If you were to fit an alternator booster

[Steve C Cronin]

A couple or four years ago I got shouted down here for my support of Charles Sterling and my indifference to the "Morris Oxford-ish" Adverc, who's creator had actually admitted to me over the phone that his device was by no means an "alternator booster".

How times have changed here!

 

[Tintin]

A couple or four years ago I got shouted down here for my support of Charles Sterling and my indifference to the "Morris Oxford-ish" Adverc, who's creator had actually admitted to me over the phone that his device was by no means an "alternator booster".

How times have changed here!

So is the Sterling unit better than the Adverc? I am struggling to get to grips with all the tech talk, so a simple explanation as to why would be very helpful as I want to fit one or the other on my new boat.

 

[Gumpy]

First thing to do is to check the output of the alternator if its 14.4v or above and you don't have a diode splitter don't waste you money on an external regulator.

 

[Steve C Cronin]

First thing to do is to check the output of the alternator if its 14.4v or above and you don't have a diode splitter don't waste you money on an external regulator.

Quite agree except that the Adverc converts to "Battery Sensing" from the standard "Machine Sensing" and that is all it does. Machine sensing only increases the alternator output when the demand increases such as when you turn the lights on in your car but also provides a little extra to charge the battery. A Battery sensing regulator takes the battery up to a pre-determined level by increasing the field windings voltage, regardless of what load is placed on it. This is much more suitable to the yacht scenario where the fridge and lights run the battery low overnight. The Sterling however is a much more sophisticated device which sets about charging the batteries as quickly as possible after an overnight deep discharge. It does this by using a staged programme beginning with a boost charge at 16.5 volts to ensure that the battery plates are clean. It then runs at around 15.2volts for a pre-determined period, known as "equalisation" (the optional monitor shows where it is in the programme and how long it has to run) it then goes on to "float" once the target battery voltage is achieved. It will also increase output if new loads are put on the batteries, like pumps etc. It also monitors other parameters like battery and alternator temperatures to make sure this is done without damaging the system. Only the Sterling can be called a "Charge Booster", an Adverc is NOT - I have this from the lips of the owner of Adverc himself! As to splitting the charge into two or more battery banks, I have changed over from spliting diodes which reduce voltage to the batteries and fitted a Blue Sea VSR (Voltage Sensitive Relay) This performs the task of seprating the batteries using a relay device which connects them and disconnects them at pre determined levels but has very little internal resistance which removes the voltage drop disadvantage of splitting diodes.

Hope this clarifies the situation.

 

[pvb]

Quite agree except that the Adverc converts to "Battery Sensing" from the standard "Machine Sensing" and that is all it does. Machine sensing only increases the alternator output when the demand increases such as when you turn the lights on in your car but also provides a little extra to charge the battery. A Battery sensing regulator takes the battery up to a pre-determined level by increasing the field windings voltage, regardless of what load is placed on it. This is much more suitable to the yacht scenario where the fridge and lights run the battery low overnight. The Sterling however is a much more sophisticated device which sets about charging the batteries as quickly as possible after an overnight deep discharge. It does this by using a staged programme beginning with a boost charge at 16.5 volts to ensure that the battery plates are clean. It then runs at around 15.2volts for a pre-determined period, known as "equalisation" (the optional monitor shows where it is in the programme and how long it has to run) it then goes on to "float" once the target battery voltage is achieved. It will also increase output if new loads are put on the batteries, like pumps etc. It also monitors other parameters like battery and alternator temperatures to make sure this is done without damaging the system. Only the Sterling can be called a "Charge Booster", an Adverc is NOT - I have this from the lips of the owner of Adverc himself!

Oh dear! So wrong! The Adverc is a booster - it increases the charging voltage at the batteries on a programmed cycle, up to around 14.8v max, depending on battery temperature (yes, the Adverc has a temperature sensor too!). It has a "slow start" function. If anything, it's over-engineered, but maybe that's why it's so popular with boatowners, not to mention ambulances, commercial vehicles, etc.

The Sterling booster has a more complex programme, but I don't know where you found the voltages you've quoted, because Sterling's literature suggests their booster will produce 14.8v maximum. You've also mentioned that it drops to a "float" voltage - note that this won't be any lower than the alternator's unboosted voltage, because the Sterling booster can only increase the alternator's voltage, not decrease it.

 

[VicMallows]

The Sterling however is a much more sophisticated device which sets about charging the batteries as quickly as possible after an overnight deep discharge. It does this by using a staged programme beginning with a boost charge at 16.5 volts to ensure that the battery plates are clean. It then runs at around 15.2volts for a pre-determined period, known as "equalisation" (the optional monitor shows where it is in the programme and how long it has to run) it then goes on to "float" once the target battery voltage is achieved. It will also increase output if new loads are put on the batteries,

Steve,
This topic comes up about once a year and always provokes disagreement.

Please can you clarify how you have come up with the charge-cycle/voltages you describe? Have you measured and timed these over several charge cycles? and from different initial states of battery discharge? What instruments? Or are you quoting from published literature of what ideally should/might happen?

Last time this was discussed another formurite (charlesswallow) maintained vehemently that his Sterling charge regulator functioned just about as you describe. However mine .... and everyone else I know who has actually measured theirs .... works in a far more simplistic way:

It maintains the voltage at the battery terminals at 14.8v (flooded open battery) for a timed period of approximately 1 hour from when it is first energised. It then drops to 13.8v (or as previously explained the voltage set by the alternators own regulator, if this is higher .... and the internal regulator has been retained). These voltages may vary a little depending on the battery TEMPERATURE (edited). but I have not been able to conclusively prove this.

If the regulator is 'reset', such as by stopping/starting the engine, the sequence is repeated ... no matter what the charge status of the battery. Same thing if the batteries have been on solar charge for ages and definitely fully charged. The 'ramp-up' function does work, but is again a timed function over about 30 seconds from when power is first applied to the regulator, which is often not ideal.

PLEASE NOTE: I have described how MY Sterling regulator and those of many others actually work. I do not dismiss entirely that some people may have ones which do actually function as you describe! That's why I would welcome input based on actual measured results as opposed to peoples interpretation of claims made. Unfortunately Sterling and his organisation are either unaware of or do not choose to input to these discussions.

 

[pvb]

Last time this was discussed another formurite (charlesswallow) maintained vehemently that his Sterling charge regulator functioned just about as you describe. However mine .... and everyone else I know who has actually measured theirs .... works in a far more simplistic way:

Vic, you obviously don't know Charles Swallow's true identity!

 

[VicMallows]

Vic, you obviously don't know Charles Swallow's true identity!

I won't deny that the thought crossed my mind .... but I would never dream of jumping to conclusions.

 

[pvb]

I won't deny that the thought crossed my mind .... but I would never dream of jumping to conclusions.

You're right! The one and only Steve C Cronin, the guy who once blasted people on here as "gutless wonders" for posting using other than their real identities! You couldn't make it up, could you? Like to guess what the "C" stands for?

 

[FullCircle]

I am no expert but Steves description is broadly my experience with the A2B so far. It does show higher than 15.5v before going imto a timed absorption cycle and then into float mode.It does react to fridge loads you can see the readout change.

 

[pvb]

I am no expert but Steves description is broadly my experience with the A2B so far. It does show higher than 15.5v before going imto a timed absorption cycle and then into float mode.It does react to fridge loads you can see the readout change.

He wasn't talking about the A-to-B charger though.

 

[temptress]

No, Prestolite manufacture the Balmar alternators. Here's just one example of a Prestolite product sheet which notes that it's an alternator marketed by Balmar - http://www.prestolite.co.uk/pgs_pro...l_id=312&item_series_id=97&refresh=1367043525

I stand corrected. I am still happy with my Balmar. Far better then the Adverc, Sterling and Merlin AMS that I have used i the past! Just spent 2 months on the hook in Scotland and the Balmar (150 amp with a double belt) plus 200w solar and windgenny was all i needed to run Heating, fridge, water-maker and everything else.

 

[Steve C Cronin]

Steve,
This topic comes up about once a year and always provokes disagreement.

Please can you clarify how you have come up with the charge-cycle/voltages you describe? Have you measured and timed these over several charge cycles? and from different initial states of battery discharge? What instruments? Or are you quoting from published literature of what ideally should/might happen?

Last time this was discussed another formurite (charlesswallow) maintained vehemently that his Sterling charge regulator functioned just about as you describe. However mine .... and everyone else I know who has actually measured theirs .... works in a far more simplistic way:

It maintains the voltage at the battery terminals at 14.8v (flooded open battery) for a timed period of approximately 1 hour from when it is first energised. It then drops to 13.8v (or as previously explained the voltage set by the alternators own regulator, if this is higher .... and the internal regulator has been retained). These voltages may vary a little depending on the battery voltage. but I have not been able to conclusively prove this.

If the regulator is 'reset', such as by stopping/starting the engine, the sequence is repeated ... no matter what the charge status of the battery. Same thing if the batteries have been on solar charge for ages and definitely fully charged. The 'ramp-up' function does work, but is again a timed function over about 30 seconds from when power is first applied to the regulator, which is often not ideal.

PLEASE NOTE: I have described how MY Sterling regulator and those of many others actually work. I do not dismiss entirely that some people may have ones which do actually function as you describe! That's why I would welcome input based on actual measured results as opposed to peoples interpretation of claims made. Unfortunately Sterling and his organisation are either unaware of or do not choose to input to these discussions.[/QUOTE.

Entirely from actual experience of course Vic. In the Med these things are very important and self delusion takes no part in maintaining adequate energy supplies. Furthermore, I have no interest in what some of the t o s s e r s posting personal insults here think.

 

[Puggy]

So is the Sterling unit better than the Adverc? I am struggling to get to grips with all the tech talk, so a simple explanation as to why would be very helpful as I want to fit one or the other on my new boat.

You ask a fairly simple question of Adverc vs Sterling. I am afraid I can't comment on the technical merits of either solution (I have an Adverc system and I am very happy with its performance and after sales support). However I also have a brand new Sterling shorepower unit, and I had some problems and I found that dealing with Sterling is a nightmare. The chap i got put through to in technical support has a very abrupt manner to the point of rudeness that I felt difficult to deal with. It was only when I threatened to return the product for a refund unless I dealt with someone else that I made some progress. Personally I will never deal with them again and will pay the extra for alternative products with a more grown up attitude to customer service.

 

[sailorman]

You ask a fairly simple question of Adverc vs Sterling. I am afraid I can't comment on the technical merits of either solution (I have an Adverc system and I am very happy with its performance and after sales support). However I also have a brand new Sterling shorepower unit, and I had some problems and I found that dealing with Sterling is a nightmare. The chap i got put through to in technical support has a very abrupt manner to the point of rudeness that I felt difficult to deal with. It was only when I threatened to return the product for a refund unless I dealt with someone else that I made some progress. Personally I will never deal with them again and will pay the extra for alternative products with a more grown up attitude to customer service.

I do believe you actually spoke with Mr Charles Sterling himself

 

[Cantata]

Most of this thread has been Sterling vs Adverc.
There are others, e.g.
Merlin AMS (which I have used for many years on my current boat) - http://www.foxsonline.com/acatalog/...05-1001.html?gclid=CODUnpDb4bgCFSXLtAodvV4A_g
And Driftgate's Buccaneer which may be the same device.