Is this a vang?

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madmat99

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Hi all.
I am looking at a westerly Berwick as a fixer upper and it has a furling mainsail.
this is on the boom and I am not sure if it’s part of the furling system or if it’s the vang.
it seems like you can adjust its position on the boom then tighten down to the mast base.
Any help appreciated!

cheers

mat
 
Lovely

thank you.
It must have been changed from a rolling boom to a in mast furling but they left this on.

cheers

mat
 
I would have thought a boom claw like this would require a solid strut to be classed as a vang -I would call it a kicking strap and the claw device was common on the Berwickshire smaller sister the Centaur due to reefing working by rotating a handle on the front of boom(as per post#3 ) Whether that claw is still reliable might be debatable but a solid strut by selden or Barton might be worth consideration. As said maybe the in mast main furler is a retro fit so also might merit further research as it seems rather OTT to have in mast on a Berwick maybe. Good luck on your project BTW .
 
Mine had a bronze rod going forward to a bracket on the gooseneck. This stopped it moving fwd. One could take a line aft to the outer end of the boom but that seems a little untidy The mainsheet fitted to the very end of the boom. ( not westerly though)
 
madmat99 said:
Lovely
thank you.
It must have been changed from a rolling boom to a in mast furling but they left this on.
cheers
mat
Click to expand...
If you are not rolling the sail round the boom to reef it would be better to fix the vang directly to the boom.
If it is the original Berwick boom there is a slot on the under side . The original vang/ kicking strap attached to a fitting in this slot.
It could not be used of course when reefed which is presumably why the claw ring was used.
We simply never used the vang at all.


Caraway said:
Why doesn't it slide forward?
Isn't it a mainsheet claw?
Click to expand...

Its a reefing claw In this instance it is being used for the vang.......... There should be a guy from it to the boom end swivel to prevent it moving forwards
The main sheet attaches to a swivel at the end of the boom
 
I would suggest you do not consider the claw as useful. Yes it is meant to be a vang. Kicking strap is not a term heard around here. (Oz) I very much doubt it has in mast furling. Perhaps OP misunderstands what that is. Anyway if Op buys the boat there are much more important things to consider. (like engine sails rigging etc etc.
What most people would do is covert to slab reefing. Roller reefing does not give a good sail shape. So as said vang would be permanently attached to under side of boom. The mainsail wopuld be modified to fit reefing eyelets tack and clew and smaller eylets for string to tidy up the bunt of the sail. (the bunt is what sail is left flopping under the boom when sail is pulled down to the reefing eyelets.
I am a fan of 2 line reefing. Not single line reefing. Typically 2 reefing options would suit most day sailors. I only ever use the first reef. If I look like needing more I will stay home. ol'will
 
Kicking strap, or kicker - used over here on the other side.

Single line reefing is invaluable for the 2 and third reef as none need to leave the cockpit (so its safer). We seldom use the first reef, Seldom system - because the reef is so small. There is a tendency for us to leave the first reef until it a bit later anyway - and we go straight to the 2nd reef. By this time you are not quite so worried about sail shape - there are other issues to think about :)

Not having a vang or a kicker any longer - is the solid strut on a vang only needed to support the boom, instead of a topping lift, when reefing or when moored. A strut costs a bit more than a purchase system for a kicker

Jonathan
 
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It sounds as if the boat is new to the Op so my suggestion would be to take a dynema line from the claw to the outer end of the boom so it stays in the correct position. then attach the kicking strap to it & go sailing. Get used to the boat & do all the other jobs first.
the advantage of the claw , for now is that it pulls down on the top of the boom . Any fitting under the boom( assuming that it is not already there) may take a bit of surgery & may well rely on pop rivets for security. these could easily pull out in an accidental gybe etc. when a sudden unexpected load is applied.
In spite of what some might say a vang is needed off wind to maintain sail shape & reduce roll
It looks a bit naff, but if it works & is secure then why not keep it for now?
 
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Daydream believer said:
Wish I could predict the weather that good.
It would mean that I would hardly ever get to go sailing though :unsure:
Click to expand...

Some sailing jurisdictions cancel racing if windspeeds are forecast to increase over a certain (not very high) level. This has some logic behind it - protect the competitors (and the legal implications to the organisations and skipper). The trouble is forecasts are just forecasts - there is no certainty. If you follow the logic competitors have no experience of stronger winds, which might need the second or third reef (and the accompanying issues, not mentioning seasickness). How are you going to experience reality if authorities take the easy option? How do you prepare for the need for the 3rd reef?

Jonathan

Apologies for thread drift.
 
I had this system on a Trapper 500 . Its definately to allow the Vang to stay in place as the Boom roles to furl the sale down. The general agreement was that it gave a poor sail shape once reefed, so It was no longer used for reefing. I added Slab reefing.
However I discovered that it was excellent for Sail Tidying . No Lazy Bags or Jacks required,-Simply - allow the halyard to drop and role the sail using the handle on the mast end of the boom as you ease the Halyard. Really handy!

Kinsale 373
 
....
Neeves said:
Nice, simple explanatory sketch!

What stopes the reefing claw, sliding (ooching?) aft and loosening the kicker/vang - or is the reefing claw 'tied' to the top block, immediately adjacent ?? What was the intended use fo the keyhole plate?

Jonathan
Click to expand...
When tension is on the kicking strap the claw cannot move aft provided it is fixed at the junction (perhaps that is not entirely clear in the drawing). In fact the load on the outhaul line is quite high.
 
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Kinsale373 said:
I had this system on a Trapper 500 . Its definately to allow the Vang to stay in place as the Boom roles to furl the sale down. The general agreement was that it gave a poor sail shape once reefed, so It was no longer used for reefing. I added Slab reefing.
However I discovered that it was excellent for Sail Tidying . No Lazy Bags or Jacks required,-Simply - allow the halyard to drop and role the sail using the handle on the mast end of the boom as you ease the Halyard. Really handy!

Kinsale 373
Click to expand...
I had roller reefing, as did many Stellas in the early days. We had tapered booms & the system worked quite well. One needed to take the weight on the topping lift, ease the halyard & pull the leech out as one furled. We always raced & a poorly set sail was not acceptable. I can assure you that the likes of Richard Mathews ( Scorpio) & co would not have accepted that. It was slow but quite possible to set a decent sail.
When I bought my second Stella in 1998 it still had the roller reefing set up. However, by then most had changed to slab & I made a new boom & did the same.
I do recall in one fierce gale having storm jib & 13 rolls in the sail.
 
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Re boom vang. My little boat has 3m boom and large main sail. The vang sits in quite a tight gap of cabin top to boom. The result is that the vang has very little power to pull the boom down. In fact almost useless. Look at the geometry. It can help however when running with boom right out to limit boom rising. fortunately I have a wide traveller which does give effective pull down of the boom when on the wind. I have often sailed without the vang. Op might consider abandoning the vang. ol'will
 
My only contribution to this discussion is that I’ve always considered vang and kicking strap to be interchangeable. They both describe the same thing. When I started sailing I learned ‘kicking strap’ and later learned vang (as an Americanism?)
Whether a boat can manage without a vang is another discussion. I don’t like sailing without one.
 
William_H said:
Re boom vang. My little boat has 3m boom and large main sail. The vang sits in quite a tight gap of cabin top to boom. The result is that the vang has very little power to pull the boom down. In fact almost useless. Look at the geometry. It can help however when running with boom right out to limit boom rising. fortunately I have a wide traveller which does give effective pull down of the boom when on the wind. I have often sailed without the vang. Op might consider abandoning the vang. ol'will
Click to expand...
A vang used to be an optional extra on US built boats until not that long ago.
 
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