Ignoring Brexit, is there a reason why…..

[markizok]

boats seem to be comparably less expensive in France, Croatia and Greece than in the UK, sometimes by over 25% for what seems to on screen be identical. I assume some might be connected to VAT, but I’m quite new to all this and thought it might be a topic which has been posed before (that being said I searched and couldn’t find anything!)
Thanks

 

[Sticky Fingers]

Brit prices are sky high at th emoment, and UK VAT Paid boats are relatively rare. EU VAT Paid boats much more common but shipping and VAT will add to cost unless you plan to keep it in the EU of course. So I think UK prices have risen specifically because if Br*xit not despite it or ignoring it.

 

[Baggywrinkle]

Supply and demand .... Brits are no longer looking to the EU as a potential source of boats for use in UK waters, so UK prices don't need to compete with the squillions of cheap ex-charter boats in the EU. On top, COVID has increased demand, as have the new EU travel rules, so UK boats in UK waters with VAT paid now command a premium for UK buyers.

Buying outside the UK means a VAT bill, regardless of the EU VAT status or history of a boat, if it changes hands outside the UK then VAT will be due when it comes back in - not to mention any duty or import issues, buying from the EU is now no different to buying from the USA - so the downward pressure on UK prices from EU markets has vanished.

 

[Poignard]

Supply and demand .... Brits are no longer looking to the EU as a potential source of boats for use in UK waters, so UK prices don't need to compete with the squillions of cheap ex-charter boats in the EU. On top, COVID has increased demand, as have the new EU travel rules, so UK boats in UK waters with VAT paid now command a premium for UK buyers.

Buying outside the UK means a VAT bill, regardless of the EU VAT status or history of a boat, if it changes hands outside the UK then VAT will be due when it comes back in - not to mention any duty or import issues, buying from the EU is now no different to buying from the USA - so the downward pressure on UK prices from EU markets has vanished.

That all makes sense.

 

[kashurst]

Supply and demand .... Brits are no longer looking to the EU as a potential source of boats for use in UK waters, so UK prices don't need to compete with the squillions of cheap ex-charter boats in the EU. On top, COVID has increased demand, as have the new EU travel rules, so UK boats in UK waters with VAT paid now command a premium for UK buyers.

Buying outside the UK means a VAT bill, regardless of the EU VAT status or history of a boat, if it changes hands outside the UK then VAT will be due when it comes back in - not to mention any duty or import issues, buying from the EU is now no different to buying from the USA - so the downward pressure on UK prices from EU markets has vanished.

This is what the people voted for! So that's what we now have to put up with - making everything slowly more expensive and more difficult - which apparently is a benefit - who could have foreseen that?

 

[markizok]

Supply and demand .... Brits are no longer looking to the EU as a potential source of boats for use in UK waters, so UK prices don't need to compete with the squillions of cheap ex-charter boats in the EU. On top, COVID has increased demand, as have the new EU travel rules, so UK boats in UK waters with VAT paid now command a premium for UK buyers.

Buying outside the UK means a VAT bill, regardless of the EU VAT status or history of a boat, if it changes hands outside the UK then VAT will be due when it comes back in - not to mention any duty or import issues, buying from the EU is now no different to buying from the USA - so the downward pressure on UK prices from EU markets has vanished.

Interesting. So in theory I could buy one in the Uk, take to Greece for a few years, and have the option to bring it back to the uk in the future if plans change / to sell. Assume the VAT doesn’t expire / don’t need to pay tax for every country it moves to as it is already paid in the UK (never knew tax was so complicated until I started looking at boats…. such a minefield ??)

 

[Deleted member 478]

@markizok do a search for posts and replies by @Tranona . He has posted great info about VAT and his info is up to date

 

[markizok]

@markizok do a search for posts and replies by @Tranona . He has posted great info about VAT and his info is up to date

thanks so much for the direction!

 

[Sticky Fingers]

.... Assume the VAT doesn’t expire / don’t need to pay tax for every country it moves to as it is already paid in the UK ...

There's the rub. Bad luck. OK not 'every country' but UK and EU are separate zones now. Some avoidance is feasible by moving around but you have to exit the EU completely to avoid VAT being payable there after (IIRC) 18 months; and unless you're an EU resident you can only stay 90 days in 180.

Under current rules the UK VAT Paid status won't expire if you go cruising, unless you sell it in the EU.

 

[Jamie Dundee]

Add in limited supply as above to massively increased demand due to COVID and people looking for a socially distanced holiday option which doesn’t involve crossing borders and you have a perfect storm.

 

[[165042]]

It's not just that. Increased cost of manufacture and new boat prices above the rate of inflation means residuals are firmer.

 

[BruceK]

Supply and demand .... Brits are no longer looking to the EU as a potential source of boats for use in UK waters, so UK prices don't need to compete with the squillions of cheap ex-charter boats in the EU. On top, COVID has increased demand, as have the new EU travel rules, so UK boats in UK waters with VAT paid now command a premium for UK buyers.

Buying outside the UK means a VAT bill, regardless of the EU VAT status or history of a boat, if it changes hands outside the UK then VAT will be due when it comes back in - not to mention any duty or import issues, buying from the EU is now no different to buying from the USA - so the downward pressure on UK prices from EU markets has vanished.

All this is true I am sure but ....

boats seem to be comparably less expensive in France, Croatia and Greece than in the UK,

.......

the OP's remark was true long before Brexit and COVID. Too easy to blame these. I think you hit the nail on the head with this comment

squillions of cheap ex-charter boats

 

[ari]

Condition has a lot to do with it. Boats can take a real hammering in very hot dry climates, teak fades, interior woodwork bleaches, exterior cushions get destroyed by constant strong UV light. Add the fact that covers are left off, often for months (because it's not going to rain, and if it does, it'll be bone dry in 24 hours time).

Obviously it's not the case for all boats, but it's not unusual to see a 10 year old Med boat look like a 25 year old UK boat, and be priced accordingly.

 

[alt]

Condition has a lot to do with it. Boats can take a real hammering in very hot dry climates, teak fades, interior woodwork bleaches, exterior cushions get destroyed by constant strong UV light. Add the fact that covers are left off, often for months (because it's not going to rain, and if it does, it'll be bone dry in 24 hours time).

Obviously it's not the case for all boats, but it's not unusual to see a 10 year old Med boat look like a 25 year old UK boat, and be priced accordingly.

^^ This

I remember when I was looking for a Cranchi, obviously there were loads in the Med. Once I asked for higher res / more pictures, it became apparent why they were so much cheaper. Couple that with a €10-€15k truck journey home (Ireland) and the 'bargain' was no longer so.

 

[Baggywrinkle]

Condition has a lot to do with it. Boats can take a real hammering in very hot dry climates, teak fades, interior woodwork bleaches, exterior cushions get destroyed by constant strong UV light. Add the fact that covers are left off, often for months (because it's not going to rain, and if it does, it'll be bone dry in 24 hours time).

Obviously it's not the case for all boats, but it's not unusual to see a 10 year old Med boat look like a 25 year old UK boat, and be priced accordingly.

.. and in the UK it's damp causing mildew and corrosion. A neglected boat is a neglected boat, regardless which climate it sits in and having looked at boats in both places it's swings and roundabouts IMO.

For a similar condition boat, the med will be cheaper though.

 

[alt]

.. and in the UK it's damp causing mildew and corrosion. A neglected boat is a neglected boat, regardless which climate it sits in and having looked at boats in both places it's swings and roundabouts IMO.

For a similar condition boat, the med will be cheaper though.

Heater and dehumidifier sorts that.

My interior is pristine, thanks to heater and dehumidifier Sep - Apr. The other months, ventilation does the job

 

[Baggywrinkle]

Heater and dehumidifier sorts that.

My interior is pristine, thanks to heater and dehumidifier Sep - Apr. The other months, ventilation does the job

Good for you, there are plenty of pristine med boats too .... my point is that a neglected boat is a neglected boat, in damp northern climes or hot Caribbean or Mediterranean .... UV damage and damp are all preventable, there are simply more boats for sale in the med, so when comparing like for like, the med is cheaper - supply and demand.

 

[henryf]

The perfect scenario would be a UK vat qualifying boat, ie. one that is sold plus vat.

A UK private buyer merely pays the gross inc Vat price and uses but a commercial UK buyer can claim the VAT back as can someone planning to export outside the UK.

With a VAT paid boat the commercial buyer can’t reclaim VAT and neither can someone looking to export.

I presume the same is true of an EU vessel being sold plus VAT.

Henry

 

[ari]

Heater and dehumidifier sorts that.

My interior is pristine, thanks to heater and dehumidifier Sep - Apr. The other months, ventilation does the job

Exactly. Easily sorted, whereas the very harsh effects of high UV and heat are far harder to mitigate against.

Every time someone has told me about the 'bargain boat' they bought in the Med and got trucked back, it's been easy to see why it was so cheap.

Same was true for USA imports from Florida that many people were buying and importing 20 odd years ago. They'd turn up, all bleached and faded with cracked upholstery and missing canopies.

 

[hullabaloo]

So that's what we now have to put up with - making everything slowly more expensive and more difficult

Yes that's right, bringing goods in from Europe is becoming too expensive,
We may have start manufacturing goods in England again.
And we will need staff to come and work.
The next bad move should be super tax all the Chinese crap that comes in.