BruceDanforth
Well-Known Member
You could have a nice Hurley 22 for that and enough budget for new sails, outboard and plotter.
Ideas for boats which fit my ideal spec!
- Thread starter Zagato
- Start date
Zagato
Well-Known Member
Seems you are spot on with your diagnosis Pete!
Zagato
Well-Known Member
Thanks they do look a good choice. I am however now sold on the idea of a trailer sailer so that I can go on the Broads, Inland Thames, East Coast, Lake district and up to Scotland.
I would prefer a Shrimper or Cape Cutter for cabin space but as the Drascombe is only 550KG and can be can launched pretty well off anything without getting the trailer wheels wet it is in first place at the moment. It's also small enough to manoeuvre in front of my house in the winter for easy accesible maintenance and free storage. During the summer I can keep it stored very cheaply near Chichester Harbour where it only takes an hour to pick, launch and be ready to sail! It's all so light and simple. A day or two in Chi Harbour/Bembridge moored/dried out overnight in the more sheltered areas sounds great to me and sooo cheap which is always a bonus.
My family are only ever going to be into day sails so a trip up to Dell Quay for cake at the SC or shove it up the beach for a day making sand castles is the way to go.
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Daydream believer
Well-Known Member
You may be correct about boats rotting from the inside but you are inferring that sheathing does not work
Totally wrong !!
When I sheathed a Stella in 1999 it sand blasted the hull in & out (which blew quite a few hole right through the boat.). The boat was in a terrible state with sprung planks etc & I had to strip it to a bare hull with only one bulkhead in place. There were 12 broken ribs .Virtually every fastening was loose & could be tapped back & forth through the rotten wood around each one. I first applied a special resin ( supplied by Wessex)internally. Forget the type but it was a bit like car antifreeze in that it searched out every pin hole in the boat & was very thin & leached right into the wood. It gave off seriously evil fumes & i had to wear an air pressured face mask, but still nearly fainted one day.
(I am amazed that Tucker Brown built boats with so many worm holes in the plankin
This gave the inner surface a really hard surface that made it look ( for want of a better description) crystallised. The resin was very thin & went right into the wood. Right through in many of the softer spots.
I then used the West system to fill all the lands. This is the normal treatment for leaking clinker hulls. But I went one further & sheathed the outside in 300Gram matt & epoxy resin.
The work was done in my joinery works & the hull was dried to 10% Mc before starting. The Wessex rep visited on numerous times to advise on the work
The point of this is that the boat is still perfect. There was no leaks on launching even after 6 weeks.
So I suggest that the detractors are wrong ---provided it is done properly
If i was into refurbishing old wooden boats I would not hesitate to repeat. It was great fun & well worth the effort. I just wish I had photo records for a magazine article
Seajet
...
Hmmm...
remember mentioning the hassle and crowding just getting to the slip at Itchenor ? That's heaven compared to a lot of slips, good examples of which are amazingly rare and require a crystal ball and machine gun to get access in time for a tide, not to mention parking boat then car & trailer securely, rigging & de-rigging etc.
I can see the appeal of this sort of sailing but it's very limited and I really doubt it's your long term solution, you'll soon want something more capable and less hassle.
FullCircle
Well-Known Member
I would be willing to venture a fiver of Zagato getting cheesed off with launch and recovery in about a season.
There is another forumite round these parts that lost a fiver in a similar wager.
prv
Well-Known Member
I think you're right - it can be successful if done properly. Yours was clearly done to the highest standards and so worked well - the problem is that when the technique was first touted as a miracle cure some people just slapped general-purpose polyester resin and mat onto the outside of old wooden boats and made something that was doomed to failure a few years later and could never be repaired. I guess it's a bit like ferrocement in that the good ones were tarred with the reputation of the bad ones - and also that unless you do the job yourself you don't know whether you're buying trouble.
Pete
Daydream believer
Well-Known Member
Fair comment but one assumes that it was going to be done correctly
However, you are right as I had a long conversation with one Jack Stock whilst he was drifting down the Blackwater ( i was in a rib & went over for what turned out to be a very informative chat)in which he described a boat which when lifted had " curtains" of disconnected polyester hanging from the hull when lifted
So yes if you bodge it then expect trouble. But you can say that about anything!!!
Seajet
...
I think PRV is on the right lines here, I've seen a few horrors which had been given the slap-on sheathing treatment.
Ditto ferro-cement boats, a chum had a lovely example I saw him ( a pro engineer who teached and now consults on it ) build and happily went across the Channel with him on her - could go anywhere - but he sold her a while ago as the writing was on the wall for all ferro boats, tarred with the same brush.
Personally I wouldn't like to assume the last bloke's efforts were top notch unless I knew him and the boat !
Ditto ferro-cement boats, a chum had a lovely example I saw him ( a pro engineer who teached and now consults on it ) build and happily went across the Channel with him on her - could go anywhere - but he sold her a while ago as the writing was on the wall for all ferro boats, tarred with the same brush.
Personally I wouldn't like to assume the last bloke's efforts were top notch unless I knew him and the boat !
prv
Well-Known Member
That's the problem - it wasn't "going to be done", it already has been done. The buyer will get whatever quality the sheath-er managed to achieve in this case, and that may not even be known.
Pete
PhillM
Well-Known Member
From what I have read / heard about sheathing, unless you have a serious surveyor or professional oversee the job and certify that it WAS done properly, I would have many doubts about the resale value. The trouble is that its one of those jobs that need a proper workplace to do and not many people have that so the job gets done in the yard on nice days. Leading to problems later.
Zagato
Well-Known Member
I do tend to go along with others out of politeness Andy and yes Itchenor car park can be chocker by 10.00 am. I have never found the slip to be too busy though.
No I'm quite happy to launch and recover. Did it many times in my Longboat and Drifter from various locations. Launching in Chi Harbour isn't a problem you just use Chi Marina or Northeny for instance but there are other places as a Drascombe can be launched into a puddle! I'm lucky also that the days I work self employed are flexible so can go mid-week anywhere.
Funny Andy but think the exact opposite of your last sentence. For me this type of sailing is the opposite of 'limiting' I am not tide dependant as others are and it enables me to travel to other locations I would never get to. I can sail on inland waters, go to Scotland or many go abroad with their trailer sailers using it as a caravan as they go. For me a little Drascombe is very capable and versatile for my type of sailing, as said I can shove it up the creeks and beaches for overnighting, exploring, and days out making sand castles with the kids. It's not a great sailer of course speed wise but I'm not bothered by that for my type of sailing and if caught out they are well proven in a 7/8 blow. You can still sail them if fully swamped (slowly) and if turned over will not sink.
Less Hassle
Depends what you see as hassle. I looked at my Crabber sitting on the hard last week and am so relieved to be shot of it and all the greif/worry that goes into maintaining such boats especially on moorings. No, been there done that and I always said I wouldn't own it long - I bought it to make money on it and would never go back to such a boat. It was just a dream boat to look at but common sense must prevail.No I am going back to my first choice of boat but this time I can afford one with a cabin. It's all so simple and hassle free, people say their boats are like big dinghy's but the Drascombe Coaster REALLY IS a big dinghy at 550KG and only takes 20 minutes to rig. It's so light you can push it off the trailer into very little water (6" draft) so no need to get your trailer wheels wet. You can put it on a mooring of course, quite a few in Chi as they are so well suited to the Solent.
You've always said you don't like trailering Andy but I've been towing, trailering etc since I was 13 (driving tractors with 4 wheel trailers on a farm!). Physical stuff doesn't bother me but have to say most owners of Drascombes are between 60-80 you can even push them off your trailer. Get a well designed trailer and you are laughing. You can also tow a Drascombe with a family car, no need for a 4x4.
It's horses for courses as always, what is a hassle to some isn't to others. I whole heartedly agree with the KISS philosophy. Everyone has different tastes and different wants out of sailing...
When you are feeling ick they also make great speed boats to get you home quickly and conversley they are easy to row when not in a rush! Many carry oars as in the picture below.
Hmmm you could market hefty anchors made of seaweed!
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interloper
Well-Known Member
At one time, I considered my own spec for an ideal Chesapeake Bay boat:
- An outboard Motor easily reachable from the cockpit.
- A deep comfortable cockpit.
- A Bimini top to shade the cockpit.
- A fixed keel with a maximum draft of 4'.
- A maximum air draft of 35' to be able to get under certain bridges.
- Good light wind performance.
Based on the spec, a C&C 24 should have been perfect.
The problem with buying a boat based on a spec is that it is too rational. The C&C 24 met the spec, but didn't tug at my heart. I once owned an International Folkboat. She failed the spec due to an inboard diesel and a boom too low to accommodate a Bimini, but my heart skipped a beat every time I looked at her.
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Seajet
...
Interloper,
I think you've hit the nail on the head; Zagato doesn't fancy the looks of my boat - or maybe any ' modern ' boat as he likes the retro traditional look - while my heart does indeed skip a beat when I see mine, possibly remembering all the good times she has provided and bad times she has got me through.
The ' row away factor ' is crucial to each individual, after all few of us actually need yachts as an essential, so they should tug our individual heart strings.
A boat I've always fancied is the Aphrodite 101, though she's pencil thin and doesn't have the 3 double aft cabins essential at boat shows !
https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=a...u&source=univ&sa=X&ei=U-mzUrrbFZGw7AbCs4DgDw&
I think you've hit the nail on the head; Zagato doesn't fancy the looks of my boat - or maybe any ' modern ' boat as he likes the retro traditional look - while my heart does indeed skip a beat when I see mine, possibly remembering all the good times she has provided and bad times she has got me through.
The ' row away factor ' is crucial to each individual, after all few of us actually need yachts as an essential, so they should tug our individual heart strings.
A boat I've always fancied is the Aphrodite 101, though she's pencil thin and doesn't have the 3 double aft cabins essential at boat shows !
https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=a...u&source=univ&sa=X&ei=U-mzUrrbFZGw7AbCs4DgDw&
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Zagato
Well-Known Member
Yes I'm afraid you are right Andy, AWB's just don't do it for me even though something like an A22 is a 'proper' sailing boat. The maddening thing is I have steered away from the Drascombe Coaster from the very start because of it's quirky looks even though it has been the ideal boat for me all along.
So it's time to be sensible and get the boat (Coaster as in pic above) which meets my needs perfectly and overcome it's quirky cabin looks. I am half way there helped especially by reading all the accounts of peoples adventures trailer sailing around Scotland, being able to dry out overnight in sheltered creeks, sailing up inland waterways, lakes and the last bit I read was a guy in Falmouth who needed to stock up on grub so he sailed up to Tesco's in Truro and docked right up to it's back door, brilliant
Quirky looks but they are so versatile and simple and easy which is want I want everything in my life to be now! No not women I love a mizzen, no boom, just wrap the sail around the mast within easy reach from the cabin, tiny anchor from the cockpit, etc.. Hassle free for me, like a little go anywhere mountaineering tent
No Antifoul
No seacocks
No leaking exhaust traps
No fan belts, anodes, leaking diesel screws, water pipes, servicing costs.
No starter motors or starter buttons to go wrong.
No earths to give any headaches.
No cutless bearings.
No worry about props fouling.
No Batteries to charge.
No gas pipes to maintain.
No water tanks pipes/pumps to clean out maintain.
No heads to service.
No impellors to seize.
No clipper speed gadget etc to go wrong.
No climbing up masts to fix lights etc.
No drooping headling.
No corroding expanding ballast.
No mooring hassles if you don't want it.
No rudder bearings or bolts to corrode.
No mess of wiring to work out.
No batteries to maintain.
It's all just so simple, easy and cheap of course. I'm never going to be into long coastel passages sadly (although many aged gents do it in Drascombes in horrible weather) so I am able to go to the lower end of simple boating and enjoy the benefits. Roughing it a bit is part of the fun for me. I don't get having a TV for instance when caravanning or boating - it's a chance to get away from all that surely...
So it's time to be sensible and get the boat (Coaster as in pic above) which meets my needs perfectly and overcome it's quirky cabin looks. I am half way there helped especially by reading all the accounts of peoples adventures trailer sailing around Scotland, being able to dry out overnight in sheltered creeks, sailing up inland waterways, lakes and the last bit I read was a guy in Falmouth who needed to stock up on grub so he sailed up to Tesco's in Truro and docked right up to it's back door, brilliant
Quirky looks but they are so versatile and simple and easy which is want I want everything in my life to be now! No not women
I love a mizzen, no boom, just wrap the sail around the mast within easy reach from the cabin, tiny anchor from the cockpit, etc.. Hassle free for me, like a little go anywhere mountaineering tent No Antifoul
No seacocks
No leaking exhaust traps
No fan belts, anodes, leaking diesel screws, water pipes, servicing costs.
No starter motors or starter buttons to go wrong.
No earths to give any headaches.
No cutless bearings.
No worry about props fouling.
No Batteries to charge.
No gas pipes to maintain.
No water tanks pipes/pumps to clean out maintain.
No heads to service.
No impellors to seize.
No clipper speed gadget etc to go wrong.
No climbing up masts to fix lights etc.
No drooping headling.
No corroding expanding ballast.
No mooring hassles if you don't want it.
No rudder bearings or bolts to corrode.
No mess of wiring to work out.
No batteries to maintain.
It's all just so simple, easy and cheap of course. I'm never going to be into long coastel passages sadly (although many aged gents do it in Drascombes in horrible weather) so I am able to go to the lower end of simple boating and enjoy the benefits. Roughing it a bit is part of the fun for me. I don't get having a TV for instance when caravanning or boating - it's a chance to get away from all that surely...
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Zagato
Well-Known Member
Beautiful 'Interloper'. I did the same with a Folksong 26 - I bought it unseen after a good survey but realised I couldn't sit up in it
Seajet
...
Zagato,
you have just, very nearly, described an Anderson 22 !
Look forward to seeing you in one sometime and you are always welcome to come along in the meantime...
you have just, very nearly, described an Anderson 22 !
Look forward to seeing you in one sometime and you are always welcome to come along in the meantime...
Zagato
Well-Known Member
Thanks Andy, I'm always up for a sail and a pint 
PhillM
Well-Known Member
I think you are missing one point, the above list is the perfect excuse to go down to the boat to get on with "something" and avoid the long list of jobs that await at home. "After all dear the house won't sink and cost a "fortune to recover", so I've just got to get it done first "
Zagato
Well-Known Member
VERY true Phill
I think I have just found another very near perfect boat... A Rob Roy 23 :encouragement:
" A capable and attractive small cruiser with some notable voyages, in North American waters, under its belt. Some 40-50 examples of Rob Roy were built in GRP by Marine Concepts of Florida, from 1980 to the 1990s, reportedly to a high standard of construction and fit-out. Honnor Marine in the UK built at least one, but their moulds were destroyed in 1997 during a change of ownership of the company. Plans are still available from Ted Brewer".
Seems to be a very capable, desireable boat but not many in the UK. Some posts are suggesting only one was built over here by Honnor Marine. Importing one from the US seems to be possible. See this thread from owners on the wood boat forum even though it's GRP...
http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthre...-by-Ted-Brewer
Gorgeous and trailerable (occasionally!) with lifting keel.
Hull Type: Keel/Cbrd. Rig Type: Masthead Yawl
LOA: 22.67' / 6.91m LWL: 21.00' / 6.40m
Beam: 6.92' / 2.11m Listed SA: 255 ft2 / 23.69 m2
Draft (max.) 4.67' / 1.42m Draft (min.) 1.58' / 0.48m
Disp. 2800 lbs./ 1270 kgs. Ballast: 900 lbs. / 408 kgs.
SA/Disp.: 20.59 Bal./Disp.: 32.13% Disp./Len.: 134.97
Designer: Ted Brewer
Builder: Marine Concepts (USA)
Construct.: FG Bal. type:
First Built: 1980 Last Built: # Built:
TANKS
Water: 14 gals. / 53 ltrs. Fuel: 12 gals. / 45 ltrs.
NOTES
Also available with a gunther yawl rig.
I think I have just found another very near perfect boat... A Rob Roy 23 :encouragement:
" A capable and attractive small cruiser with some notable voyages, in North American waters, under its belt. Some 40-50 examples of Rob Roy were built in GRP by Marine Concepts of Florida, from 1980 to the 1990s, reportedly to a high standard of construction and fit-out. Honnor Marine in the UK built at least one, but their moulds were destroyed in 1997 during a change of ownership of the company. Plans are still available from Ted Brewer".
Seems to be a very capable, desireable boat but not many in the UK. Some posts are suggesting only one was built over here by Honnor Marine. Importing one from the US seems to be possible. See this thread from owners on the wood boat forum even though it's GRP...
http://forum.woodenboat.com/showthre...-by-Ted-Brewer
Gorgeous and trailerable (occasionally!) with lifting keel.
Hull Type: Keel/Cbrd. Rig Type: Masthead Yawl
LOA: 22.67' / 6.91m LWL: 21.00' / 6.40m
Beam: 6.92' / 2.11m Listed SA: 255 ft2 / 23.69 m2
Draft (max.) 4.67' / 1.42m Draft (min.) 1.58' / 0.48m
Disp. 2800 lbs./ 1270 kgs. Ballast: 900 lbs. / 408 kgs.
SA/Disp.: 20.59 Bal./Disp.: 32.13% Disp./Len.: 134.97
Designer: Ted Brewer
Builder: Marine Concepts (USA)
Construct.: FG Bal. type:
First Built: 1980 Last Built: # Built:
TANKS
Water: 14 gals. / 53 ltrs. Fuel: 12 gals. / 45 ltrs.
NOTES
Also available with a gunther yawl rig.
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