Inner forestay on Bavaria 42 Cruiser

[haydude]

I was wondering if anyone has fitted an inner forestay, either fixed or removable to a Bavaria 42 Cruiser (or other sizes of the Cruiser design), or could recommend the steps to take for a safe installation.

The rig is fractional 9/10

This model has an alluminium plate laminated into the foredeck which is now holding a large size Wichard D ring (for the pole downhaul). The position is right aft of the anchor windlass which I would assume is a strong point. Would the D ring be sufficient to hold a removable stay or would I require a stronger chainplate? In the latter would I need to reinforce and brace the deck below?

 

[Fr J Hackett]

It all depends Why do you want an inner forestay if it is to fly a sail from then you need to consider where you will attach it to the mast, it is desirable in such cases that the inner forestay runs parrallel with the outer stay. You then need to consider how you will support the mast ie you will need additional backstays either running or fixed. Only then can you consider the attachment at deck and that will need to be substantial not I would suggest just a pad but fixed to a cross beam if Bavarias have such things. Enjoy

 

[fireball]

I would seriously doubt the strength of the plate around that D ring. If the layout is similar to mine then that plate is in the middle of the forecabin without a bulkhead anywhere near.
It may be suitable for jackstays as the loading on those will be mostly along the decking but not a forestay as that will be perpendicular to the deck - with nothing below to take the load.

I've seen similar fittings on Westerly Falcons - and they add a chain or cable brace below the deck fitting - but this does rather impinge on the cabin layout.

If I were to fit an inner (removable) forestay I think I'd take it from the second spreaders down to the bow.

 

[haydude]

Indeed it is to fly a jib in those conditions where the furled #1 Genoa becomes inefficient and unmanageable because of the bad shape. Changing sails underway is a no-no due to short-handed comfort and sail size/weight (it takes two people to lift the sail in its bag). Besides, when the conditions require to actually change the sail, nobody wants to venture on the foredeck to drop and fold a huge and heavy sail (we are just cruising).

 

[Maxi_10]

I have had a removable inner forestay fitted this week. Boat is an Oyster 42. The deck fitting is a double pad eye, 8mm by Wichard with 4 bolts through the deck into a stainless steel angle bracket approx 100m x 200mm x 100mm wide x 5mm thick with fillets welded across the angle for strength. That is then bolted through the bulkhead at the aft end of the chain locker with a backing plate in the forward cabin, either 6 or 8 bolts through the bulkhead, I can't remember.

I was advised that a simple backing plate under the deck was not strong enough for this purpose and that deck would flex under load causing all sorts of other problems, cracks, leaks etc. A tang was added near the top of the mast (mast head rigged) sufficently high to allow a storm sail to be flown without extra back stays. So not a full cutter rig.

I have had this fitted for all the same reasons you describe. I think if you don't have a bulkhead or similar strong point under the fitting it will be a problem.

 

[haydude]

I have had a removable inner forestay fitted this week. Boat is an Oyster 42. [...] I have had this fitted for all the same reasons you describe. I think if you don't have a bulkhead or similar strong point under the fitting it will be a problem.

Thank you! I would like to learn from your experience.
Is an Oyster 42 actually 42 foot (just to understand the proportions)? I will refrain from asking about the robustness of the deck, I know, no match to a Bavaria ...

What did you do about the jib tracks and sheets route? Addtional or reuse the Genoa's? Back to the genoa winch? On the cockpit winch? Is it feasible to have a small jib furler with a removable stay or are you bound to hank-on jibs?

 

[Maxi_10]

She is 43' 6" LOA.

As for sheets we are waiting until the storm sail and/or Jib (I might order both as hanked on sails) are on the boat to determine the best sheeting angles etc.

I have seen one example where they added an extra car to the existing track, the car was in a fixed position, as the hanked on sails don't furl, the sheet then went back to the primary winch. I am hoping this will work, but we will see. So seperate sheets for each sail leaving the genoa sheets in place to keep it furled safely.

I hope that a small jib on this stay will give me good upwind, flat sail performance 20 to 35 knots then the storm sail for higher wind speeds. Although that does mean a sail change at 35 knots ??? not sure if thats ideal on a short handed cruiser. It will also allow a twin headsail arrangement down wind.

You can have furling systems on a removable stay, I had a quote from Kemps for this but the furling gear was very expensive, for a set up I don't expect to use very often. The system offered had a rope stay built into sail and the top fitting clipped onto a fitting up the mast (I hope that makes sense). I decided a simple removable stay was the answer for me.

I will be interested to hear what you decide to go with.

 

[Judders]

I think that a better solution really would be to talk to the original designers and ask them to propose the replacement.

 

[Tranona]

The normal place on a Bavaria is where Fireball suggested. Just behind the anchor locker with an L shaped reinforcement along the centreline of the deck and down the forward bulkhead. I have seen it done on a 35, similar to my 37 - I think the basic configuration of the deck/bulkhead is the same on most Bavarias I have looked at. It might make sense to have a mooring bollard incorporated at the same time as there is no centreline cleat. An experienced rigger will be able to give you firm advice.