Insurance for bareboat charter

bbg

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I'm renting a boat for a week in Lorient, France. Contract asks for a big security deposit (against my credit card) and asks me to accept all liability for damage to the boat.
I would not take my own boat out under those conditions - I would insure it. And with a deductible a lot less than several thousand EUR.

I haven't chartered in a while - what is the best way to deal with this to make sure I don't end up paying thousands if I screw up? Or if someone else does a nasty hit-and-run while I'm away from the boat?

Do I arrange insurance myself or do I get coverage from the owner's policy?

Thanks.
 

E39mad

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[3889]

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Because no matter how competent you are other idiots can hit you especially is crowded charter waters. We took out Pantaenius insurance last year and one through LateSail the previous year.

In which circumstances you claim off the other party's insurance / assets. Not that I'm complaining about peeps being over-insured: I'm sure the vast majority of boats superglued to the pontoon help keep my premiums to very reasonable levels. It is noticable how premiums rocket for no perceivable increase in risk once you head further afield. Presumably because the 4-weekends-a year mob never go very far.
 
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E39mad

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In which circumstances you claim off the other party's insurance / assets. Not that I'm complaining about peeps being over-insured: I'm sure the vast majority of boats superglued to the pontoon help keep my premiums to very reasonable levels. It is noticable how premiums rocket for no perceivable increase in risk once you head further afield. Presumably because the 4-weekends-a year mob never go very far.

Firstly you are assuming that they have insurance and secondly what happens they hit you when you are ashore and they move on. I for one am happy to pay about £150 or share of to protect a £2000 deposit and lots of potential hassle.
 

bbg

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Firstly you are assuming that they have insurance and secondly what happens they hit you when you are ashore and they move on. I for one am happy to pay about £150 or share of to protect a £2000 deposit and lots of potential hassle.

That's my thinking. I'm also thinking that I doubt I have ever done anything in my life without making mistakes. I'd like to think that I don't make mistakes very often, and when I do I get away with it 99% of the time. Insurance is for events that have a small risk of happening but a high consequence if they do happen.

And they are asking for EUR 5,000 so it is not negligible.
 

[3889]

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Firstly you are assuming that they have insurance and secondly what happens they hit you when you are ashore and they move on. I for one am happy to pay about £150 or share of to protect a £2000 deposit and lots of potential hassle.

No assumption on 3rd party being insured, hence claim on "assets" reference. I'll 'fess up to having a bee in my bonnet over the insurance obsession de nos jours. The idea that an insurance claim avoids potential hassle is pretty fanciful, IME. Still, each to their own.
 

desperatelyseeking

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https://www.pantaenius.com/de-en/insurance/skipper-liability/

Though my own attitude is "be careful", assuming you have the competence to do so. Ins Cos make money by covering risk. Why not keep it for yourself?

Wish i'd read this post before my recent charter in Sardinia. We lost Eu3,500 deposit and were forced to leave our boat after damage was found to the saildrive on the first day of the charter. I cannot prove that I did not hit anything and they already had my deposit so i was powerless. We had to stay in a hotel and rent a hire car all in the height of the season. In total, i reckon it's cost me £5,000. Lesson, take out deposit insurance. I'd also say charter as new a boat as you can afford. The Bavaria 38 we chartered for £2,150 had no bow thruster, no sailing instruments, broken lighting, broken autopilot. Was a total disaster and i have no recourse whatsoever. They even refused to refund me for the 2 paddleboards and outboard engine i hired as extras but had no opportunity to use. Happy to name the company we used, i'd avoid them at all costs despite being told by reliable sources locally that they are a well respected company.
 

Daverw

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We’ve always taken out non refundable deposit insurance, about £300 but whatever happens to the boat is then not our problem, we find that it works well.
 

bbg

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Wish i'd read this post before my recent charter in Sardinia. We lost Eu3,500 deposit and were forced to leave our boat after damage was found to the saildrive on the first day of the charter. I cannot prove that I did not hit anything and they already had my deposit so i was powerless. We had to stay in a hotel and rent a hire car all in the height of the season. In total, i reckon it's cost me £5,000. Lesson, take out deposit insurance. I'd also say charter as new a boat as you can afford. The Bavaria 38 we chartered for £2,150 had no bow thruster, no sailing instruments, broken lighting, broken autopilot. Was a total disaster and i have no recourse whatsoever. They even refused to refund me for the 2 paddleboards and outboard engine i hired as extras but had no opportunity to use. Happy to name the company we used, i'd avoid them at all costs despite being told by reliable sources locally that they are a well respected company.

FWIW in the end I didn’t take out separate insurance. The deposit and any damage to the boat was covered under my homeowners / personal liability insurance. Maybe check with yours.

That and my regular travel insurance (from my credit card) would also have covered the additional costs you refer to.

I suggest you check all your various insurance to see if you might have something that covers these losses. Good luck.
 
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E39mad

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Wish i'd read this post before my recent charter in Sardinia. We lost Eu3,500 deposit and were forced to leave our boat after damage was found to the saildrive on the first day of the charter. I cannot prove that I did not hit anything and they already had my deposit so i was powerless. We had to stay in a hotel and rent a hire car all in the height of the season. In total, i reckon it's cost me £5,000. Lesson, take out deposit insurance. I'd also say charter as new a boat as you can afford. The Bavaria 38 we chartered for £2,150 had no bow thruster, no sailing instruments, broken lighting, broken autopilot. Was a total disaster and i have no recourse whatsoever. They even refused to refund me for the 2 paddleboards and outboard engine i hired as extras but had no opportunity to use. Happy to name the company we used, i'd avoid them at all costs despite being told by reliable sources locally that they are a well respected company.

Sorry to hear of your woes with the charter.

Yes please name and shame the company so we can all avoid!

Did you pay anything via credit card? If so you can claim monies back through them.
 

skyflyer

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Wish i'd read this post before my recent charter in Sardinia. We lost Eu3,500 deposit and were forced to leave our boat after damage was found to the saildrive on the first day of the charter. I cannot prove that I did not hit anything and they already had my deposit so i was powerless. We had to stay in a hotel and rent a hire car all in the height of the season. In total, i reckon it's cost me £5,000. Lesson, take out deposit insurance. I'd also say charter as new a boat as you can afford. The Bavaria 38 we chartered for £2,150 had no bow thruster, no sailing instruments, broken lighting, broken autopilot. Was a total disaster and i have no recourse whatsoever. They even refused to refund me for the 2 paddleboards and outboard engine i hired as extras but had no opportunity to use. Happy to name the company we used, i'd avoid them at all costs despite being told by reliable sources locally that they are a well respected company.

if its any consolation ( 4 years later) note this from the Panataneus FAQ
"
Does this insurance cover me for damage I cause to the yacht I am skippering?

No."
 

ridgy

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Wish i'd read this post before my recent charter in Sardinia. We lost Eu3,500 deposit and were forced to leave our boat after damage was found to the saildrive on the first day of the charter. I cannot prove that I did not hit anything and they already had my deposit so i was powerless.
Out of interest how did they conveniently find saildrive damage on the first day? What was the nature of the damage and what were they doing to find it?
 

AntarcticPilot

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Negligence and malicious damage are pretty much blanket exclusions in the insurance world. Note that malicious damage means damage caused by the person insured, not damage caused by a third party. SO, you ARE covered if someone else deliberately rams you, but you AREN'T covered if you deliberately ram someone else.
 

Laser310

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Wish i'd read this post before my recent charter in Sardinia. We lost Eu3,500 deposit and were forced to leave our boat after damage was found to the saildrive on the first day of the charter. I cannot prove that I did not hit anything and they already had my deposit so i was powerless. We had to stay in a hotel and rent a hire car all in the height of the season. In total, i reckon it's cost me £5,000. Lesson, take out deposit insurance. I'd also say charter as new a boat as you can afford. The Bavaria 38 we chartered for £2,150 had no bow thruster, no sailing instruments, broken lighting, broken autopilot. Was a total disaster and i have no recourse whatsoever. They even refused to refund me for the 2 paddleboards and outboard engine i hired as extras but had no opportunity to use. Happy to name the company we used, i'd avoid them at all costs despite being told by reliable sources locally that they are a well respected company.

Wow - I guess the best way to avoid this is to bring a mask and snorkel and have a look before you leave the dock.
 
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