I guess I must hang my head in shame

RupertW said:
I’m surprised that there is even a debate about thrusters on this forum. As a raggie I do believe they are the work of the devil and the sound announces to the marina that it’s time to get fenders out as the skipper doesn’t have a clue. But when you see it’s a mobo you relax because with a single engine, flat bottom and high windage they must be a pig to park in crosswinds without them.

But a sailing boat has a deep keel to pivot around, a guarantee that the bow will always turn downwind at slow speed and a very big rudder just behind the propellor that acts as perfect stern thruster at zero boat speed.
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On a catamaran where the rudders are 12ft apart so no prop wash over the rudders, an outboard engine that has poor astern power coupled with high windage and no keels they are a womderful aid.
 
I've got no thrusters. I'm a natural entertainer especially when giving the scream to man fenders. (y) I could sell tickets, save up to buy some :unsure:
 
NoviceRod said:
I didn't dare mention the boat hook - 3 strikes and I'm Out!!

BTW I also find the thrusters invaluable to hold the boat alongside while SWMBO ties or unties lines.
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We occasionall use both thrusters to push boat close enough to finger to get on/off in a strong beam breeze or to get SWMBO back on board after a visit to facilities. Have even used them to shove drifting weed/algae rafts aside and away from on board loo intakes
 
Does this make me a proper boater?
This is what today looks like from the fly bridge


So, did I go out or did I stay in port and work on the macerator?
 
OK - here's another idea for the stern thruster.
Connect it to a Raspberry Pi and get it to automatically motor the boat round so that it faces the sun.
That would be great for my solar panels but I'm not sure that the thrusters wouldn't use more power than the extra that the solar panels would collect from them pointing into the sun.
 
You can go through phases with tech , it’s sold on solving perceived problems for most , which turn out actually real problems for just a few .Hailed as game changers or what ever by busy motivated marketing teams .
Like ABS brakes , automated paddle shift gearboxes , reversing cameras etc in the car world .
It’s easy to be labelled a Luddite by the “ few “ if you don’t need theses things , stern thrusters are one . Joy stick in a boat another imho .

It’s a normal human reaction of the “ few “ who have slid down the gadget route to attempt to justify the tech to those who manage to carry on perfectly with out . In fact they come to rely on the tech can’t function without , groups start to polarise .Tech guys super sensitive to being called out as whimsy whimps. Over reacting in justification of the said gadget .
In this case a stern thruster .

Hughs 300 helicopters come with a single flight control ( stick ) to make it easy . You don’t need to learn that basics of control as with regular twin hand coordination ( boat = twin sticks + bow Thruster ) hard bit is all done for you .
Classic helicopters come with separate cyclic and collective pitch sticks , Takes practice to get right and armed with that once mastered a better chance of getting out of tricky situations.
You can bump a boat and walk away .No prizes for guessing which copter has the worst crash record ?

How ever some folks are better coordinated , spatially aware than others so every gadget on a boat is good for them but not necessary for others .
Each to there own .......folks gravitate towards things or similarity others don’t take the bait of the sales bumf as see no problem that needs fixing .
There’s room for both camps and experienced boaters know which camp they are in and will gravitate towards a suitable equipped boat that they can control .
 
I think the joystick popularity was based on the perception that there was a new market. People who had made some money and wanted a big boat as their first boat. So never developed the skills by climbing the ranks from little boats to midsize etc over the years. Whether this market is real I don’t know but the secondary market was to the first mate.
But as boats get bigger, marinas get smaller, and you are expected to have increased maneuvering ability. The distance between the rows of boats in the Med are usually less than a boat length.
I like reverse cameras?
 
Fun debate - would I buy a boat without a ST? Yes definitely, that wouldn't bother me at all; a BT? yes, but would be a little more disappointing and would probably look to fit one later as they are very useful when operated with twin throttles and to bring the bow back in-line and all other reasons stated.....albeit not sure about the RPi/PV solution :)
 
Portofino said:
...
Hughs 300 helicopters come with a single flight control ( stick ) to make it easy . You don’t need to learn that basics of control as with regular twin hand coordination ( boat = twin sticks + bow Thruster ) hard bit is all done for you .
Classic helicopters come with separate cyclic and collective pitch sticks
...
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I'm confused. Reading this comes across as if you're saying that Hughes 300s don't have a separate collective stick, but they do (two cyclic controls and one collective between the seats for either side to use)... Did you mean something else?
 
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sorabain said:
Did you mean something else?
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My understanding of his statement was that the H300 has also a single flight control, on top of the traditional ones.
And that his inference on crash record was related to folks unable to handle the latter.

Now, only PF can confirm what he meant of course, and even assuming that my understanding was correct, I don't know how true all that is.
But having spent quite a lot of time living aboard in my marina, I think his point is valid regardless of the chopper analogy, because I've seen all sorts of poor shows:
People unable to reverse in a berth and screaming to the marinero to push their boat with his rib, because their joystick suddenly packed up. Or using the joystick like there's no tomorrow, to the point of making the boat roll so badly, in between two other boats, to hit and damage the walkaround rails regardless of how well fendered the boats are... You name it.

Bottom line, my luddite-ness doesn't stretch to the point of suggesting that Joysticks should be illegal.
But pretty sure, it would make sense if only folks able to make do without them would be allowed to use them! ?
 
Is that rolling only Volvo or does it happen with Zeus? Putting a joystick on a shaft boat shouldn’t cause the rolling (should it?)
 
Bouba said:
Is that rolling only Volvo or does it happen with Zeus? Putting a joystick on a shaft boat shouldn’t cause the rolling (should it?)
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That mostly depends on the specific installation - more so than the pod brand.
When a pod rotates, its force vector doesn't rotate only from longitudinal to transversal, but also upwards, at the same angle of the hull where it is installed.
So, the deeper the vee, the stronger the tendency to make the boat roll upon maneuvering.
This is also the reason for another tendency of pods btw, i.e. emphasize the boat listing upon steering.
On top of all that, obviously the power of pods is a multiple compared to any conventional thrusters, which is what joysticks control when interfaced to shaft boats.
I don't think there is any risk of dangerous rolling with joysticks interfaced with shafts+thrusters.
But of course, the other major risk is still there, i.e. getting used to maneuvering with joystick to the point of not being able to control the boat anymore when (not if!) the thing packs up.
 
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MapisM said:
But of course, the other major risk is still there, i.e. getting used to maneuvering with joystick to the point of not being able to control the boat anymore when (not if!) the thing packs up.
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Which I think was the point of the article wasn't it, rather than to dismiss use of bow thrusters completely?
 
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