Is it just me....

Oh come on .. no one is moaning about the necessity for regulation etc its the tone employed which is the hackle raiser .. IMHO a bit of PR training would seem to be a good idea.

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I must be thick-skinned, I reckon. I've just read it twice to see if I was missing somehting, and hackles definitely still in the lowered position.



<hr width=100% size=1>Nickel

Being paranoid simply means - having all the facts.
 
Bagdad!!!???

I don't think most of us would want anarchy, but the thought of having someone like you Boatmike, in any form of authority, could possibly make me change my mind!

Surely you don't really find it unfortunate that most of us have never been in the armed forces?

Although I have every respect for most current and ex sevicemen & women, somehow I'm not surprised that as a result of years of receiving and taking orders, you probably don't find anything, even slightly offensive, about the tone of QHM's 'order' to all of us.

But what I find most disturbing about all this, is that a slightly tongue in cheek thread, that started off by asking if anyone found QHM's tone a bit hackle raising, has turned into a major rant by you suggesting that people (and by inference me), should try living in Bagdad..........

Wow! Thank heavens you are not QHM!

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I think that what is winding people up is that a law-abinding citizen, minding his/her own business, is being REQUIRED to fill in paperwork for the benefit of the authorities.

I don't have a problem with the QHM having authority, but I don't like having to fill in forms, etc, when I haven't done anything wrong.

It also irritates me that one is expected to fill in an SORN when keeping a car off the road, or provide justification if I don't have a TV licence. It's all part of the same system, where people who spend their lives dealing with information (very easily, now they have computers) think nothing of slapping legal requirements on the population to supply the information for them to play with.

Grumble, grumble,

Rich

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"I think that what is winding people up is that a law-abinding citizen, minding his/her own business, is being REQUIRED to fill in paperwork for the benefit of the authorities."

Its not for the benefit of the authorities, its for yours and everyone elses benefit. Being a citizen means you have to be socially responsible, ie acting when someone does wrong.

Is it really too arduous a task to fill in a form that will help contribute to the smooth running of the port and prevent accidents?? If it is you have *serious* laziness issues!

With regards to SORN's and TV licenses, what other possible way is there of doing things exactly??? The government needs to keep track of what cars should be paying road tax don't they? The reason they have to make it a legal requirement is because of people like you who wouldn't bother to tell them unless they poke you with a cattle prod. If people didn't have to declare a SORN then how much wasted time would there be chasing people who didn't need to pay and didn't bother telling them??

I find your grumble ridiculous!

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Quote.
Its not for the benefit of the authorities, its for yours and everyone elses benefit. Being a citizen means you have to be socially responsible, ie acting when someone does wrong.

Rubbish! Being an intelligent "citizen" means I have the right to choose. I resent being "required" to submit any form to anybody. If I feel it necessary to submit a complaint I'll submit it ( although with little expectation it will be acted on), if I don't I won't. Sod all the petty little bureaucraps

By the way I don't have an armed forces background. Bet that surprises you..



<hr width=100% size=1>A pessimist is an optimist in full possession of the facts
 
If people weren't required to act in a certain way, we would have anarchy.
All you've done is re-moan about how you shouldn't have to do anything unless you want to, ignoring the reasoning behind why you are "required" to fill in some forms. They really are valid reasons, are you going to contest that?

Being a citizen gives you a right to choose who governs you, not a right to choose which of your governors laws you want to obey. If you don't like the laws, vote. Or even better, stand yourself.

I thought most people grew out of this kind of attitude by the time they finished school. Moaning about our decision to go to war, or rising taxes, or rising violent crime is understandable. Moaning about having to fill in a form or having to go to school is ridiculous!

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Re: Another question ?

Demn it old chap ! I agree wholeheartedly with you and boatmike. The answer to the unwashed boaters is to reinstitute National Service. I had a chap of 70 telling me last week how it made a man of him - and now he's the Chairman of the Parish Council - so it obviously works. If everyone spent 2 years as a squaddie then there would be none of this bolshie nonsense - all these boaties would shine their boots and boats and gladly report to this splendid chappie in Portsmouth.

I also think that we should highly recommend UKIP to the yachies - stop those nastie Froggie types infiltrating within the 12 mile limit.

Anyone got any further ideas ?

<hr width=100% size=1>a pragmatist is an optimist with a boat in the UK - but serious about not being in the UK !
 
Re: Another question ?

Yes! The statutory punishment for causing an emergency situation in the small boat channel should be immediate sterilisation!

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Re: Another question ?

No no - you've misunderstood me - 100 lines would be more appropriate - assuming they can write of course.

Don't you think you're all making the case for statutory regulation - or is that really what you want ? Then we'd be required to complete forms - BY LAW. No naughty pranks or sailing in an independent manner - quite frankly old man that wouldn't be playing the game, would it ?

<hr width=100% size=1>a pragmatist is an optimist with a boat in the UK - but serious about not being in the UK !
 
Oh dear, I agree with boat mike again - does the forum think that I need to see a psychiatrist. /forums/images/icons/smile.gif

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Probably. But there are plenty of others in the queue first trying to cure their phobias about all the forms they have to fill in :-)

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Re: Bagdad!!!???

Relax my friend, there is no chance of me wanting QHM's job or being even vaguely qualified to do it. As I said earlier, this post is polarising peoples views and there is no doubt which side of the argument you are on. Have a nice day!

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"Being a citizen means you have to be socially responsible..."

I guess that's the problem. I can't opt out of being a citizen. So I can't opt out of being "socially responsible". Which means whatever the government thinks it ought to.

I used to think that being a citizen meant being subject to the law of the land. Social responsibility was an option, assuming that such jargon had been invented. The impression I get now is that we poor little citizens can't be trusted to be responsible, so the government will regulate our behaviour. Regulation which will be ignored by the worst behaved (at whom it is really directed), resented by some, and accepted by others. I'm happy being "socially responsible", but not so delighted about being told that I have to be.

Re: SORN. I own a car, licensed to me. I don't have it taxed. I am therefore breaking the law if it is on the public road. Fine. What does the SORN gain anybody? Am I less likely to drive untaxed after filling in a SORN declaration?

Much the same applies to TV licenses.

Still grumbling, however ridiculously,

Rich

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Quote: "Re: SORN. I own a car, licensed to me. I don't have it taxed. I am therefore breaking the law if it is on the public road. Fine. What does the SORN gain anybody? Am I less likely to drive untaxed after filling in a SORN declaration?"

No you're not, but the DVLA now knows that you don't intend to use the car on the road and that therefore you don't need to pay tax. So if they go through their database to find out which naughty people haven't paid or have forgotten to pay their tax they'll know not to bother you. Its got nothing to do with the nanny state!

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I might accord you more credibility if you were to provide some bio. What do you have to hide? Or is it just that you dislike filling in forms?

<hr width=100% size=1>A pessimist is an optimist in full possession of the facts
 
Reporting / SORN etc.

I visit UK a few times per year and I pay Road Tax .... blimey the price !!! So I duly fill in my SORN every time I depart UK ... and duly get my tax back for unused months .... A pain in the arse to do, but a reward of knowing that a) I get unused tax back, b) Govt Dept. can waste time chasing someone else.
QHM and reporting .... is a little different - BUT ultimately benefits us - pain in the arse and really sad that it has to be required that you complete a report ..... but that ust have been imposed because many hadn't reported the bad boys ....

Sad times we live in .....


<hr width=100% size=1>Cheers Nigel http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gps-navigator/ http://groups.yahoo.com/group/searider/
 
By avoiding the report / rule ...

That attitude could actually speed up the introduction of licencing and Statutory Examination ......

Voluntary ...... yes because no matter how the QHM or anyone else shouts screams etc. - YOU Have the choice whether to comply or not - and it would be difficult to prove you had or not....... Voluntary 'policing' and standards are the preferred and I regard the QHM as aiding that by his response and request for more reports to tackle the iodiots etc.

Ignore at your Statutory Exam peril ......


<hr width=100% size=1>Cheers Nigel http://groups.yahoo.com/group/gps-navigator/ http://groups.yahoo.com/group/searider/
 
Re: By avoiding the report / rule ...

Personally I'd rather ship out and leave HM anthing else to play in the Solent. IMHO the only time the Solent is bearable is in January.

Other places not only have nicer weather (damp round the edges for the 3rd time today) but maybe don't have the same bureaucracy and pressure of numbers (lets hope/dream so).

<hr width=100% size=1>a pragmatist is an optimist with a boat in the UK - but serious about not being in the UK !
 
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