Is 20 years too old?

[Cody "Boaty"]

Hey everyone! This is my first post here, and I come in search of advice.
I have an opportunity to purchase a cruiser for about 10k under market from a family member. The boat is a 2000 Trojan 360 Express by Carver. I know everyone has their opinions about every manufacture, but I believe Carver to be more of a premium brand. ( Background on the brand(s): In the mid-1990s Trojan Yachts went bankrupt and all assets were purchased by Carver where they used the boats to introduce a line of large express yachts to rival the Sundancer line and other large express cruisers. Trojan ( by carver ) had 4 express models in the 2000 model year. The 320, 360, 400, and 440). This boat is the 360. Anyway, I am planning to purchase this boat to use for day charters. It has an enclosed stateroom with an island berth ( rare on express yachts of this size ), a full galley, full head, a large salon, and a mid-cabin with a convertible bed. The cabin is pretty nice with leather seating, rich cherry woodwork, and nice earth tones. It's a very nice place to be. It just had new carpet ( interior and exterior ) installed, and the cabin sofas were just reupholstered. Its really in nice shape. My family member took good care of it with getting it detailed and waxed regularly, along with new bottom paint when needed. It also has a new engine. a few years back the mechanic forgot to take the old O-Ring off when replacing an oil filter and the engine seized. The new one only has 10 hours on it, and both are strong runners. The other engine has 670 hours. They are twin MerCruiser 7.4 MPI V8's attached to V-Drive transmissions. It also has an 8kw Kohler generator. Are there any things that I should be looking out for that I'm not thinking of? The boats I've owed are a 2005 Sea Ray 260 Sundancer, and I currently have a 2000 Lowe Suncruiser 24' Tritoon.

 

[BruceK]

Hey everyone! This is my first post here, and I come in search of advice.
..........

What advice were you looking for?

 

[lynallbel]

Boats are like Land Rovers, you buy on condiiton and not age.

 

[Jamie Dundee]

Boats are like Land Rovers, you buy on condiiton and not age.

And more in hope than expectation... ?

 

[scottie]

Any advise of chartering on this forum are likely to be framed by uk regulations unlike USCG REGS so may be of dubious help and
petrol V8 engines not the most popular but it looks a nice tidy boat with great

 

[Mr Googler]

Land Rover....Turning owners into mechanics for 70 years

 

[DavidJ]

The boat looks clean enough but you need to get more information about the cost of upgrading to the legal requirements for chartering. Maybe someone here can help.

 

[Cody "Boaty"]

Sorry, I wasn't too clear on what I was looking for. I was just wondering if there's anything I should look out for. This would be my first boat around that size range. It is my uncle's boat. it's kinda funny what happened. He "bought" it in 2002 from an ex-business partner that was later arrested for stealing money from him and a few other people. He was forced to sell all his assets to pay off his debts. So, he sold my uncle the boat and basically had to give him back the money my uncle paid for it. Before this, my uncle had an F32 Trojan sedan, so he pretty much got a free upgrade. anyway, where I am going with this is that my Uncle bought it barely used, and took really good care of it since. But I'm just trying to be careful because I'm not trying to get sunk ( Pun Intended ) on this one.

 

[Cody "Boaty"]

Scottie -
Is this a primarily U.K. based forum? I'm in the U.S. Lake of the Ozarks, Missouri to be exact.

 

[longjohnsilver]

I’m sorry, but Carver, a premium brand? I’m not sure that many would agree.

 

[Cody "Boaty"]

I’m sorry, but Carver, a premium brand? I’m not sure that many would agree.

"I believe Carver to be more of a premium brand" ( "I believe" ). Please remember that I am coming from owning a Pontoon and a 26-foot sea ray. I'm sorry a Carver is not up to your standards. Please remember that I am just some hick from the midwest.

 

[longjohnsilver]

Nothing to do with my standards, just the impression I get from various reviews and owners.

 

[scottie]

Scottie -
Is this a primarily U.K. based forum? I'm in the U.S. Lake of the Ozarks, Missouri to be exact.

Yes but we do have various wanderers from your side of the pond

 

[Sticky Fingers]

Land Rover....Turning owners into mechanics for 70 years

Ain't that the truth, says the LR owner of 5 decades.... though I've sold my last LR and now have two out of three.. Jag and RR.

 

[Sticky Fingers]

Hi @Cody "Boaty" yes this is predominantly a UK forum. Carver is not a brand well known in the UK and not respected as "quality" in Europe compared to Euro brands (Princess, Sunseeker, Fairline. Azimut, Feretti, Absolute...) .

A 20 YO boat = not an appealing charter prospect.

In UK/Europe (touchy subject) chartering is very heavily regulated and this idea generally (regardless of the boat) would not be attractive.

But at 10k (presume USD) that's a bargain so I suggest you buy it and enjoy boating with your fiends / family. Spend a year with it then decide what to do next.

 

[Bajansailor]

Scala, I think that Cody is suggesting that he can purchase the boat for US$10k less than the going market value, not for $10k itself?

Here is a similar age sister ship for sale in Florida for US$ 45,000 -
2001 Trojan 360 Express Yacht

Cody, I know that inboard shaft drive petrol engines are more commonplace in the USA than in Europe, but even so, you can probably expect to have problems with engines that are 20 years old. OK, one engine is new, but the other one is still 'old'.
And one aspect in your favour, being in Missouri, is that they are at least working in fresh water, not salt.

You mention that you want to do 'day charters' with this vessel - can you elaborate a bit on this please?
Would this be for a standard '6 pack' where you carry a maximum of 6 people?
Have you researched the USCG regulations that you would have to comply with, including the qualifications required of the skipper?

You could also try asking your questions in the Powerboats section of the Boat Design Forum, which is based in the USA, and has a lot of very experienced American contributors who are familiar with the regulations you would have to comply with -
Powerboats

 

[Cody "Boaty"]

Scala, I think that Cody is suggesting that he can purchase the boat for US$10k less than the going market value, not for $10k itself?

Here is a similar age sister ship for sale in Florida for US$ 45,000 -
2001 Trojan 360 Express Yacht

Cody, I know that inboard shaft drive petrol engines are more commonplace in the USA than in Europe, but even so, you can probably expect to have problems with engines that are 20 years old. OK, one engine is new, but the other one is still 'old'.
And one aspect in your favour, being in Missouri, is that they are at least working in fresh water, not salt.

You mention that you want to do 'day charters' with this vessel - can you elaborate a bit on this please?
Would this be for a standard '6 pack' where you carry a maximum of 6 people?
Have you researched the USCG regulations that you would have to comply with, including the qualifications required of the skipper?

You could also try asking your questions in the Powerboats section of the Boat Design Forum, which is based in the USA, and has a lot of very experienced American contributors who are familiar with the regulations you would have to comply with -
Powerboats

My apologies. The boat is listed at $65,000 USD ( 54,849 Euros ). This is around the market price for this boat in this condition. I was offered the boat for $55,000 ( 46,410 Euros ). I'm planning on having the old engine rebuild at least. These engines are pretty well regarded here. The 7.4 "Big Block" started out in Chevrolet trucks and SUV's back in the 1950s. It was later adapted into marine use for its durable and somewhat crude design. Pig iron block, pushrods, etc. The boat was run regularly and serviced professionally by the same mechanic. This mechanic retired and passed the family business down to his son, who at 19 years old, didn't have any experience, no training, and lied about having his certifications. As soon as his father ( the original mechanic who serviced the boat since 2002 ) paid for a new engine, they found a new mechanic to do the work.

Day charters here consist of taking people on day trips ( 4-8 hours ). So, pick them up, take them on a tour, give them cocktails, show them around, find a spot and let them swim, and take them home at sunset. I plan on getting my Masters License, which allows me to carry 7 or more.

 

[PlanB]

If this was the UK, apart from checking and complying with charter regs, on a boat that age you would normally have a full survey, plus engine survey.

 

[Kub Cat]

I am in Australia so we have the Aussie boats, the US boats and the European boats.

There are a lot worse boats than Carvers, and some better ones as well. I would look at a Carver.

The photos show the interior to be in great condition but that’s not where I look, I spend my time in the engine room, behind panels, all the bits you don’t normally see.

On the positives, it looks well looked after, you know the history of the boat and it is a boat you like.

What you don’t know is the quality of work the mechanics have provided, that’s why I look at the hidden areas of the boat. How tidy and how much attention to detail the previous mechanics have had will be evident here.

You have petrol big blocks. Granted they are in fresh water but in my experience, they don’t last anywhere near as long as diesels. Not that they wear out, it is rare for a pleasure boat to wear out engines, they just deteriorate with age.

As for chartering work, that’s location specific and you need local knowledge. You need an expert to advise you if it is possible and if so, how much work and cost it will take. Also what qualifications the skipper and crew will need.

You also need some who has experience with chartering businesses to go through the maths with you to decide if it’s indeed viable.

If I haven’t scared you off yet and you are serious about purchasing this boat, spend the dollars on a surveyor who can advise you in detail about this specific boat and your preferred use.