up to "only" 18m (which would be fine for yourself, anyhow), because Viareggio is also used by Azimut-Benetti for their superyachts, so I'm pretty sure that they can handle MUCH bigger boats.
Regardless, if you are interested in the place and you have any difficulties to get in touch with them, I can ask a chap whose 22m boat is moored right there.

Back to Sardinia, no problem at all to ask Portus Karalis (which is the name of the marina in Cagliari I was referring to, and where btw BartW of this parish has his boat moored at the moment) a quotation for a 17m berth. I can follow up on this next week.
If I got your tentative dates correctly, you would arrive at the end of Aug/beginning of Sep 2020, right? And you would like to stay for how long?

For land storage, I'm not sure if any yard in Cagliari can offer that. Probably yes, but I would think only outside.
If you would like to have the boat sheltered, I believe that the only yard in S Sardinia that can handle large boats (up to 30m or so) is the one Deleted User mentioned in his post #11, which happens to be the same that I'm using for my own boat.
Their sheds are usually pretty full during winter though, so you'd better book well in advance.

 

[NYboater]

Porto di Pisa only have 15.75 and we need 16.99x 4.8.
I can't find a website for M di Viareggio if you can ask in the marinas in Sardinia that would be great looking at arriving end of Aug or September early, the flights are only London based from what can see but that would be fine as I can leave it over winter. Also do you know if there are any on land storage as that gives peace of mind particularly if not visiting in winter.

We berthed at Porto di Pisa in July of 2017. We are 25x6 And there were bigger boats than us.

 

[petem]

If you would like to have the boat sheltered, I believe that the only yard in S Sardinia that can handle large boats (up to 30m or so) is the one Deleted User mentioned in his post #11, which happens to be the same that I'm using for my own boat.
Their sheds are usually pretty full during winter though, so you'd better book well in advance.

Did you dry store your boat for the Winter then P?

I must say I quite fancy a season in Sardinia. Not sure if I have the range to get there on it's own bottom so might need to be tricked from Menorca to Sardinia. Either that or some Jerry cans!

Are they able to fix truculent green engines over there?

 

[Hurricane]

Did you dry store your boat for the Winter then P?

I must say I quite fancy a season in Sardinia. Not sure if I have the range to get there on it's own bottom so might need to be tricked from Menorca to Sardinia. Either that or some Jerry cans!

Are they able to fix truculent green engines over there?

Under 190 miles from Mahon to Carloforte.
Have you ever checked your displacement range?
You can get some lovely weather so you could take your time and "pootle" - like us.
Just wait in Mahon for the weather.
We are thinking of a late summer run down there for 2020.

Here's a video - made before the days of video stabilisation!!!

 

[petem]

Under 190 miles from Mahon to Carloforte.
Have you ever checked your displacement range?
You can get some lovely weather so you could take your time and "pootle" - like us.
Just wait in Mahon for the weather.
We are thinking of a late summer run down there for 2020.

Mike, I need to check my records but I think we'd just about make (it but would depend on sea state). An Extra 100 litres of fuel would probably give us a safety margin.

But it would be a miserable journey in my boat, 70 miles to Ibiza is long enough for me. So sticking it on a truck / ferry or delivery skipper would be the way to go.

 

[MapisM]

Did you dry store your boat for the Winter then P?

I must say I quite fancy a season in Sardinia. Not sure if I have the range to get there on it's own bottom so might need to be tricked from Menorca to Sardinia. Either that or some Jerry cans!

Are they able to fix truculent green engines over there?

Yes, I always sheltered the old lady for winter - and so far I did also with the DP, though it's likely that at the end of next summer I'll leave her at CF fully commissioned, for several reasons, all irrelevant in this context.
And yes, my yard is very much used to deal with green stuff.
Actually, they have some experience with most marine engines, including exotic stuff like Seatek and Isotta Fraschini (installed in Coast Guard vessels).
But for VP (and Cat) they are also official dealers - and I have a funny feeling that VP powered boats, particularly with outdrives and IPS, count for their bread, butter and also spaghetti, if you see what I mean...

Ref. the range, nothing to add to what Hurric said.
But in your boots, provided to have enough juice, I would wait for a glorious day in Mahon, and then make the whole crossing at P speed.
It's less than 10 hours at 20kts, all in daylight and fair weather - what's there not to like?
That's exactly what we did when arriving from Sicily with the DP in 2017, over an even longer distance.
And she was a completely new boat to us, which we also knew to need injectors refurbishing and some other maintenance.
Otoh, if you should make a fair bit of the passage at D speed in order to have the range, then I agree that it's a cruise I wouldn't fancy making with a boat like yours - or also mine, for that matter.
In fact, I already forgot what single digit cruising means also with the DP, after 17 years spent at 8kts or so!